Flight sunglasses

[Guest Dirt Beater]

I remember reading in some reg that aircrew aren't permitted to wear sunglasses with polarized lenses. Is this just something guys slough off, or is there an actual, viable reason not to wear them? The only thing I can think of involves distorting one's view of the HUD or something...who knows. Thanks!

[Hacker]

Originally posted by Dirt Beater:

I remember reading in some reg that aircrew aren't permitted to wear sunglasses with polarized lenses. Is this just something guys slough off, or is there an actual, viable reason not to wear them? The only thing I can think of involves distorting one's view of the HUD or something...who knows. Thanks!

I am not sure of any reg or AFI saying that, but if you step out to the flightline and look at the jet you'll know why it's not smart to wear polarized sunglasses. The material that the canopies are made of (at least on T-38s and F-15s) have a wicked rainbow effect when viewed through polarized sunglasses, and that really tends to distort what you see when looking through them.

Once in the cockpit, there are similar effects with some instruments. In the F-15E, the EMD and UFC could be totally blacked out by polarization, and in the T-38C the same is true with the EED.

Bottom line is that you shouldn't wear them while flying.

[Chuck17]

Ditto for us guys on the heavy side.

[Toro]

I've never heard anything specfic to polarized sunglasses, the only two things I've heard regarding sunglass wear were-

1) You can't wear 'reflective' type sunglasses (like the Oakley glasses) in uniform. This is for all AF personnel in uniform, it's in the AF clothing uniform/dress appearance reg I believe.

2) When I was at Columbus, something came out (I believe it may have been an FCIF - probably an AETC-ism) saying you couldn't wear glasses while flying that had plastic frames (due to melting in the event of a fire).

[Guest MitchBaernet]

Don't know about Military reg's, but FAA reg's prohibit polarized sunglasses.

One reason I can think of is that the light emitted by certain types of displays (i.e. LCD's) is already polarized. Thus, if you view them though polarized glassed in the right orientation they light they emit can be completely blocked.

Another is that Plexiglas also has a polarizing effect, which is conjunction with the polarized glasses can cause the same problem described above, reducing visibility.

[Guest donnieray3]

You are correct. The reason you cannot wear polarized glasses is that the windows in aircraft are already polarized. If you wear polarized sunglasses with polarized windows that will completely block your vision at some angles. Hope this helps.

D

[Hacker]

Originally posted by donnieray3:

You are correct. The reason you cannot wear polarized glasses is that the windows in aircraft are already polarized. If you wear polarized sunglasses with polarized windows that will completely block your vision at some angles. Hope this helps.

D

Not completely true, at least in figher canopies. The canopy is not polarized, per se, so unlike when you look at an LCD display or a truly polarized item, it does not go black or gray or anything that "completely blocks" vision. Instead with polarized glasses the canopy does have a prismatic rainbow effect, which does distort the picture and, in some case, prohibit you from seeing through it.

[Guest Sven]

Polarized sunglasses being prohibited by the FAA is new to me. Nevertheless I have been hunting for the reg stating that fact. I would appreciate if anyone who knows the FAR part/paragrapg number of this req could post it.

Thanks,

Sven

[Guest MitchBaernet]

Originally posted by Sven:

Polarized sunglasses being prohibited by the FAA is new to me. Nevertheless I have been hunting for the reg stating that fact. I would appreciate if anyone who knows the FAR part/paragrapg number of this req could post it.

Thanks,

Sven

My information is from the January 2002 issue of Flying Magazine. Exact quote: "The standard neutral gray lenses did not change the colors of the instruments, which is key since the FAA doesn't allow pilots to wear polarized sunglasses in the cockpit." That having been said, I can't find any such reg in the FAR either. My aplogies for not checking my source!

[Toro]

Straight from AFI 36-2903, Table 2.6

Eyeglasses and Sunglasses - Free of ornamentation on frames and lenses. Conservative, clear, slightly tinted or photosensitive lenses indoors or in formation. Conservative lenses and frames outdoors (faddish styles and mirrored lenses prohibited). No sunglasses in formation. Not worn around the neck.

[Guest copenhagen]

OK - just starting out UPT here. The sunglasses that they issue are crap and don't fit me worth a damn...

I go to see the medical group including the eye doc as we're getting started. We get to talking about eyes and sunglasses... I told him that I have a great pair of serengeti's that I love to fly with and he tells me that I won't be able to fly with them.

SO he then tells me that for me to get a pair of "approved" sunglasses that actually fit - he'll have to write me a prescription for "extremly mild astigmatism" and the military will buy me all the glasses that I need. However, it will be noted in my records that I "Do NOT" need the glasses to fly. So I go talk to the admin gal and she orders me up the new glasses...

So my question is this... How many of you flew in UPT with sunglasses vs the helmet visor? If so, did you use your "civilian" sunglasses? Next, what do you fly with now that you are done with UPT and flying for real jobs?

I don't really like being told what I'm going to wear for sunglasses - and I'm not sure about what's going to happen if I show up to fly with my personal glasses... Or does the damn visor on the helmet work ok? I'm just skeptical and am officially soliciting your opinions on the matter.

Cheers

[Ram]

I flew with the visor only, but I know a lot of dudes who fly with sunglasses. Many people just fly with whatever they want. I have no idea what the rules are on that, though...

As far as the chaw, just about every guy at work who likes it chews all the time. The boss doesn't really care, and I've never seen anyone pitch a b!tch about it...chew away, but spit into an empty coke can so no one can tell

[ViperStud]

Dude the AF issue glasses are annoying and I promise you'll eventually ditch any kind of glasses altogether if you can. If you want to go heavies this post might not apply, but if not I'd listen up. I wore glasses through UPT and IFF and finally have contacts at RTU. You have to realize we are not talking about your average point to point flying here. When you need to check six, keep tally with dudes fighting you and monitor where flight lead is, any kind of glasses become more of a hinderance than anything. Not to mention with all the hardcore maneuvering you'll do you tend to sweat a bit and fog the damn things up.

If you're looking out the side or back of your jet, or using your peripheral vision at all, you need to deal with the frame blocking part of the sky and the nice little refraction that happens whenever a jet crosses from being seen through glasses to your straight up peripheral. I, like a lot of dudes, fight with my visor up, it's way easier to keep tally without sunglasses/visor cutting the amount of light that gets in.

What might happen if you show up with your own? Probably depends on the IP but I'd bet you won't be able to use them. If anything bad happens to you in the jet, from an EP to a physi or any other substantial buffoonery, they'll crucify you if they find you snuck non-AF sanctioned eyewear to use. At least while you are in training, I would suggest not to push their buttons. My $.02 but I think a lot of dudes would agree.

[Sneedro]

I wore the visor during Tweets, and now I am in T-1s where I wear sunglasses. My classmates, IPs, and myself wear whatever sunglasses we want to in the jet. I have never heard anyone complain about what sunglasses we have on. As I think about it, I dont think I have seen a single person wear the issued ones in the T-1 world.

[Toro]

Viperstud is right on. I'm sure there are some guys who were sunglasses in the jet, but I don't personally know of any. They're a huge pain in the ass for the reasons listed. I used to occassionally wear them, but they tended to get fogged up and droop down when I was pulling Gs. When I was at Columbus, a rule came out (don't remember if it was some AETC Sup to an AFI or just an FCIF) that said you could only wear metal-rimmed sunglasses. They felt it was a safety issue of plastic rims melting to your face in the event of a fire.

I personally think the visor works just fine.

Originally posted by copenhagen:

I don't really like being told what I'm going to wear for sunglasses - and I'm not sure about what's going to happen if I show up to fly with my personal glasses.

Probably not the best attitude to have as a UPT student. I would smile, salute sharply and wear the issued/approved glasses (or nothing at all). The last thing you want your IPs and Flt/CC to think is that you don't like following the rules (as stupid as you may think they are).

[Guest croftfam]

I don't wear any kind of sunglasses under the helmet. The visor is good enough. Viperstud brings up a lot of good points about vis being blocked!

[Guest KoolKat]

In a 37 or 6, I can't see any reason why you would want to wear sunglasses...trust me, you'll feel plenty cool enough without them if you can fly...if you can't, then your IP will ruin your coolness fator with or with out the glasses. Go with the visor, besides I thought looked *****in' with the visor down.

As far as tobacco goes, I smoked (outside & away from sight, preferably at the designated smoker's station) during phase II the whole time. I would get the occasional ass ribbing (sts) every now and then...

During Track Select they said, "His favorite boldface to apply, Smoke and Fumes 100%."

But, many of my IPs would preface the debrief with, "I have to fill out the 781, go have a smoke, meet you back here in 5."

...I wouldn't push to test this one as a student.

Read and heed. I'd try hard to figure out why you think you'll be above the rules somehow in UPT long before you show up. Your comments of "how will it go when I blatantly disobey the rules" raise questions about your attitude...which, unfourtunately, is not part of the standard equipment issue when you show up!

[Guest kirkhac]

I have a pair of serengetis that I use in the C-12. If you end up out here at Corpus, you can wear whatever sunglasses you want.

[Guest Mary G]

You won't even need sunglasses under your visor - nobody I knew wore 'em. But, to echo an earlier comment, in T-1s we pretty much all wore whatever sunglasses we wanted to (for me that meant big Ralph Lauren's that I'm addicted to - earning me the name Jackie-O from a couple of the IPs). I never heard of anyone getting any slack for wearing other-than-issued glasses except once on the verge of an ORI - it was *strongly* suggested to wear the issued sunglasses or none at all if you ended up on a sortie with an inspector.

[Guest copenhagen]

Ok... I want to clarify.

The glasses - sounds like they won't be necessary in the tweet. I'll just use the visor. Sounds like good advice regarding pulling G's (with the glasses falling off and being a general pain in the a$$). Perhaps I will like the visor much better than the glasses to begin with - I'll find out in about a month.

My question was more focused on will they make me wear my "slight" prescription glasses at any point or can I wear my off the shelf ones once that is possible. Sounds like I can wear whatever I want once I'm done with tweets and have moved on to non-fighter related flying.

[Bergman]

Originally posted by copenhagen:

My question was more focused on will they make me wear my "slight" prescription glasses at any point or can I wear my off the shelf ones once that is possible.

FWIW, I have AF issued prescription glasses for 20/25 distant vision in my right eye. I have never worn them while flying. The only place it's printed is on your 1042 (and usually left off mine for some reason) so as long as you don't make it an issue, none of the IPs are going to quiz you about it (at least in my experience).

[Guest Rainman A-10]

To each his own.

I wear sunglasses. I have recently trashed another pair of Ray Ban Aviators (the small lenses with the wrap around the ear rigs so they don't slide down when I pull Gs) and have been wearing my visor. I have a gradiated visor (I think that's what it is called), which kicks ass, but I still don't like it. I am reminded why I hate the visor when I look in the mirror after a sortie. The visor pushes down on the bridge of my Norwegian nose and hurts like hell. I don't pull 9 Gs but I do pull 6 Gs 100 times and the visor is hard on my beak.

You will want to have some sunglasses with you when you deploy or sit alert if you wear NVGs in your jet. You can't have a visor and the NVG bracket on the helmet at the same time. If you are sitting alert or flying a sortie that will include day and night flying it means the sun will be near/on the horizon and in your eyes (most likely right when you are trying to get on the tanker).

The biggest problem with sunglasses is finding a place to put them when you don't need them anymore. I shove them in my G-suit pocket where they eventually get trashed. It is a lot easier to put your visor up and down when doing things like going through the weather in close formation (if you do that very often).

Best advice right now, do what your IPs tell you to do.

[Guest jaybird141]

My last squadron was pretty big on this from 11-202 Vol 3

6.3. Spectacles, Contact Lenses, and NVGs. (Not applicable to ROA operators)

6.3.1. Spectacles. While performing aircrew duties, crewmembers must use only Air Force provided spectacles and sunglasses. The Improved Aircrew Spectacle (IAS), including sunglasses, is ordered as the Air Force Flight Frame. The HGU-4/P is authorized only if the IAS is unavailable.

6.3.2. Contact Lenses. Crewmembers who want to wear contact lenses must consult with their unit flight surgeon and meet criteria and follow guidelines outlined in AFI 48-123, attachment 17.

6.3.3. Spare Sets. Crewmembers who wear corrective spectacles or contact lenses must carry a spare set of clear prescription spectacles on their person while performing aircrew duties.

[farva]

I heard a story of a chief ripping into an LT because his glasses weren't AF standard. You know, the whole non-reflective lenses, black only, really small logo, nothing written on the lens. Is this normal?

[Toro]

Originally posted by farva:

I heard a story of a chief ripping into an LT because his glasses weren't AF standard. You know, the whole non-reflective lenses, black only, really small logo, nothing written on the lens. Is this normal?

I wouldn't doubt it. I've never had senior enlisted lecture me on proper uniform wear, but I've heard of/seen it happen to other people. Sometimes it's deserved (if I saw a dude wearing purple Oakley wraparounds in uniform, I'd tell him that he looked like a tool, and that he was out of regs). Other times, it's just nitpicky - a bunch of us went to the chow hall in the desert and as we walked inside, our Intel Lt pushed her shades up onto cranium. Some random MSgt walked up to her and talk her that in accordance with AFI 69-CMH, her sunglasses were not allowed to be placed on her head...bla...bla. While it would have been nice to tell the dude to pound sand, lighten up, and let her get her food so she could help us fight a war, she did the smart professional thing - she said okay, put them in her pocket, then sat down with us and proceeded to rant about what a douchebag he was.