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FWIW the 118th OG is a flying unit all day every day and twice on Sundays Negative ghostrider. 16 years of service and a PA/customs & courtesies fuck-up means you should be shown the door? Crashing airplanes negligently, getting others injured/killed, losing your weapon, etc. will all get you stars on your shoulder from what I've seen (no shit), but something like this means you get the boot no questions asked? I agree with pawnman above - this is an ass-chewing punishment, not a lose-your-retirement punishment. I know the internet outrage machine is turned up to 11 and it's a nice neat narrative that, "Haha, look at those POGs in the ANG with their fucking sock puppets!" and I cringed and face-palmed too, especially because this was right down the street from where our guys are sitting and taking the fight to the enemy, but zoom out a little bit and realize we've all made mistakes that would probably severely embarrass the Air Force. Luckily for most of us there weren't any cameras around.

Half your age plus seven.

Although I encourage my mil friends to come over to the airline side every chance I get, I will not criticize them for deciding to stay in. I have a few good friends who are truly on the good guys’ side that are in their prime to make the jump to the airlines. And yet, despite the increase in pay and quality of life they have decided to stay. I had lunch with one of these guys a while back and he told me that he felt that he had a responsibility to stick around in order to provide the same mentorship to the young guys that he had experienced years ago. My hat is off to the guys who make that decision despite the continued sacrifice and the state of the USAF today. These men and women have far more patience than I do. Of course I’ve made sure they know that I will walk their resumes and rec letters into HR The moment they decide they’ve had enough.

Remind me which administration bombed their surrogate in Syria twice plus killed a bunch of their merc’s, actually got NATO to agree to not be an empty shell of an organization with a pretty blue flag and pay up, approved arms sales of munitions to include anti-tank weapons to Ukraine, shuttered the Russian consulate in Seattle, and has their diplomat to the U.N. pretty much daily taking them to task for stuff. I could have sworn that all happened in the last 18 months. But you’re right, that picture couldn’t reflect Obama. He was after all willing to be much more flexible in how he got f’d By Russia.

Well said, concur. the video was embarrassing and filming/posting by experienced people showed a huge lack of judgement. However, their error did not jeopardize life, mission, equipment. Firing these folks while ignoring senior leader mistakes that do jeopardize life, mission, and equipment tells me two things: image is valued above substance, and leadership will crush you for violating non-criminal undefined standards. I like that immediate forcible retirement is a tool at the disposal of senior leaders, but this incident is when they use it? Would any of us want the GO who crushed these folks to be our GO who may turn on us if a video surfaced of you without a hat, or having a beer in uniform? What if, theoretically, CVR and FMV emerge of you shooting an injured squirter and CNN demands accountability. Think this group of GOs would have your back or throw you to the wolves? TLDR: initial incident bad, reaction worse. Nsplayr reply good.

Still a 1...

Not bad. The vast majority of Americans are grossly ignorant of our own history. The bottom line is that American exists today because the government attempted to enact gun control. It was 243 years ago today that the British arrived in Lexington enroute Concord to confiscate guns. The American militia in Lexington were grossly outgunned, but fought to defend their freedoms anyway. Our forefathers fought and died to fight gun control and now Americans are eager to give up the very freedoms our forefathers died defending because those guns look scary. Along the line of the linked article; the British were hands down the most powerful military the world had ever seen to that point. They were beat and besieged in Boston by a 'well regulated militia'. As we have seen ourselves in Vietnam, Iraq, Syria, and Afghanistan, don't underestimate a motivated group with some guns even when faced with the worlds most powerful military.

Dept of Justice IG recommends criminal charges for fired former Deputy FBI Director McCabe. Gonna be a good day, Tater...

If you aren't on MIL duty...DON'T be on MIL leave from the airlines, simple as that. If your mindset is you will "weather the storm" during those years of low seniority where you can't control your schedule like you'd like by using MIL leave to get birthdays, holidays, or whatever off...find a different profession. How would you like not getting a job offer because dudes before you gamed the system for themselves and the airlines got sick of it? I'd bet you'd be pissed so why even consider pulling that shit on those hoping to follow in your footsteps? Every single military dude/dudette who uses MIL leave to their advantage screws over the rest and makes everyone's life harder. If you have legit work, by all means take the leave over whatever days you need. Don't F your buddy! It's really not that difficult yet even when I went through INDOC you'd hear guys talking about how they won't miss holidays because of their ability to use MIL leave...it's disgusting.

My dad was a pilot but my Mom thought we would butt heads if he taught me to fly so she arranged for a close family friend who was a senior Pilot at Delta to be my first instructor. The guy was a legend who did many incredible things in his life and wrote books about his adventures )sailed a six foot boat across the Atlantic by himself.) I really looked up to him until the day after I soloed. I was in his hangar on his private flying ranch when he pulled me aside and said "you needed to get that military flying thing out of my system and get a real job." He went as far as to show me his paystub which was incomprehensible money to a kid in 1986. I was kind of taken aback, when I looked around the guy had several planes, cars motorcycle and boats, he obviously had a lot of money but he did not value military service. Oddly I ran into his years later when my hometown made a big deal about getting some medals in Afghanistan, he was all smiles and handshakes, "you done good kid!" I never looked at him the same. As for Huggy, how about as a dedicated American who served his country he also taught his children about service, sacrifice, and something more than the almighty dollar. As a senior officer I routinely met with folks who decided to get out. I never required a meeting if someone dropped their papers, most of the meetings were requested by folks I had mentored and decided to get out or through chance interactions. My first statement was ALWAYS "thank you for your service, what can I do to help with your next chapter." As Huggy noted, giving any period of your life to military service buys my everlasting gratitude, you have done more than 99% of the population and I am honored to shake your hand if it was 2 years or 28. In my humble opinion, Huggy is a fucking hero and though we are not close friends, I dare say his family has done just fine, in spite of his 28 years of service.

T-Pain, I'm not arguing with you one bit. Please understand I'm not pontificating and stating you must have the job satisfaction I did. My career was exceptional... and unique.. and I spent a lot of mental time planning through various things to make it go my way. No doubt I was fortunate in things I couldn't control. Even my U-2 cohorts will tell you I had a charmed career. Had things gone for me like they went for some other people on here, I'm sure I would have separated or retired before my 28 years. I remember sitting in front of the Alconbury MPF (CBPO for you old guys) when my UPT commitment ended and the bonus was offered. "Get out or stay in?" I sat in my car with the engine running for about 30 minutes questioning the decision. In the end, I went in and signed up for 6 more years (or whatever it was). Glad I did. Here's the bottom line. My overly-long post yesterday was simply aimed at Joe's statement: "it's pretty f*cked up to turn down a massive improvement in income and quality of life to drag your family from base to base, suffering through deployments and taking a massive paycut just because you want to wear a bag and go fast." That rubs me the wrong way. Big time. I've heard this sentiment from others, and I've heard it often: that my selfishness and unwillingness to leave the military has caused my family pain and suffering, and a reduction in their quality of life. I'd be a rich airline Captain, had I separated at the 6 year point, right? And my lack of seeing the big picture financially has prevented my family from being wealthier. And my time away from home negatively affected my kids... as opposed to the 18 months I was Executive Director and when I was home, I was in my office working from 1900-2300 most nights, and unable to do stuff on the weekends. There's more to QOL than meets the eye. I really don't think that's what Joe's message really was intended to be... but that's what I hear when I read people that post "you're crazy and doing a disservice to your family if you stay in 1 day past your commitment". I've had U-2 guys seek my advice, and in some cases I've told them they should leave the AF at the end of their current commitment. If I was in their shoes, I'd certainly do it. And had I gotten the fighter I wanted out of UPT, I doubt I would have lasted beyond my 6 year commitment. It turns out the U-2 Program was the perfect fit for me. I only left because they threw me out. I do not begrudge anyone that leaves when they are done. They gave 6, 8, 10 years of their life to the country, and deserve every ounce of my respect. But don't tell me I'm fucked up because I decided to stay for 28.

Last beer + 12 hrs = take-off time.

Yeah that’s my ?, is a a month or a year. Cause it wouldn’t surprise me if they made it 6k a year. But an extra 6k a month would be nice.

Half your age + 7 or 21, whichever is less.

I believe TKs post is not to be taken at face value, and instead a reference to an Obama one-liner which mocked and condescended then candidate Romney’s warnings towards Russia. A viewpoint shared by democrats at the time, and conveniently forgotten now.

I agree. But some new guys may read that and think it's okay for a company to demand that. It's a slippery slope when it comes to setting precedents. If you're still in the military and flying for the airlines, it's just as important to know USERRA law and comply with it as it is to know your contract and fly it. Deviating based on company demands for either can screw your fellow pilots. This is the easiest job in the world. Don't make it harder than it needs to be.

Let me clarify, if you can't theoretically look your chief pilot in the face and tell him/her what you are taking your MIL leave for and offer to call your CC, you probably shouldn't be taking the leave. No, you should not actually do this...do only what is required by law. Don't let them force anything more. It isn't in your or any other reservist's best interest as nothing good can come from it only bad.

Pretty sure he's not suggesting you SHOULD do that, he's saying you shouldn't be worried about what would happen if it did. If you know you're cheating and a conversation between the airline and the unit would expose said cheating, you probably shouldn't be doing it.

I use the clock method to determine XW component. Just picture a clock with tick-marks at the quarter hours... 15 min(1/4 of clock) 30 min (1/2 of clock), and 45 min (3/4 of clock). If winds are 15* off runway hdg, you take 1/4 of the wind speed as your XW component. 30* off is 1/2 the wind speed as your XW component. 45* off is 3/4 the wind speed as your XW component. Anything above 60*, take the full wind speed as your XW component. Interpolate as needed to get more exact. For example if winds are right at 60 off, I take the full minus 2. If winds are 70 off, I take the full minus 1. Using this technique, I’ve never been more than 2 knots off estimating the XW component, and it takes about 2 seconds to calculate.

While I agree with just about everything else you said, this is a hard no. USERRA has no such requirement and no one should be expected to do this. From the USERRA website:

Agreed. Maybe when the most common O-6 story about the good old days isn't about how SF used to let them drive drunk after a night at the O Club, they can start kicking people out for stupid judgement lapses.

Seems pretty excessive to me, especially given the light punishments that accompany actual wrong-doing so often. The message is clear - fuck up all you want, but don't embarrass the Air Force in public.

Wow, lay off the MSNBC bro it’s getting to your head.

1/2 your mom = 300lbs

You are correct, many O's have picked up part time jobs or run a side business. Only caveat is that your other job can't interfere with your military duties and the JAG usually has to review it to be sure you're not creating some kind of conflict of interest. For example, working for a defense contractor part time with duties that overlap with your AD job. You certainly can't work a FULL TIME civilian job while on FULL TIME active duty orders, I'm sure we're all in agreement on that. USERRA was not written with the expectation that 'the troops' would use it to game the system, cheat their companies, and massage their schedules. But that's exactly what some have decided to do. And if anyone is asking why it bothers me/us, here's why...when a dude pulls a bullshit move like SocialD described above over Christmas (definitely happens), what do you think happens to that trip that spanned Christmas? That's right, someone else without the USERRA get out of jail free card gets shacked with the trip and misses Christmas when they otherwise would have been home. It's always amazing to me how much home station military duty (and on an unrelated note, ALPA work) happens over Christmas driving so much MLOA. I seem to remember the base being a ghost town...

Send the WSO to go call the crew van on his 02 mask tester in life support and step without him?

Tick off scheduling, end up in the family model every flight. Sounds terrible.

Sucks to suck! Lol