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Terrible and Godspeed to the warriors. The last full measure. Side note, speculating on names or revealing classified is obviously a no-no. But discussing possible causes etc is not only fine, but probably a good thing so we can all learn about issues we might have never encountered. As an example, i was discussing this with a friend who flew the civilian version, and he mentioned something about engines at high altitude i didn’t even know could be an issue. So whether that was a cause i don’t know but i did learn something. If i would ever be in a fatal crash i would hope my brothers could learn something from it. the eager beavers of “stop” are just trying too hard to be the mature “been there done that” guys. When you have actually “been there done that” you see the value in dialogue.

Alternatively, experience could lead one to conclude that with so little conclusive information during a time while our people can look up at their puck board and go, "I don't know if this bro is still alive," these aren't good conversations. Without further info, you can't have a productive conversation with respect to increasing aviation safety. There is no definite thing you could point to as your dudes step out the door from what we know of the incident to refocus their crosscheck to increase their chance of success. We just know that we've lost two of our own under unknown conditions.

I'm also very curious to know what happened. As a former flight safety guy, this one really surprises me. The aircraft is fairly intact, resting on flat terrain and I'm not aware of an airfield anywhere nearby, at least not one that the BACN would operate out of. RIP to the crew...I've known a number of guys who've deployed to do that mission. It was often seen as an easy, "nice" deployment where one can rack up flying hours. Tragic that this happened. And to the users on here trying to get into a slap-fight with fellow forum users for merely wondering out loud what could have happened...so long as no one is revealing OPSEC info or being disrespectful (as stated before), so what? It's a military aviation forum. Go find other things to feel important about.

For anyone that missed it, resubmit your Tulsa packages ETA: https://bogidope.com/job-posting/125th-fighter-squadron-3/

WTF does names have to do with stating the obvious from the photos? Is that gonna change a GD thing if BADFNZ makes some factual observations about the photos in contrast as to what the news was reporting? I’m with BADFNZ here and I think some of you guys are being over sensitive. He’s not getting at anything personal, just disputing the Taliban CNN claim. And he’s correct. Sent from my iPhone using Baseops Network mobile app

Hey guys, I know everyone here wants know what happened and how to fix it which is expected from folks like us. However,First let’s drink a toast and morn the loss of two fellow aviators. I knew one of them personally, trained and flew with them down range Family and friends are being notified. outstanding officers and experienced aviators. God speed......him him him

Just for some kids that don’t know math: 1999 bonus and cap were introduced: $25,000, which it’s been in some form or fashion for a while, though it took far too long for big blue to realize that not just fighter pilots are important enough to offer a big bonus to... 2019...it’s now $35,000 Inflation says that 1999 $25k should be >$38k in 2019. Apparently flyers were more important in 1999 than they are today. Let that sink in.

Short answer, yes. The alerts are sat by mostly first assignment personnel. Most try and cross train or separate, not necessarily because of the schedule but because of the job. Most guys assigned to ops squadron work 4-6 alerts per month. Alerts are 24 hours long but do not include travel and pre/post briefs so the alert shift is two duty days. Also missileers haven't sat alert near the silos since the Titan II was retired in the 1980s. The MMIII has the capsule (or missileers) dispersed from the actual silos.

All facts.....to which I have no idea why you are being told to not speculate/discuss and being shut down. As long as you aren’t disrespectfully pointing fingers at individuals, placing blame and spreading rumors, some people seem to take the safety process “don’t talk about it” a little too seriously. I for one think this shit should be front and center in the same care and manner people are talking about the Kobe crash. People should care when service members die and planes clash and want to understand why and it should be discussed. You guys don’t think that civilians aren’t armchairing this in other forums. I like hearing from other professional aviators. What is to be gained by silence? People died in a third world shithole flying a jet that nobody hardly knows or cares about and likely never will because we don’t talk about it for some reason. Sent from my iPhone using Baseops Network mobile app

This.

LOL! thats drugs plus Tourette’s syndrome! pretty hilarious

I'm honestly not convinced this isn't a troll. If it's not, I'm very surprised. I didn't know you could get a 99 PCSM with that few hours. Sent from my SM-N975U using Baseops Network mobile app

BeERholder Huggy...the Beerholder! But it's true. I flew with a Captain on the 737 that absolutely hated flying WB international. Hated it so much that he bid back to the right seat of the 737 as soon as he could. Sat there until he could hold the left seat of the 737. Having flown the 737 and now WB international, I can't imagine flying our domestic system right now. Life is just so damn good on the 330. That's the great thing about this job, there is a little bit of everything for everyone. To each their own. Oh man, flightinfo. I wonder what ever happened to General Lee...

There's more info on SIPR on the CSAF daily ops brief.

As someone who is also trying the active duty route while doing the Guard/Reserve circuit find another recruiter. You are under NO obligation to use the regional LO recruiter. I'm in a similar situation. My recruiter for the last AD board made me think I had to put down an alternate job other than pilot (I put down CSO so he would push my paperwork through). Naturally I got selected for CSO and wasn't interested. He lost patience with me and refused to let reapply for another board for 12 MONTHS. I then just started cold calling recruiters all across the country until I found someone who is amicable to my cause and is now helping me apply for the next open active duty rated board due in May (wanted to apply for the January one but nobody could get me in before the deadline). TLDR for everyone seeking active duty (or any other) recruiters: 1. Only put down pilot for jobs you want (you aren't required to put alternates) 2. Don't like your recruiter or they aren't working with you? Find another. 3. Don't admit anything medically that they won't find on your physical. I made that mistake and it took me YEARS to get a medical waiver (finally achieved just last year). Everything you say can and WILL be used against you. No reward for medical honesty. I'm not saying lie but don't shoot yourself in the foot.

This. Solidly toward the bottom of the Tarantino pantheon. I liked Leo in it, Brad just plays a toned down version of Aldo Raines, and there is no plot. Basically just a buddy movie. Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

So there's the public part of an airline, and then there's flying for an airline. For example, SWA is a great company, but the flying does not appeal to me anymore. I'd been happy to get hired there coming out of the military (it was one of my top 3) but now that I'm here, I'm happy I'm not in a 737 flying domestic (incl Mexico and Hawaii) for the next 30 years. This is an example of the latter, nothing in this article affects my daily life. Sure we made less than UAL/DAL, but that's for the MBAs to figure out. And surprisingly, we still made 2.9 BILLION dollars this year. When our summer operation turned into a mess, the 737 MAX was grounded, and our stock price hit a new low, we pay a billion dollars in interest on our debt... we still made 2.9 billion. Now, you don't see Labor coming to the defense of management. We're in negotiations. Headlines are probably going to get worse before they get better. Especially with our past. But AA, the world's biggest airline, isn't going anywhere anytime soon. There's always someone at Hickam who wishes they were at Minot. My friends Miami IOE sequence has layovers in St Kitts and Medellin. Another friend exclusively bids Aruba layovers. What he said, bolded for emphasis. I also wouldn't mind seeing Alan Mullaly. But I do think AA is going to get worse before it gets better. PS: I'm posting this from my couch while on Reserve 🤷‍♂️

No.

Go to APC and read posts from the United forum around 2012-2014. Jeff Smisek in his prime. Doom and gloom, sky is falling, bankruptcy right around the corner, liquidation inevitable, unrecoverable death spiral. Now, United is an industry darling. What changed? A new management team. If APC had existed, you’d read the same from a theoretical Delta forum in the mid-2000s. The industry is cyclical. A management change at AA could/will make a huge difference. Some think that change will happen sooner than later. A Richard Anderson or Glen Hauenstein type hire could turn AA into a monster. Youngest fleet of the majors and cheap hubs in areas of massive growth. Or, Doug Parker could run AA into bankruptcy. No matter where you end up, it will be far better than Active Duty. That place is a toxic cesspool.

First, they haven’t released the names yet so there are probably plenty of people here with a vested interest in the form of friends over there. Second, I don’t give a shit if civilians are armchair QBing this. When NOK notifications are still going is probably not a great time to throw out random bullshit. You want to look at Twitter and draw your own conclusions? Go for it. You’re probably a semi-educated individual and can figure stuff out.

A very holier than thou view you have there. I don’t know this guy personally, but you have quite the bias. I’m not saying he did no wrong, but you act like this is some easy black and white situation. There’s a lot of blame all around for him, the girl, and OSI/the military judicial system. 1. That’s not how possession charges work in the civilian world, and he’s not guilty until proven innocent in the a real court. A psycho bringing shit into your house (especially if you don’t know) does not make you responsible for said psycho. 2. You must’ve never had significant family issues go on, because most people will choose to cling to a turbulent family situation over the military who is also ing you every day (in a bad way) I’ve chosen relationship situations that weren’t necessarily the best course of action over the military plenty of times, and I wouldn’t expect others to act differently with the blinders people have for loved ones. 3. You bring up weapons employment. Have you ever been directly responsible for someone’s death? Ever listened to guys in a TIC begging for help get killed? I don’t know what he was going through, but I haven’t met many people that aren’t heavily impacted by death. They may cover it up with the joking around, but when you have a real heart to heart with the bros it’s acknowledged. I think you would be surprised at the coping mechanisms many people in the military who have those experiences develop. They have no other help that won’t destroy their lives as they know it in their eyes. I couldn’t imagine sitting in a box for 8 hours, killing some people, watching Americans you can’t help die, and then just going home to my family that night like it’s nothing. Especially when there’s family issues at home. The Air Force pretends that they are there for you, but will gladly take your job if you actually seek mental health help for combat experiences. We have plenty of example of it. And there’s plenty of data acknowledging how crippling it can be for veterans. The useless morons in OSI who entrap and crave convicting anyone for anything have plenty of blame in his death. They have no real job, and far too much power. They try to coerce false accusations and entrap people as much as possible. They even sit around at Nellis trying to get people to talk about classified info so they can get you for they. If they were real cops that found her drugs in his house, she would’ve been charged with it, not him for owning the house.