mb1685

That would be great! I'll shoot over a sanitized copy of my main application documents to you soon.

That method is also age-neutral, which seems strange. The older folks who are good runners would probably still be penalized since it’s almost inevitable that waist circumference will increase. So a 40-year-old is going to have to run faster than a 20-year-old of the same height and smaller waist to get the same score. I did some quick number crunching though and it seems like it doesn’t take an amazing run time to get a high score (compared to the current PT standards for younger age brackets), so I guess that’s the flip side. There would probably be (even more of) an expectation for young people to crush it.

Thanks for responding! I've been following your story and it's inspiring, although again I do make sure to keep my expectations in check since my background pales in comparison to yours. If it matters at all (although it's difficult to communicate everything concisely in an application package and assumptions instead prevail), I did try to pursue an age waiver twice from the Navy to go back to OCS, but their Program Authorization explicitly specifies that age waivers are only authorized for prior service and so they wouldn't budge, despite my persistence. I hope that a unit will be willing to hear the whole story if they're interested in considering me but have reservations about that. What EvilEagle said makes perfect sense. Although I know the biggest hurdle is convincing a unit that I'm a good fit and that the lifestyle (during and after training) is compatible and won't diminish my ability to thrive despite my age, there's perhaps a tiny silver lining in that I'm no longer in age waiver territory for another year or so thanks to the age limit increase to 33. When I had just turned 28, I had one fighter unit give me a call and told me I was on their short list for interviews but my age was the only concern -- then later they told me that ended up being why I didn't get one. That gives me a little bit of hope (and was also the moment that took me from thinking there's no way in hell I'd have a shot at fighters to wondering if maybe there's a chance). But I fully understand that the regulation isn't so much the issue, it's the actual real-life implications of how things have tended to shape up for older guys. I definitely have no qualms with flying heavies, and if the age limit extension hadn't happened then I'm sure I'd be trying to rush heavy units in hopes of getting selected with an age waiver. But since I'm now technically eligible again for a little bit longer (cue Lloyd Christmas "so you're telling me there's a chance..."), I figure I'll hard-charge after primarily fighters for a while and see what happens.

Thank you, gentlemen. Definitely sounds like the odds aren't in my favor but there's no reason not to try of course. I'll give it my all but keep my expectations in check!

Whoa, how’d you manage that? I tried to pay my own way to do MFS since I already had an IFC1 but they wouldn’t let me.

I've been on these forums for quite a while but have never bothered to post one of these. I guess now is the time. I previously attended Navy OCS with a Pilot slot and disenrolled due to a family emergency involving my pregnant wife. Tried to get an age waiver but they don't do them for non-prior service, then started pursuing Guard/Reserve units, but got to be too old. Now that the age limit has been increased to 33, it looks like I've got some time to try again. -Age: 30 next month (I assume that gives me a solid year of attempting this again since 28 seemed to be the cutoff for most units when the age limit was 30) -AFOQT scores: Pilot: 92 Navigator: 55 Academic Aptitude: 77 Verbal: 85 Quantitative: 63 -PCSM score: 80 with 20 flight hours 200+ hour column is 97 (mentioned because I've heard some units compare all applicants based on that) I'm planning on knocking out my PPL as soon as I can. My flight time has all been really staggered over many years so I'll probably start from practically the ground up and I figure I'll end up in the 60-80 hour bracket, putting my PCSM at 88. -GPA: 3.11, B.S. Mass Communication -5+ years of professional digital marketing experience, including a promotion to management -No medical issues, clean background Already used both AFOQT and TBAS attempts so I figure the PPL is the only thing really within my power at this point other than taking the time and effort to rush units. I definitely can't afford a master's degree + the PPL. I know my stats/background aren't extremely impressive and time isn't on my side, so I'm not fighters or bust. But I do want to shoot for them primarily. Do I stand a chance with a PPL?

Welp, I just overnighted a package that's due by COB on 1 March. I put the MFR in the package. Read this news, got on BogiDope to look at board listings, and then left work really early to run home and put this together in record time. 😂 Hopefully the change indeed applies for Guard/Reserve + off the street accessions.

Actually I’m not sure. This seems to refer to an extension for Guard/Reserve applicants too.

On second thought I think this is probably correct. I think it’s just this being put into writing: https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10156206329556865&id=285437941864

Wow, I haven't been on this forum in months and I randomly decided to log on today and you posted this 30 minutes earlier. It's like an omen. 😂 I'm almost 30 and had thrown in the towel on this. Looks like it's time to start back up!

As far as I know, yes, it's only for already commissioned officers who are applying for the AD rated board. As for commissioning into another AFSC to get your foot in the door, it's not really a "loophole" and there's nothing shady about doing it. Just keep in mind that the Active Duty boards are the most competitive route to an AD pilot slot (compared to OTS, ROTC, USAFA), and you'll probably have to stay in your non-rated AFSC for a significant amount of time before you're eligible to apply. You'll need to bust ass in your AFSC too since you'll probably be competing against some standouts. If you really want to go Guard/Reserve but aren't picky about airframe/location, I'd keep trying heavy units before rushing to commission into AD. It seems that a fair number of heavy units don't have a problem doing age waivers these days. Plus who knows, maybe the next step will be for the Air Force to make age 33 the cutoff for civilian accessions too. If you'd rather go AD anyway, then sure, it's a decent plan to commission into another AFSC and apply for the rated board when eligible. If you don't care whether you go Guard/Reserve or AD but you just really want fighters, then that plan is probably your best chance at getting a shot.

I turned 29 earlier this year and most of my board applications were while I was 27 and 28. Thank you! But I'm actually calling it quits on the boards. Life has some other cool stuff in store for me which is also aviation-related.

I found it extremely worthwhile. A few units told me that my (updated) cover letter and resume (formatting/style) were the best they'd ever seen, but my age always ended up being the issue keeping me from getting interview selections.

Going AFROTC is probably a no-go for him. The official site says that cadets selected for rated AFSCs have to commission by age 29. Age waivers are pretty much unheard of for active duty rated acquisitions too (but age ETPs do seem to get approved for the active duty boards for already commissioned officers to cross-train). With his age, a Guard or Reserve unit pushing for an age waiver is his best bet unless he wants to commission into a non-rated AFSC (or possibly RPA since there's a blanket age waiver in effect extending the age to 35) and then apply for the active duty rated board with an age ETP when eligible (this requires you to serve in your current AFSC for 2.5 years before you'd be able to begin UPT, to my knowledge).

Active duty is probably out of the cards unless you get picked up for RPA and then apply for the AD rated board (for already commissioned officers) when you're eligible, which I believe is 2.5 years after you earn your wings. Obviously you'll need an age ETP by that point, but it seems that those aren't a gigantic deal for the AD rated board as long as you're in your early 30s based on what I've read around here. I mention RPA because there's currently a blanket age waiver in effect for RPA which increases the maximum age to no older than 35 on your first day of undergraduate RPA training. The other 3 rated fields have the age 30 limit and it seems that AD officer accessions (i.e. boards that select people to attend OTS, as opposed to the board I mentioned earlier which is for already commissioned officers to cross-flow) absolutely will not do age waivers. AFPC/AFRS has a rule that Pilot/CSO/ABM selects have to start OTS by age 29 + 1 month (I guess to give them ample time to make sure you can get through OTS, IFT, SERE/Water Survival training, and start your undergraduate training program all by your 30th birthday), so there's no way that would pan out. I also mention RPA because the word on the street is that there won't be any OTS boards to select non-rated AFSCs until next year (and I believe they'll be slotted for OTS classes beginning in FY2021), so RPA is your only quick way in. I agree with the poster above that recommended applying with Reserve heavy squadrons (although I'd look at Guard ones too). Getting to UPT by age 30 might be doable but I wouldn't count on it, but fortunately it seems like a fair amount of heavy units are doing age waivers these days. Fighter units have been known to do it occasionally but it seems extremely rare and reserved for the most awesome candidates known to man (e.g. prior military, lots of flight time and some advanced ratings, great scores/GPA, maybe even ties to the local area), but it couldn't hurt to apply to those as well (although to maximize your chances it's a good idea to spend the time and money to visit those units, and it can be tough putting forth that investment without knowing if your application is even going to be considered in the first place). Your scores are good and your PCSM is great for having a relatively small amount of flight time. I'd recommend applying to every unit you can while continuing to build hours and ratings if you can afford it.

This is correct. You can still apply for Guard and Reserve unit boards though since most of them won’t require you to start doing all that stuff until after the unit selects you. If I could turn back the clock, I’d put all of my efforts into rushing Guard/Reserve units (which in your situation would mean getting a good chunk of flight time, preferably a PPL). If you still haven’t gotten hired once the age limits start creeping up on you, then start considering Active Duty. The Navy’s age limit for no prior service is really low — you have to commission by age 27, so if you’re just as open to the Navy as you are to the USAF/USAFR/ANG, you might want to get the ball rolling on that by the time you turn 26 so that opportunity doesn’t escape you. I was a former Navy OCS select (disenrolled due to a family emergency and then busted the age limit) and I thought it was the easiest selection method. As long as you meet the minimums to apply, doing well on the ASTB is practically guaranteed to get you selected. I also found the ASTB easier than the AFOQT and my scores reflected that. I got picked up with a 3.11 GPA, 1 hour of flight time, decent letters of recommendation, and a pretty unimpressive background. The only thing I really had going for me was good ASTB scores (60 9/9/8). Flight hours aren’t a part of the equation, unlike the Air Force PCSM. If you’re not all that crazy about the Navy then I’d say to forego applying since that will give you another few years to keep rushing Guard and Reserve units. Since the age limit is to start UPT by age 30, most units will stop considering you around your 28th birthday. The Active Duty AF accessions OTS boards also requires the timing to work out so that the selection board meets prior to your 28th birthday (might be waiverable, I’m not sure). So if you still haven’t had any luck and time keeps ticking, I’d put it an Active Duty OTS application last. You’re in good shape for any of the avenues as long as you get some flight time, can snag some solid letters of recommendation, and aren’t a douche.

Are you going AD or Guard/Reserve? The other part of the physical is called MFS (Medical Flight Screening). If you're going AD, it's standard to do MFS after OTS but before starting UPT, so it shouldn't affect your eligibility to go to OTS. If you're going Guard/Reserve, they usually knock out everything all at the same time at Wright-Patt I believe (before OTS).

Stahp. It's not funny/entertaining anymore now that you made the trolling so obvious.

That guy mentioned the 558th FTS specifically (for approving the PTDY) so I'm pretty sure he's talking about RPA and therefore his cost estimate is for that remaining 20%. Plus $2.5k seems like it'd be implausibly cheap for any significantly greater amount than 20% of the hours required for a PPL.

Check paragraph 10 of the 18-02 results document, it says "The next AFRC OTS/UFT/URT selection board will be held on 05-06 march 2018. application deadline is midnight, 25 February 2018. This board will select only unit sponsorship applicants; no unsponsored applicants." I'm definitely not saying to not try, but just relaying what I've heard/seen. It sounds like getting in touch with that IP on ALPF is probably your best bet. MAF = Mobility Air Force (i.e. heavies) LNO = Liaison Officer

The latest board (March) took no unsponsored candidates. Here's what a T-6 IP in the squadron that controls the unsponsored pipeline said recently: "Program was introduced because MAF was taking so long to get candidates to boards. They were coming up short every year. It acts as a bridge to fill the un-filled slots. Last year, they turned in 20+ slots. This year, they have around 100, but many more applicants than slots available, a good chunk of them sponsored. First choice is to take sponsored candidates, then fill if needed by unsponsored. So, yes, there are no Unsponsored Boards for a while. They got the candidates. But, that doesn’t mean if your a great candidate you won’t be picked up unsponsored and “injected” into process. But, it does mean your going to have to be “overqualified” for the immediate future. The bare minimums ain’t gonna cut it right now. In reality, we do not have a problem recruiting new pilots, we have a problem retaining them later in their career." More info here (I started this thread at ALPF): https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/military/112125-current-status-afrc-unsponsored-boards.html The IP there is willing to help some people with the process. It might be worth a shot, but at the moment it looks like unsponsored opportunities are drying up.

Question #1: No, the ANG and the USAFR are totally separate entities. You'd need to get sponsored by a Reserve unit. If you got picked up by an ANG unit, you'd have to relinquish your unsponsored Reserve selection to process with the Guard unit. If you'd already gone to OTS and commissioned into the USAFR via the unsponsored route then it would probably be totally impossible to go ANG at that point. Question #2: Traditionally, the point of the unsponsored route was to get guys into training prior to getting sponsored (then they'd need to find a sponsor by Phase 3 of UPT or they'd be automatically assigned to a unit). The latest word I've heard is that they're getting plenty of sponsored candidates now and it seems like the future of taking unsponsored candidates is in question. I've heard that recent unsponsored candidates now aren't being sent to UPT until they're sponsored due to a UPT backlog, and I've also heard that AFRC isn't really bothering with unsponsored candidates at the moment unless they think you're exceptionally qualified.

Anyone heard from Fort Worth yet?

You definitely don't have to swear in to DEP just to apply for the OTS boards. You do it after you're selected, and then swear in once more (this time to Extended Active Duty) just before leaving for OTS. That said, swearing in to DEP doesn't obligate you to anything and you can be discharged per your own request (per AFRSI 36-2001 paragraph 2.40.1.6.), so if you're worried about your recruiter blowing you off for pushing back and you just want to get the ball rolling, it's probably not going to hurt anything to go ahead and sign. Chances are that once you get to MEPS for your physical, the Air Force personnel there will know what you're there for and they're not going to go try to make you randomly swear in for something you haven't been selected for yet (i.e. there won't even be a contract for you yet).

Does anyone know if the AFRC UFT boards are not taking unsponsored applicants anymore? I heard that was the case for the board taking place this month. Is that the plan for the foreseeable future or is there a chance unsponsored applicants will be able to apply again in the near future? Also, I read on here a while back that age waivers probably aren't a thing for unsponsored applicants, but to "try anyway". Can anyone speak to this? I turn 29 next month and already have a MEPS physical, IFCI physical, and my security clearance investigation was initiated almost a year ago, so I figure those things could theoretically get me orders to OTS/MFS/IFT/UPT sooner than someone without, but of course the uncertainty of the fate of unsponsored boards + UPT backups mean that I'd probably need a waiver.