Clark Griswold

They may be doing this on the cheap, just not reporting the true development cost or just not developing all the LO / 5th Gen capes the 22 & 35 have. They have a track record of significantly improving existing designs, bringing them in on the Silent Eagle for a further extension of that idea might have paid dividends, but that ship has sailed. Concept proposed Japanese Stealth Eagle They are buying F-35s but really wanted F-22s. They have lifted their self-imposed ban on exporting weapons so this might turn into a competitor to the F-35 for sales, possibly India as they aren't happy with the T-50 and that would give China a problem to worry about.

Update. Japan's F-3 could fly this summer. https://nationalinterest.org/blog/the-buzz/watch-out-china-japan-readies-test-new-stealth-fighter-jet-12580

The company reps said they would offer that as an option but they didn't think the USAF would go for it - just from casual conversation with them at WEPTAC It has good maneuverability and power but not really enough for fighter lead-in (from a company pilot)

Thanks - I try. India is getting into the Light CAS game.... https://www.janes.com/article/51099/carter-to-offer-scorpion-to-india-under-joint-development-plan

Agreed but the F-35 could become self-aware and choke the pilot with the O2 hose and the AF would still talk about how it is the only answer to the CAS mission. The only thing that will get the AF off it's duff and figure out a way to fund an affordable / supportable / capable CAS asset is to threaten to give that mission to the Army then suddenly they will figure it out

True - this shit is like a horse fly, annoying and it will come back, swat it and move on.

Anything will be sacrificed to the Golden Calf Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Use liberally - unfortunately they are out there Checks with my homework Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Ammunition for A-10 supporters (count me in). Doing The Math: Saving A-10s By Cutting F-35s By LT. COL. DAN WARDon August 12, 2014 at 2:38 PM

Copy all, agree to slightly disagree.

I don't think we are actually in too much disagreement on this but realize the position the PC corps puts her in, I read the article it was innocuous and she slipped the "jet nor troops doesn't care if you're a woman" quote in there, I interpret that as her saying "quit mentioning and focusing on the fact that I am woman even though that is the reason for this article" Most lady aircrew I've met (civilian or military) didn't have a chip on their shoulder about the fact they were a minority in the aviation community and the ones I did were no more or less annoying than some of the dudes i had the misfortune to work with who were nuclear powered ass-bots Hate the press not the pilot.

Ditto, I hate shit like this too and have never met her but my spider sense and cynical nature makes me suspect that some good idea fairy in PA and A1 volun-told her to do this.

As Willie Sutton was interested in banks because "that's where the money is" all the major actors (good and bad) are hovering around the federal government because of its steady but of late exponential growth... These things usually take years to either gain enough steam to happen or fizzle out but a convention of states to force a constitutional change on the federal government I think it is gathering steam... https://www.theblaze.com/stories/2014/01/14/governors-looking-at-constitutional-convention-to-reign-in-federal-spending/ Ultimately the modern state requires a strong central government but not one that is on steroids... Edit: grammar

Yup - trust but verify but never completely trust... the government is just in need of a wholesale purge to reign it in... of course with that comes against the wishes of the army of lobbyists, PACs, Super PACs, corporate donors, billionaires, bullshit non-profit advocacy groups and other purveyors of legal bribery...

Yup https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuskegee_syphilis_experiment

We're thru the looking glass people... SOF is using abandoned Wal-Marts connected by underground tunnels to allow for a Chinese invasion force to first subdue the southwestern USA then you'll be in a re-education camp with your Chairman Obama book eating rotten rice... /sarcasm... Behold the rant of Alex Jones... https://www.infowars.com/the-truth-about-jade-helm-they-dont-want-you-to-know/ Conspiracy is nothing new to the USA or any other country, in fact it's a helluva lot less here as we have a multitude of press outlets that somewhat balance each other to deliver mostly true but slanted liberal / conservative / corporate or kooky reports and our government is somewhat transparent but becoming byzantine with little direct accountability for obvious malfeasance - Fast & Furious, Clinton e-mails, Lois Lerner. Just listing some of the last few obvious screw ups / cover ups for which no one's cock was put on the chopping block when it was clear that someone needs to be held to account... conservatives have had theirs too... all that typed, that power and no accountability is fueling the recent spike in paranoia, the solution would be for the powerful to hold them selves accountable but I will not hold my breath for that.

I finally read about the conspiracy theory on this exercise, other than imposing martial law on Texas to pave the way for theft of precious bodily fluids and prepare the population for mass brainwashing, what's the big deal? OPSEC considered, is anybody here going to support this LFE? Ok, Wolverines...

Thanks but damn it Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Just went to the hiring page but still says no ANG or Reserves but the page is dated 1/21/2014 - did the email open it up to the ARC? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

There is still a lot of room for new innovation but as SurelySerious and dvlax40 said we (the military) don't necessarily have the best technology anymore but we can buy it just like anyone else but everyone else is usually concerned about money so they get it done faster, cheaper, better. These two referenced articles are not explicitly related to a new trend / advancement in air to air warfare but these type of trends: advanced rapid prototyping and manufacture are the antidote to the stone tablet technology of our current requirements / procurement system This Obscure Skunk Works Jet May Help Team Win New Stealth Bomber Bid 20,000 3D Printed Parts Are Currently Used on Boeing Aircraft as Patent Filing Reveals Further Plans

Yep, but we are well past V1 with F-35 so it is now a matter of how do you mitigate or maximize it depending on whether your outlook is glass half empty or half full. AESA missile guidance seems like another advantage to improve the odds when the 35 will have to do air to air.

AESA radar missiles. Worth the cost and effort to develop? Bad News for U.S. Warplane Pilots: Russia’s New Dogfighting Missile Can’t Miss (Just the title of the article, they seem to be selling it rather than reporting on it) Japan Upgrading 60 F-2s With AAM-4, J/APG-2 Continuing with that idea of better missile, is that the realistic solution to the F-35 and its compromises? Maybe it's not the best fighter but has one helluva missile (if we put the money into the effort). Lockheed Test Pilot Calls For Longer Range AIM-120

We'll worry about the money later? Sounds awesome, that's how you wound up with only 187 F-22's, great idea.

Stillion makes the argument that would contradict your assertion about maneuverability and BVR effectiveness. From page 39 of his report: Costs of Maneuverability Just as with speed, there would be no need to reduce the maneuverability of combat aircraft designs if it could be incorporated for “free.” Just as with speed, however, adding features necessary for high maneuverability to a combat aircraft imposes constraints that force aircraft designers to make tradeoffs in other areas of performance and add weight and cost to the aircraft. For example, maneuverability is enhanced by a relatively low wing aspect ratio and a high thrust-to-weight ratio to allow for tight turns and sustain energy at high G-loads. Low wing aspect ratio tends to reduce aerodynamic efficiency, and, as previously mentioned, high thrust-to-weight ratios result in inefficient engine cruise performance.61 High maneuverability also requires strong aircraft structures, and these add significant weight. The load-bearing structure of an aircraft with a design goal of maintaining 9-G turns must be three times as strong as one designed to sustain only 3-Gs. For any given level of aircraft structure technology, this will make the 9-G structure significantly heavier than the 3-G structure if both aircraft are to have the same range and payload. Since aircraft cost is closely correlated with empty weight, adding maneuverability contributes directly to aircraft cost. Another potential drawback to high-maneuverability designs is that they require significant vertical tail area to facilitate high-angle-of-attack maneuvering. This was not much of an issue before the advent of stealth technology. However, large vertical tail surfaces add significantly to the side radar cross-section of aircraft.62 So, while increased maneuverability certainly contributed to the combat effectiveness and survivability of fighter designs in the past, it is much less clear that its future value will outweigh its costs. 61 Wing aspect ratio is the ratio of the square of an aircraft’s wing span to the area of the wing. For a given wing area, the longer the span, the higher the aspect ratio. Higher aspect ratio wings allow for lower induced drag and greater cruise efficiency, but have higher bending stress for a given load requiring greater structural weight, assuming similar materials, and generally lower roll rates because they have a higher moment of inertia to overcome than a lower aspect ratio wing of the same area. Lower-aspect ratio wings offer higher roll rates and produce more lift at high angles of attack than highaspect ratio wings. Both of these factors have received high priority in fighter designs resulting in relatively stubby wings compared to aircraft designed for efficient cruise flight like airliners. And page 26 From his report also on Gulf War Air to Air Engagements: TABLE 1 . SUMMARY OF FIRST GULF WAR AERIAL VICTORIES Detection and Identification In twenty-seven of thirty-three engagements against fixed wing aircraft (82%), AWACS provided target information and identification before U.S. fighters detected enemy aircraft. On average AWACS detected and identified enemy aircraft while they were still over 70 nm from U.S. fighters. In the four engagements where ACM occurred, U.S. pilots first detected enemy aircraft at 5 nm or more on radar. Air Combat Maneuvering (ACM) In only four of the thirteen visual range encounters did U.S. fighters engage in significant ACM to attain firing position. Only 15% of all engagements and 38% of visual range engagements involved ACM. BVR Engagements Sixteen of thirty-three engagements between fixed wing aircraft occurred BVR (48%). On average, U.S. pilots detected enemy aircraft on their own radars at 42 nm and launched missiles at 10 nm. U.S. pilots fired twenty-eight AIM-7s. Twenty-two of the AIM-7s hit their target or the debris (79%). Speed At no time did any U.S. aircraft exceed 650 knots (Mach 1.03 at 12,000 ft), even against targets moving at 700 knots or more. I think it is a matter of degrees, obviously a fighter should not be load limited to 3Gs but if you could have significant range improvement, sustainable high cruise speed, RCS reduction, more weapons / ECM, and enough maneuverability would that not make a better fighter / interceptor? I still disagree with his idea / concept but I respect his research and presentation of argument. Maneuver is still a major factor and will continue to be in air to air engagement, it just needs to share the stage with SA, LO, range and high cruise speed. Edit: poor posting technique for referenced material by the sage of food additives.

Guys we only paid averaging the costs of the F-35 models together $178 million per copy, did you really expect quality for that bargain basement price? How Much Does an F-35 Actually Cost? Up to $337 million—apiece—for the Navy version and the program is only a $163 billion over budget, c'mon stop min running this and put some real money in. 60 Minutes: F-35 Cost Overruns Total $163 Billion For the cost overrun, we probably could have gone to Mars twice on manned missions.. Mars, red rocks...