SocialD

I'll pick up that torch. 6. Crozier retires with an O-6 pension. 7. Lands a comfortable, high-paying gig. 8. Writes a book and/or becomes a news SME. 9. Looks back at his decision with his head held high. 10. Realizes he's much happier now that he's out of the shitshow that is the service.

Pretty close the story that was relayed to me by one of my buddies in the class. From my understanding one of the sticking points was that they "broke into" the flight room on the weekend (through 2 cipher locks), to get to the EPQ. From what I remember, all but the 1 Guard guy (who ended up quitting) made it back into training. One of them was my roommate in the B-Course. Another one was in the B-Course after mine. He was showed up to Sheppard right after commissioning and was on admin hold so long that he was a Captain when he showed up to the B-Course. I think many of then were Captains before they left Sheppard. It was a mess and a ridiculous overreaction.

Ya, initially that wasn't the case. Then they realized many deployments actually cross the FY dateline lol. Definitely a great change in our favor. Your dates line up with the guys who got the really good deal that I mentioned above. I went through all of my training the O6-09 time frame. I just pulled up all my orders from UPT through seasoning. All of them were Title-32. Story time. Right as I showed up to ENJJPT, they were in the middle of a huge cheating scandal. Supposedly the "ring leader" was a Guard guy and because he was on Title-32 orders, it made the investigation/discipline much harder because it all had to go through his state/unit. So as a "fix" for that issue, sometime while I was in 38s, they amended all the Guard guys orders. The amendment included verbiage that essentially made us under control of the local leadership wrt to disciplinary issues like mentioned above. My guess is that this was just a bandaid and they eventually (after I was off seasoning) changed the guys to Title-10 orders. The guys who were on those title-10 hit the jackpot wrt to early retirement credit...one of our our guys got them all the way through seasoning. I think he got a full 5 years of early retirement credit. From what I've been told by the more recent punks, their orders no longer count toward early retirement and I honestly haven't looked into it. I just assumed that they fixed the glitch with the MEST orders.

That was true only for a short time. When I went through, we were all on Title-32 training orders, thus we didn't get early retirement credit. There was a short period of time where guys were title-10 or some time of early retirement eligible orders. Some of those dudes had 2-3 years of pilots training plus their 2 years of seasoning counted...they killed it for sure! From my understanding they "fixed the glitch," and those orders (MEST?) are no longer early retirement eligible. You are correct though, it is 90 day increments. You just have to get them in any 2 contiguous fiscal years.

Ya man, I didn't learn this until about the 10-12 year point in the ANG. Shouldn't be a huge deal for pilots since we have so many extra days. I guess if technicians bunched up their days at one time, they could screw themselves. You can see a year-by-year break down off all the types of points you earned. vMPF - Self service actions - Personal Data - ANG/USAFR Points Credit Summary Inquiry (PCARS) - Service History

If noone has told you, if able, make sure you get 50 points during this year while you wait to go to training. I understand that this may not be possible with the current situation. You get 15 points for just being a member of the ANG and you get an additional point for ever pay card you turn in. The 50 points are based on your enlistment year, not fiscal year or calendar year. If you don't get 50 points, that year won't count as a "good" year toward your 20 years for retirement.

Ok, I write OPRs (ANG), but what does lack of recent award mean? As in, not getting some kind of made up, BS award of the year or qtr? That is a thing? I can understand a referral OPR, but even then, that's been 5 years ago now. Add this to the list of reasons why I tell all my AD buddies to go to the ANG over AFRES...especially reserve units embedded in an AD Wing on an AD base. I've wondered this as well. I was prior-E and have told two different things by two different commanders.

I've flown with a few guys who have deposits down on the Raptor. The numbers they were quoting seemed a bit of a pipe dream, but who knows. I hope it works the numbers actually happen. I heavily researched the idea of buying a Bonanza/Mooney or similar. Hindsight is right, you'll run into some serious personalities, and experimental is the way to go to save costs. All I can say is be honest with yourself on what your "mission" is and how often you'll actually use it. After joining a club with a Cherokee-6, I found I didn't use it nearly as much as I thought I would. If it wasn't bad weather, it was personal scheduling conflicts, rarely was it because of aircraft availability. This drives up the cost/hr significantly. As someone who was a CFII before UPT, and once very proficient in small plane IMC ops, I realize I will not fly nearly enough to be comfortable in single pilot IMC ops in a light GA aircraft. I also looked at fractional ownership with a few squadron mates and let's just say, do LOTS of research and soul searching if you go that route...especially if you're particular about your stuff. Tons of good information out there about doing this, so study up and know the pitfalls. I found the type specific forums (beechtalk, mooneyspace, etc...) to be the most informative places to hang out. In the end, I went to the opposite end of the spectrum and now fly around at 500 feet, 85mph, radio off (out of the pattern), door open in a tailwheel aircraft and couldn't be happier. I fly it WAY more than most fly their BO's/Mooneys and it's ridiculously cheap flying. I may not fly more hours, but I'm probably flying more often. If you have a good airport community, half the fun is just being out there and hanging out. Plus, you get to know people who may let you fly their planes lol. If I ever decide I want something with some speed, I'm likely getting an RV-7.

Honestly, if you're finishing up a 10 year UPT commitment, and meet the mins, you're well qualified.

If you have a seniority number and can go back to a gig you like, I'd go back. Keep a nice steady paycheck coming in and get to watch this all pan out from the sidelines. If you don't actually get furloughed, then you continue to accrue longevity, so you'd come back to 3rd(ish) year pay. Aside from a possibility of a 179 or 365, I can't see too many downsides.

Sounds like this stimulus bill has some no furlough language through Sept 2020. If true, and all the airlines take it, I'd be surprised to see any of the big airlines furlough. But who knows, I never thought I'd see a global pandemic where I'd be forced to stay home either. Pretty much the same at my ANG squadron. Not that it matters much since we're basically not flying anyway. Can't fly at the Guard, can't fly at the airline...shaping up to be a relaxing April of drinking on the porch and watching the world go by. Not a big deal for most, but for those CAT E reservists, watch your points and ensure you don't screw up missing a good year. I've seen it screwed up, especially since a lot of people lose track that a good year is based off the day you entered service, not CY or FY.

Our RCP deployers can't seem to get a straight answer. They've been told everyting from indefinite hold, to a month delay and most recently, certain deployers may be going on time. For some of them, on time is early April.

Although they were under no obligation to offer them, they negotiated to reinstate SILs (55 hour no-fly line) and then said they were going to offer them for May and June. Then the day they were supposed to be posted for bid, they said nevermind, that doesn't work for us right now. Basically, they don't want to upset the other employee groups (non-union) since 13k of them took unpaid leaves...then they offered us over 4,000 personal (unpaid) leaves of absence. So they'll pay me 72 hours to sit reserve and likely not fly since we have 60-90 guys on reserve every day and basically no trips to fly (WB international category) rather than paying me 55 hours. Of course they could be trying to negotiate a lowered line value. In the grand scheme of things it's not a big deal, but it just destroyed what trust the pilot group had left in management. Lots of moderate folks just turned hardline.

...and DAL just took our partial pay leaves off the table and said you can take a personal leave of absence (no pay). Essentially, because it might look bad to the other employee groups. 🙄

One of our part-timers (F-16) was an DOD-employee as an engineer/project manager and surprisingly enough, he had the toughest time with his employer wrt to his MLOA. Of course they legally had to give him time off, but he was trying to do right by both employers. Toward the end of his time he even told the bosses to take his IP status off the letter of X's because he didn't feel he could be an effective IP, with how little time he could devote to the Guard. On the upside, there are LOTs of contract gigs out there that having an engineering background will really help. We have a few guys working contract gigs for F-35 stuff because they're fighter guys with an engineering background. Pretty good side gig/pay, some are still doing as airline guys.

Truth is, the 2 years "consensus" is all bullshit. Not a single person knows how this will all pan out. Even if the virus turns soon, will the traveler confidence return quickly? I'd say continue to log the IP/EP time if able, maybe sign up for various schools (safety, etc...) if you have the change. If it turns quickly and you have the means, then a trip to the regionals wouldn't hurt either...though likely not needed. I think it will be as competitive as it ever was, with you having a slight edge for being military.

You're talking about a group of guys that were told their entire career that they didn't need to save their own cash for retirement because their pensions were a sure thing...we all know how that worked out for many of them. A lot of them have been through the B-scale, a furlough or two, a bankruptcy and more black swans events than they can count. They all know that the company can wipe their ass with this agreement should they go back into bankruptcy or otherwise become insolvent. My guess is many of the old timers will be very wary of such an agreement. I know many of the old timers on the DAL boards are essentially scoffing it because they know it can be taken away with the stroke of a pen. Not saying you won't have some takers, but I don't think it's will be as slam dunk as some think.

I guess I would say calm down, pour a scotch and smoke a lucky. I certainly don't blame people for jumping on orders as you worry about providing for the family. Guys going on orders will help the situation out a bit. Thankfully, the airlines are wisely waiving the 5 year USERRA clock...hopefully this is expanded. None of us should be anywhere close to pulling up the floor boards to keep the fire going. At DAL, we've been running at such high ALVs, that simply dropping us down to the bottom of the ALV window will help ease off furloughs. We still have lots of training going on which will keep instructors in the sims (requiring more guys on the line and on the list). In the next year or two we'll retire over 1300-1800 pilots which only helps. It may be a bumpy road for a bit, but we may come out of this a little better off than many are thinking right now. As we speak, AAL just rolled out a pretty generous voluntary leave package (even continue to get paid to age 65 while essentially retire early) which will be helpful as well. DAL is offering 55 hour no fly lines (SILs), which pays me about the same as a month of orders would as a 18 yr LTC. I hope I'm actually senior enough to get a SIL. Ohio (and many others) just shut down all bars and restaurants, the fed cut the rate of 0 and fired up the quantitative easing machine. Trump just invoked the Stafford act which means we may all be headed to a federally mandated home quarantine....that's bad for everyone (other than killing the virus lol), so we're all in this mess together. If it comes down to it and we do start to furlough, I think I'll be ok with about 4,800 junior to me. That said, if I have the option to go on orders and it will save a junior guy from furlough, then I'll probably jump to mloa, even if its just 4ish months of orders. I've run the number and as an O-5, just with all the AFTPs/UTAs/AT, I'll be sitting at ~50k gross. Add in 4 months of orders and I'm at 100k. It's not anyway what I'm making now, but it's way more than I really need to live comfortably and still enjoy my life. Thankfully I paid cash for my house and all my toys! Anyway, I'd have a tough time looking a fellow pilot in the eye and saying sorry bro, I can't take that pay cut as he gets kicked to the street. Were all in this together. This is a great lesson in not being a complete dick about losing pay to come out to the gaurd (standing by for the people's elbow from Hindsight2020😁). Also a lesson in not leaving your mil gig right away and continuing to promote if able. I haven't run the numbers (mentioned above) for O-4, but I'm certainly glad I finished ACSC as the extra pay will only be helpful in times like this. Speaking of, time to get ready for a day at the Guard. Supposed to double turn...we'll see if we even turn a wheel today.

Don't necessarily disagree with you, but it's going to be A LOT harder sell when your management team was doing 12B in stock buyback and making 6+B leading up to this temporary event.

I say keep the post Huggy, you were spot on!

Ya supposedly we have furlough protections for everyone on the at the signing of our last contract. However, I'm not sure it's worth the paper it's written on in times like this. If they need to furlough, they're furlough what they need. We supposedly get 90 days notice and 1 month pay per year of service up to 6. That said, I don't think we're really there yet...especially if they think this will dry up in the next 2-4 months. We've been fairly understaffed in a lot of categories and running guys at high ALVs (80+) even in the winter. Dropping them down to a more normal ALV 70ish will provide lots of relief in itself. Throw in some SILs and maybe some guys jumping on orders and that will go a long way. Won't totally solve the issue but doesn't hurt. The 300 number referenced in Huggy's post likely includes 120 or so regional jets.

Ya, early outs won't make much of a dent, as AirGuardian said, why leave early. I certainly would not expect senior dude to leave early...those dudes have already been through a lot in their careers. I'm just hoping I'm senior enough to bid one of those 55 hour no fly lines they'll be offering in May or June. Well...now that the DOD said we can't travel, maybe I'd rather just take 72 hours reserve lines to sit at home.

Me too! Ya, I was thinking of going Sun N' Fun, wonder how much it will be impacted by all this CV stuff. I see they have a document posted on their website addressing CV. You going to end up out East at all?

SV-80? I gave the HARM office all my graduation certificates when I returned from training. Either way, keep copies of your certificates.

I'm with Tank on this one, I think it will be mostly a thing of the past by the time airshow season really kicks off. In the mean time, NCAA tourney games in Ohio will be played with no spectators...