Karl Hungus

LOL.

Flown with a bunch of former RF-4C, RF-111 , etc guys in the civilian job. Great stories abound. Many of them convey some regret that they didn’t get a “better” (their words, more or less) fighter- F-16, F-15, etc. I tell them that it’s all relative- people would kill to have F-4 and F-111 opportunities these days. Their jaws drop when I describe to them how ridiculously awful modern day AF is, and how they’d find it completely unrecognizable.

yeah, assumed the Blues woulda had a female pilot circa 2010 or so. Surprised it took them so long. Good for her!

Just think how many 11Fs that frees up to work the staffs, 365s to the Deid/Korea, RPAs, etc. Brilliant move.

This. If none of the various airline domiciles are palatable for whatever reason, and you absolutely must commute, FedEx is the clear winner. Getting paid to deadhead around the world to and from an airport of your choosing, while keeping the miles, can be a great deal. You can do this at a surprising level of juniority. Perhaps a UPS guy can chime in with their experiences… my impression is that it’s a better deal at FedEx, though. Of course, the other side of that coin is days away from home. My FedEx buddies make a TON of money and have fantastic work rules… but are also gone way more nights than I am. They deadhead in biz class to Australia, Paris, whatever, fly around, deadhead back, home a week to 10 days later. That’s awesome if you’re a commuter! On the other hand, I manipulate my schedule much like Lord Ratner, dropping all of my trips and rebuilding with easy turns and 1-1s, with lots of deadheads, and mostly for premium. I drive to work. Less than 20 nights total away from home in 2021, with 4 of those being for my annual sims. I average less than 1.33333 (repeating of course) nights away from home per month. I make less money than my FedEx buddies (by a lot in a couple cases) but, overall, I’m home a lot more. A few of my buddies ended up moving to Memphis to gain access to the type of flying I do at my legacy (turns, 1-1s, etc). They hate Memphis but it’s worth it to them for the QoL/pay bump being able to drive to work provides. Some others live in Random City, USA and bid for a week of trips that “overnight” (overday would be more accurate) in their city throughout, so they’re home sleeping while the kids are at school or whatever. That sounds exhausting but again, to each their own. Certainly a niche for everyone. I know Hacker knows all this, more for those still on AD contemplating where to go. Tons of pros and very few cons wherever you end up…. but most definitely a thousand times better than the AD USAF cesspool.

Can’t go wrong with either. Lots of pros and very little cons to both. AA: upgrade is 4 years and decreasing (in general, PHX would take much longer). PHX has been going to new hires. PHX is only the 320. If you can’t get PHX at Indoc, you could bid LGA/LAX 320 and subsequently get PHX 320 at your first vacancy bid, probably max 3-months after Indoc. Lots of AA pilots living in PHX do 320 FO for a few years, commute to DFW/LAX 777/787 FO and/or upgrade to LAX 320 CA, then back to PHX 320 CA when they can hold it. PHX 320 does a decent amount of Hawaii flying if that motivates you. It’s relatively senior on the captain side but there’s so many retirements that the future will look much different. Over half the seniority list is gone by 2026-2027 or so. AA offers widebody options if that motivates you. I don’t foresee a PHX widebody domicile, but who knows. AA work rules (reassignments mostly) lag but that’s largely mitigated by living in base. Best commuter policy in the industry. Can drop to zero with surprising ease, the vocal minority who claims you can’t are either too lazy/scared to try or don’t know how. AA has the worst, most incompetent management team by far. That’s all relative though; AA mgmt is light years better than the toxic frauds across AD USAF that love to call themselves “leaders”. SWA: 10 year upgrade to sit reserve on weekends and holidays in OAK. Much better balance sheet. I’d say SWA management is better, but my SWA buddies say that the old Herb culture is long dead and the new mgmt is not good. Better work rules that incentivize pilots to work hard. SWA pilots are very productive and are compensated well for that. You’ll work way harder as a SWA FO but be paid more for it. Only the 737… it’s not a bad airplane but an entire career on it? Yikes. I have no idea how senior PHX is at SWA. My buddies complain about a “Luke Mafia” and “Kernals” that think they’re still in the AF and can’t let it go. I guess that could be a good or bad thing. There are some threads on the SW forum of APC that would be worth a read. I’d take that stuff with a grain of salt. FWIW, apparently a dozen or so SW pilots left for AA over the past few months. I’m sure some AA guys left for SW. Grass is always greener type thing.

Use your GI Bill for yourself and get your ratings. Have your kids join the ANG and get TA and their own GI Bill. Good luck!

So IMA's are not subject to any sort of mobilization? I thought that was the whole point. They certainly are, in theory. Some positions might be more “vulnerable” than others. I’ve yet to meet an IMA who was involuntarily mobilized, let alone deployed. My particular organization would “deploy” (mobilize) its IMAs to a CONUS location to backfill the AD suckers sent to some third world shithole. Even still, that hasn’t happened in more than two decades. Yep, never deploying again.

Yep. Downside being ineligibility for TriCare Reserve Select, if that’s a motivation.

Different IMA billets have different “minimums”. Some have higher minimum IDT amounts (48 vs 24 is typical). Two IDTs would make up an 8 hour day so it sort of works out to 24 vs 12 “days” of IDTs. You can very much work only half days, or work an afternoon on day 1 of a string of IDTs and a morning on day X to allow for a commute in and out. There’s officially zero travel pay for IDTs, but there’s also an annual critical AFSCs list that allows for some travel pay with your IDTs. Otherwise you’re on your own. Getting paid, for either the travel pay or the IDT itself, is typical AF incompetence. Archaic, non-functioning systems supported by lazy, brain-dead civilians/enlisted folks. Yet I’m supposed to believe we’re gonna actually go to war with the near-peer bogeyman… but I digress. The 14 days of Annual Tour is sort of set up to be: commute out day 1, work days 2-13, commute home day 14. There are ways to split up the AT, and/or combine it with IDTs. AT is 1/30th AD pay/benefits/etc more or less. Travel is always paid for AT. Doesn’t mean the archaic systems are gonna get you paid on time, though. I’d rather telecommute and never step foot on a mil installation again. A lot of this stuff is unit dependent as to what they expect and how flexible they are. There are certainly MPA opportunities if you want to exceed your AT/IDTs. Some people volunteer for those Korea AOC exercises or COCOM duty officer shift work things in addition to their IMA gig… I have no idea if those are good deals or not. Probably not during this COVID insanity. Did I mention the best part of being an IMA- never deploying again?

I was in the same spot as you. Became an IMA and it’s worked out well. Pre-COVID I was able to telecommute about half of my ATs/IDTs yearly, so about half of the 22-24 total mil days I work per year That went to full telecommute under COVID… hopefully it stays that way. It’s a win-win; the AF doesn’t have to pay me for travel/lodging/rental car/per diem, and I don’t have to spend time going to an AF base to do a job I can do almost exclusively from home. Some things (PHA, etc) won’t be telecommute-able, but I can do those at a closer AF facility to my home. My unit doesn’t have weekend work. No such thing as UTAs. Only currency items are the silly BS everyone in the mil wastes their time on. I will go almost three years without putting on a mil uniform. Promotion to 0-5 is more than 90% if you have ACSC done. I live in an airline domicile, so that factors in. If you are willing to live at an ARC location versus an airline domicile, that’s different. Starting on year 2 airline pay, a day working for the mil is at best a wash and most likely a loss compared to what you’d make for your airline. Picking up a single day trip at my airline pays better and is far more enjoyable, but that’s obviously different for everyone. The IMA job itself is just… ok. It’s a means to an end (retirement). An ARC flying job would definitely provide more camaraderie and perhaps more job satisfaction and better scratch the “serve your country” itch if you have it. As we all know, some flying jobs and airframes are better than others. A motivating factor for me was the fact that I will never deploy again unless I choose to. When a deployment to be the AF Liaison to Vail Resorts to ops check their mil appreciation programs on-mountain for a season pops up, I’m your guy! Anything less, GFY. Like I said, never deploying again.

Bizarre double-down. I must have missed where he asked for advice from “ U2/United pilots who love name-dropping their astronaut buddies and humble-bragging their air show experience” in addition to folks from NK, JB, and F9. He must have edited that out at some point after your silly nitpicking. And yet, even after your holier-than-thou nitpicking, and all the inside knowledge you have from your single-digit seniority friends and friends in hiring, you didn’t offer any actual advice (other than the weird IATA thing). Enjoy your last word to follow. Whether you accept my feedback is of no ultimate consequence to me, but I certainly found the exchange insightful and mildly amusing. Cheers. SPAWNmaster: I’ll be transparent that the only real advice I can provide is to seek out this information on APC. Good luck, I think you’ll have no problem getting hired by any of the three you mentioned!

A strange criticism. The guy asked for feedback from folks at three specific airlines- those who could provide said feedback would certainly know what their respective IATA code was. Critiquing him for asking for feedback on this website in the first place makes more sense. Probably not going to get much out of this place. Better off going to APC.

Go to APC and read posts from the United forum around 2012-2014. Jeff Smisek in his prime. Doom and gloom, sky is falling, bankruptcy right around the corner, liquidation inevitable, unrecoverable death spiral. Now, United is an industry darling. What changed? A new management team. If APC had existed, you’d read the same from a theoretical Delta forum in the mid-2000s. The industry is cyclical. A management change at AA could/will make a huge difference. Some think that change will happen sooner than later. A Richard Anderson or Glen Hauenstein type hire could turn AA into a monster. Youngest fleet of the majors and cheap hubs in areas of massive growth. Or, Doug Parker could run AA into bankruptcy. No matter where you end up, it will be far better than Active Duty. That place is a toxic cesspool.

All true re: Delta. In Delta’s defense, they have strong work rules in regards to manning their widebody international flying. Routes that require 4 pilots are done with 2 CAs and 2 FOs, whereas it’s done with 1 CA and 3 FOs at others. Creates more widebody captain positions than you’d otherwise expect from the relative lack of widebody aircraft. Delta (management) hates this. Management tried to include a provision in the last contract allowing it to paint the 49% owned JVs in Delta colors, with a tiny “operated by AeroMexico /Virgin /Dmitri’sVodkaAir/ etc” on the side. If Delta could get away with it, it would outsource everything and just be a holding company and an online ticket broker. Everything is cyclical. Go to an airline that lets you drive to work and hope for the best.

Sure. Plenty of ways to get an AD retirement. Some, like going to ACSC in Montgomery, aren’t at all appealing. Sounds like it worked out for JS. I’m guessing the proximity to his/her family and the lack of moving made it palatable.

I turned down IDE in residence in order to separate from AD a few years ago... I can’t imagine taking the pay and QoL cut necessary to drop mil leave, move my family to cesspool Montgomery, AL for a year, and attend a fake indoctrination school after a couple years at my airline job. It would be a serious decline in both compensation and time off. Was it difficult to take the program seriously?

Eliminating the bonus completely would actually be pretty smart. Since they’re unwilling to raise it to a level at which it would actually change someone’s mind from leaving to staying on a large scale, might as well get rid of it completely. The only people (for the most part) who take it were going to stay anyway... free money for them. Might as well waste that money on other Defense Industrial Complex garbage.

Saw a documentary on these things back in the mid-80s.

This. For those who lament the fact that AF management (and your elected politicians) don’t care about the impact of a pilot retention crisis on national security and the likely potential for an increase in deaths/mishaps... well, it’s because they really don’t care. We won’t lose wars against near-peers because we won’t get into them, just approach them enough to scare folks into more spending. That’s by design. If a few dozen pilots mort because of abbreviated/inadequate training, well, America at large doesn’t care. It’s not about winning wars or providing national security, at least not as the primary goal. You’re but a peon in the massive jobs program that is the Defense Industrial Complex, too big to fail. As others have said... once you understand that the purpose of the Department of Defense is to spend taxpayer money, everything starts to make sense. Life is far, far better with active duty AF in the rear view mirror.

Yikes. Reading this thread (amongst others) makes me really glad I went to Cat B IMA.

Same reason the US is still in Afghanistan, with no end state in mind and zero incentive to ever win. ForeverWar feeds the jobs program that is the Defense Industrial Complex. As another poster pointed out- once you realize the purpose of the DoD is to spend taxpayer money, everything starts to make sense.

You won’t be getting a “white jet to Tampa”. They won’t exist after next summer.

There’s a form to fill out, 1881 I think. You just need to cite the applicable regulation and paragraph designating that area as CZTE, and then explain in plain English what you did. Retroactive should be ok... it usually took my finance several months to process, but they were used to processing the 1881s. We usually attached something as proof, like CED orders, flight orders, 781s, DTS voucher, etc. Not sure how it works going back years though. YMMV.

You’re missing the point. It’s not about efficient use of taxpayer money. It’s about feeding the beast that is the Defense Industrial Complex. It’s not about winning wars, it’s a jobs program... too big to fail.