BitteEinBit

What the AF "Leadership" needs to realize is that officers at the tactical level should be focused on things tactical. Do you want to know what the leadership is stressing during the "Welcome Brief" for new CGOs?? "Get your masters done, do PME via correspondence," and it becomes the culture of our youngest officers to focus more on self-serving actions than the mission of the squadron. Commanders are only relaying information they are getting from higher levels on "what it takes to get promoted." And they are right. The Air Force really doesn't seem to care much about how well we do our jobs...just that we have masters degrees, and that we look good trying to do our jobs. That literally seems to be the focus. And what we end up seeing are people doing everything they can to make sure they stay promotable instead of doing their primary jobs well. In today's Air Force, they can do a mediocre job, but with a little wordsmithing on an OPR they sound like rockstars! Add in PME and AAD, and they are golden! I'm not at all saying AAD and PME isn't important. It is important that we know how DoD operates and, in some rare cases, an AAD can help facilitate new ideas on how we conduct business. We stay so busy that what we actually get for the money invested in AADs is operators who are not operating at their full tactical potential who spent the first 3-5 years of their career focused on getting a (in many cases) worthless online degree so they can help the AF stats in looking like the most educated force. I can't tell you how many times people disappear from work for a week at a time because they have a masters paper due. Some are even taking leave to do it. Really? Taking leave to finish PME? That is a direct failure of leadership. Just casually ask any CGO in your flying squadron what their priorities are in the squadron and they'll tell you 1) Finish Masters/PME 2) Do my additional duty (scheduling, tactics, training) 3) Fly. Of course I grew up during the Jumper years, so our commanders back then stressed 1) Know your aircraft! 2) Do PME in correspondence if you want to go in residence (although we still sent people without it done via correspondence) 3) Get a Masters. Of course things weren't as accelerated back then. Pin-on rates for Major didn't happen until 12 years or so. Now, eight years into your career you are considered for promotion to Major. After a year of UPT (probably after sitting casual for 6 months) and another 6 months of FTU, probably 2-3 months of MQT before you're really ready you are two years into your career and now only have 6 years to finish masters, SOS, and get a job where you can get face time with a commander who can ensure your promotion....and we haven't even talked about flying and deploying yet. Air Force, that is your problem...and until you fix the culture, all of your talented pilots who joined to fly will punch out and use their talents elsewhere, and you'll be left with self-serving, square-filling officers who really aren't as good as they could be at anything tactical. I say this in general...I think MOST of our rated force is very talented, but I also did my time in white jets, and I saw what we let through when we lowered the standards in order to increase pilot production in the mid 2000s. Great idea, but we've already seen that the AF doesn't honor contracts. They guarantee nothing other than the needs of the AF. Air Force: "10-year ADSC: You can't quit, but we can RIF you. Good luck!"

It has never been a secret that selective continuation was a "as needed" basis, in addition, I think we all agree that we need to make cuts to remain within our means, but make those cuts SMARTLY. Don't just use "if member is within 5 years of retirement by the board date" as a means to determine if you're going to cut people. I hate to make this a rated vs non-rated issue, but we are the Air Force, and flying is one of our primary missions. Personnel officers and Finance officers are important to our mission, but can I cut an FGO from those career fields and and probably replace them relatively quickly with a younger one and still do the mission? Yes, very easily. On the other hand, while we have very talented young pilots, it is a little more difficult to replace 15 years of flying experience and expect that you will be as effective and efficient in your mission. It takes a while to make a fighter pilot/flight lead and a seasoned aircraft commander on a C-17/C-130 etc. In addition, we rely pretty heavily on those experienced pilots to bring up the younger ones. So, letting rated officers (both pilots and navs) go just because they aren't within 5 years of retirement as of 7 March is not cutting SMARTLY...it is just "cutting to get my numbers to where my boss told me to get them." Forget operating within our "means" for a minute, if the reductions are "affecting units" then maybe you're not operating within your REQUIREMENTS. Yes, I know there were specific AFSCs that were retained, but lets just think about the dynamics of one specific AFSC that appears to be adequately manned: the 11M. Have you thought about where T-38 trained pilots have been going over the past year or so? Thats right, they've been getting 11M assignments. If there is a projected fighter pilot shortage, do you think they are going to fill them with brand new UPT graduates, or will they (as they have in the past) have a fighter crossflow board? Where do you think they are going to get a lot of those crossflows? I'll take a guess...since they want need experience, they'll probably come from those T-38 trained pilots from that 11M career field that you keep cutting because TODAY it appears to be overmanned. There is a reason it appears to be overmanned, think about it. AFPC, start thinking about manning 5 years down the road in addition to fixing your current relatively minor manning issue. You're going to have pretty major manning issues 5 years down the road because of how these drawdown intiatives are being mismanaged. Your 11Ms are going to be needed as long as we have ground forces in Afghanistan which will most likely be the case 5 years down the road. Don't just think about getting rid of 2000 officers by the end of FY12...Think about the messages you're sending with how you're making these cuts, think about the message that was sent to you during the VSP mismanagement earlier this year, think about how many of those "overmanned" (overworked) pilots may not stay as long as you think they will, think about the airline hiring spree...or better yet, just THINK. Bit

The DoDD spells out what is the standard...The key phrase there is "shall NORMALLY". I would think that anything other than the stardard would be a requirement to notify the SECDEF...thats why I'd let the congressional inquiry figure that out. I would hope that some officers' involuntary separation after 15-16 years of service, with nothing to show, would be worth more than a casual conversation in the hallway at the Pentagon. But then again, it wouldn't surprise me if thats how it actually happened...

Interesting...the SECAF used "within 5 years of retirement" for the board consideration when the DoDD 1320.8 says "within 6 years of retirement"... Ref: DoDD 1320.6 Section 4: 4.3. Continuation of Officers Serving in the Grade of O-4. Commissioned officers on the Active Duty List who hold the grade O-4, who are subject to discharge under Section 632 of reference (b), shall normally be selected for continuation by selection boards convened for that purpose if the officer will qualify for retirement under Section 3911, 6323, or 8911 of reference (b) within six years of the date of such continuation. The Secretaries of the Military Departments concerned may, in unusual circumstances, discharge involuntarily such officers in accordance with Section 632 of reference (b) after notifying the Secretary of Defense of the rationale for this action. The involuntary discharge shall not be used to circumvent legal proceedings, show-cause procedures, or release an affected officer who is within two years of qualifying for retirement under Section 3911, 6323, or 8911 of reference (b). Of course, the catch all is that it is "needs of the Air Force" and "determined by the SECAF" Unfortunately in this case, the SECAF used 5 years to retirement from the date of the board, when DoDD 1320.6 uses within 6 years of retirement as of the date of continuation, which AFI 36-2405 defines the continuation period as normally starting on the 1st day of the 7th month after the board results are approved. That would put the 5-years to retirement date as of 1 Dec 11. Ref: AFI 36-2405, para 7.11.3 7.11.3. Normally, the continuation period begins on the 1st day of the 7th month from the approval of the board results. For officers being further continued, the continuation period begins on the first day following the completion of their initial continuation period. For officers who are in the retirement sanctuary or retirement eligible, the continuation period normally begins on the first day following the 20-year DOS Is there a lawyer in the house??? Was the SECDEF notified as required? Might be worth a congressional inquiry.... I only studied Lawyerology for one semester in college...I'm just sayin' Edited for reference correction

Does anyone know if it will be only an H squadron, or are they going to make it a mixed squadron with J bubbas as well?

It is sad that the Air Force "Leadership" has really lost touch with its people...what is even more sad is that they don't know it...

Oh, come on! You can't tell a story like that and not give the important details...WAS SHE HOT? Because really, that makes all the difference in how the IP responds to her question: IP: "Uh, we'll probably push you back regardless..." IP: "We might be able to work something out...why don't you get on my schedule so we can talk about it"

Does anyone remember the time when an O-7 or O-6 gave an order and people followed it? What is happening with the leadership and discipline in our ranks? I haven't been to the Deid since they went to wearing PT gear all the time, so I can't fully appreciate what is going on there. But, from an outsider's perspective, it appears that the leadership there has completely lost control and no one respects them enough to just wear the belt. For an O-6 WG/CC or CV to have to send out an e-mail to other O-6s on base telling them to organize shifts so they can monitor a simple policy like "reflective belt wear" tells me that someone does not have command of that base or they have WAY too much free time. I remember a time when an O-6 would tell his commanders "Handle this" and the commanders took care of their own people. But now we are posting commanders at chow hall and BX entrances to enforce basewide reflective belt wear? Seriously? Someone please tell me this is a joke! Someone tell me that deployed commanders have more important things to worry about than that....tell me that deployed commanders aren't turning tired and hungry people away from the chowhall for not having a reflective belt. I thought I've seen it all...

Well, the good news is that we already have organizations like MPF and Finance leaning forward reducing operating hours/saving energy costs...the bad news is that we don't pay them any less.... (sarcasm)

Remember that those numbers in the ISR/UAS are based on the "now" and requirements for "current operations" That was the point I've been making all along. When the "current requirements" are no longer requirements, the AF is going to have to figure out what to do with all of them. Remember, it isn't the AF driving the requirement "today." So, like I said, you're relatively secure but not immune (the original point). The "most secure" are the ones with 10-12 years in service NOW. Everyone else is relatively safe today, but not necessarily 18 months down the road depending on the elections. Don't expect a huge RIF like the mid 90s or mid 00s, but the AF will need to figure out what to do with the overages in ISR/UAS once the requirement goes down...and it will. They aren't going to keep everyone in ISR/UAS to fly the flag pole just because they trained you there, especially the UPT trained bubbas. There will be life after the UAS eventually for most (not all) rated bubbas...believe it. You can revive this thread in 18 months and tell me I was wrong...otherwise "today" we'll agree to disagree about future manning.

I wouldn't necessarily say pilots are safe...the Air Force is going to have to figure out what to do with all of those ISR/UAS pilots they're getting ready for this war that is probably getting ready to end if the new not-so-pro-military admin gets elected and has its way. Thats the problem with focusing more on the "now" vs "future needs." The "now" changes pretty frequently, and it takes time/money/effort to gin up for the "now" every time it changes. I hear there is a plan for those ISR/UAS bubbas...I just haven't heard it yet. I'd say, if you're a pilot with 10-12+ years in service right now you're relatively safe (but not immune) since more than enough of the 94-98 rated bubbas took the VSP...add to that the lack of rated slots in the early 90s to begin with and it should be no secret why rated staff billets are hard to fill these days. Also, regarding personnel cuts, the Air Force has changed its mind on the 307,000 end strength number and is now trying to get funding for the additional 20,000 unfunded bodies we currently have to make our new proposed end strength of 330,000. I'm not completely sure personnel is where the cuts are going to be made at least for the Air Force. No new toys for you this Christmas! My 2 cents...

Dude! I seriously choked (sts) on my drink! Still coughing/laughing...LMAO

I've been out of the Herk for a while...but YGBFKM! They were doing this same sh*t 5 years ago! I understand for the first time deployers, but why is it that no one has yet figured out that air crews and their MX/support folks have been there done that 5+ times already and they aren't FNGs coming into theater? What gets me the most is that all the O-6 types that were squadron CCs and DOs back then when we were bitching about doing it 5 years ago are the ones running the show now and STILL doing the same sh*t that annoyed us back then! What has changed since I was here 4 months ago that you have to send me to a bunch of briefings about services that I ignored the last time I was there?! Could it be to re-emphasize the reflective belt or PT wear policy? Perhaps it is the white socks at the DFAC policy? No? The flip flops to the Cadillac policy? Because who could ever forget such ridiculous rules from the LAST time I was here.... Why can't flying units just be an expeditionary tenant units (ETUs) so we don't have to put up with the BS anymore. I'd even live in a tent again just to not have to deal with being treated like a 5 year old. AIR FORCE: "Mr Pilot, why are you getting out?" MR PILOT: "Because I graduated Kindergarten 25 years ago..."

That guy is going to be a General one day....

Toro is black??

That guy's name is "Chick," no wonder he's pissed...

They keep implying a "fear" of the OSI...is there something I'm missing here? Are we supposed to be scared of OSI?? They make it seem like OSI is the "Gestapo" and people fear them or they disappear.... (Just in case I disappear, tell my wife I love her) EDIT: I should learn to spell

I was on my second MR flight at Little Rock just after my PIQ/PMQ check on a simulated overwater navigation checkride. We were westbound towards OKC just over Tulsa when we heard numerous airliners talking to Memphis Center getting recalled or told to divert. This went on for about 20 minutes and then there was complete radio silence. We thought something was going on at Memphis Center and didn't realize it was a national crisis. Finally we did a radio check just to make sure we hadn't lost contact with Center when they told us to contact our command post to "see what they want to do with you." We asked what the problem was and they just said "Contact your Command Post, there is a national emergency in progress." We couldn't even imagine the carnage that was underway in New York and Washington. We thought maybe there was an assassination or a nuke had gone off. Curious, we contacted CP and asked what the problem was but weren't given any details. They just told us to come back "via the most direct routing, and max forward speed." We land at Little Rock, pull into the chocks, shut down and a crew chief comes up to the flight deck and says these words exactly "You're not going to believe this...two planes flew into the WTC and knocked them over...and another one blew up the Pentagon." Planes "knocking over" buildings just didn't sound realistic but we knew SOMETHING had happened. As we were walking back to the SQ we could see THREATCON DELTA procedures in effect. We knew something was wrong. It really was hard to believe what I was seeing on TV...but we knew right then that life as we knew it was getting ready to change.

They start to lose credibility when they promise something will be posted by a certain time and 5 hours later it isn't posted... They definitely lost an opportunity to get it out in the mainstream media if that was their intent.

Have they been dropping C-130Js to Ramstein yet? I know Ramstein is scheduled to get the first J in 2nd quarter of FY09. Also, are they still dropping Es to Ramstein as well?

Huggyu2, its amazing how that happens at EVERY base over there. I think I figured out why: Most MAF aircrew, maintenance and other squadron support functions end up deploying outside of the AEF cycle. For instance, in the Herk community, it had been 4 on 4 off. The AEF weenies do 4 on 15 off (I think). They send three Chiefs per support function to manage that function, but once the function is set up, what else do they have to do?!? I don't know about you guys, but when I wasn't flying, I was searching for things to do. Perhaps they do the same...and enforcing regs is probably all they can find to do. It's amazing how the people who spend 4 months of an AEF rotation in the desert are making all the rules for those who spend MOST of every year there. I always thought it was funny how every 4 months we'd deploy to the desert and have to sit through the same personnel briefings as if it was the first time we ever deployed. Five years of this and we still don't have it quite right yet. But...who am I. My only job is to fly the mission and play the "desert girlfriend" game....

You opened up a can of worms with this thread! I'll never forget the time at the Deid we were on ALPHA alert with the ALPHA alert van. Since we were on call for the quick takeoff, we considered ourselves "Emergency Response" and parked in front of the chow hall in the "Emergency response vehicles only" parking lot..which was completely empty by the way. No! No rational thinking allowed at the Deid. Wouldn't you know it, when we come back outside after our fine Deid dinner, the Security Forces managed to BOOT the vehicle because we weren't considered an emergency response vehicle. This was at the back end of a 120-day and I was already tired of the Deid BS anyway. Long story short, I had a few choice words for the female LT who responded to my call to the LE desk to get the "F*cking boot off my van." She in turn informed me that I would get a citation and this incident would probably make the "police blotter" the next day. I responded by saying "Great, tell the whole base how the security forces contributed to the war effort by disabling the medevac aircrew alert vehicle," (in so many words) and that she can take the hit if we can't take off on time because our vehicle was disabled. I didn't get a citation and I don't think the incident ended up in the blotter. I probably could have handled it better, but it was the END of my 120 day and that just took me over the edge. My understanding is that the sign in that parking lot now says "Emergency Response and Alert vehicles only..." I like that quote TacAirCoug "Winning the war on terror, one reflective belt at a time"

T-1 Rides are no longer "Dollar Rides" but "Handle Rides" for a nice big bottle of whatever...with a handle. Alcoholic IPs.... Pilot training is getting so expensive.

Nice! I'm sure that was Kandyland (Khandahar) because you can see the mountain to the north of the field when the aircraft passes and I remember being on the ground at Khandahar and seeing those guys take off and make their turn out at what looked like no higher than 50ft. That was pretty bada$$!

Regarding promotions, lack of PME is a clean kill, but don't forget your official records at Randolph. Too many people depend on the records kept at their local MPF as a sufficient records review. The records that are at your MPF are not your official records. In other words, while your local MPF records might be in order (probably not if you're at Dyess, but thats another story), the ones that really count are the ones on file at AFPC. You are authorized permissive TDY once a year to check your official records at Randolph. Those are the records the promotion board will see, and if they are not in order, you will not get promoted, PME or no PME. Essentially you're making sure that all of your medals (Achievement and above) are posted in your records, ensure all OPRs and training reports are posted and that the dates on the OPRs don't leave any gaps between reports. Also ensure that all of your personal data is up to date on your SURF to include job titles (current and past), PME, flying hours, current ratings, etc. The good folks at AFPC can help you and answer any questions you might have. To get to the records review office in case you don't know, enter the front doors of the AFPC building at Randolph and head towards the back right of the lobby, take that hall to the right and it will turn left. Go down the LOOOOOONG hallway and it is the last door on your right before the hallway turns left again. Take advantage of that free leave to Randolph, check your records and then go have a beer or two or three on the Riverwalk. Every one I've known to get passed over has had at least SOMETHING wrong with their records. Sorry for the long geeky exec post, but hopefully some of you will take advantage... Cheers!