BashiChuni

"He who knows only his own side of the case knows little of that. His reasons may be good, and no one may have been able to refute them. But if he is equally unable to refute the reasons on the opposite side, if he does not so much as know what they are, he has no ground for preferring either opinion"

oh ousted? not western backed CIA coup overthrow? interesting

What also happened in 2014?

Where’s the signed, ratified treaty to defend Ukraine? I actually produce sources. It’s a proven fact the US promised to not advance nato via the sec state James baker. Don’t be ignorant.

I’m not justifying it. I’m telling you how we got here. And how we could have avoided it

I have receipts. What do you have? https://https://nsarchive.gwu.edu/briefing-book/russia-programs/2017-12-12/nato-expansion-what-gorbachev-heard-western-leaders-early.gwu.edu/briefing-book/russia-programs/2017-12-12/nato-expansion-what-gorbachev-heard-western-leaders-early

THE TOLD DOESNT WORK AT ABQ! - every UPT FAIP.

Act of war and provoking are two separate issues. “Unprovoked”. Sure. look I think Russia overrated. But they definitely were reacting to something, which was articulated by yours truly in a masterful way above. https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-tucker-carlson-show/id1719657632?i=1000657058513 first 10 min of tuckers podcasts lays it out further. Jeffery sacks explains it well.

not even close. why does the west think ukraine SHOULDNT be outside the russian orbit?! fuck the entire central and south american countries are in the US orbit

any other fucking brain busters @raimius?

ukraine is a simple rook in the geopolitical chess game played by the west post WWII. a chess game where the west has demonstrated strong opening moves but disastrous long term strategic thinking. no one in the west, NATO, or the EU gives one flying fuck about ukraine or its people. they are a means to a end. to answer your question russia invaded after seeing nato (US) and the cia fucking around and finding out in the ukraine. "For years, the Kremlin made it emphatically clear that inviting Ukraine to join NATO would cross a red line that threatened Russia’s vital security interests." "Evidence grew in recent years that the United States had begun to treat Ukraine as a NATO ally in all but name. Steps included pouring nearly $3 billion in “security assistance” (primarily weaponry) into the country since 2014." "Predictably, such conduct ultimately produced a geopolitical explosion. U.S. and NATO officials used Ukraine as a strategic pawn against Russia and are now fuming with outrage at Moscow’s decision to go to war. Russia’s invasion was indeed a horrid overreaction, but it was far from being unprovoked. The Ukrainian people, unfortunately, are the ones paying a high price in blood for the gullibility of their country’s leaders and the shocking arrogance of U.S. leaders." https://www.cato.org/commentary/washington-helped-trigger-ukraine-war# standing by for "the CATO institute is a secret KGB run dis/mis/trans-information campaign! "The split between Washington and both Paris and Berlin about admitting Ukraine to NATO emerged clearly in 2008 when President George W. Bush lobbied ferociously for extending such an invitation. French and German leaders firmly opposed that step at the NATO summit. In her memoir, former Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice recalled that German Chancellor Angela Merkel was especially outspoken, dismissing Ukraine as a “corrupt mess” and warning that a membership offer would dangerously provoke Russia. The allied opposition held, and the best that Bush could come away with was a summit declaration affirming that “someday” Ukraine would become a NATO member. " https://www.cato.org/commentary/making-ukraine-nato-member-all-name standing by for "Angela Merkel is a puppet of putin!"

it is true and has been confirmed by both sides. stop spreading misinformation.

you are picking which promises you want to be honored. we promised the Russians no more NATO expansion east. You never addressed that.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/ar-BB1n6Myr weak.

was that promise voted on in the senate and formalized in a treaty? or was it a legally non-binding agreement? is ukraine a part of nato?

except you're not. snap.

nato expanding up to the borders of russia was provocation.

1. there is zero need for ukraine to join nato. it's incendiary and serves no purpose. would the US be upset if canada or mexico joined BRICS or the warsaw pact? to answer your question...possibly, but no way to know. i think he would have invaded before ukraine joined NATO (such as present day conditions). 2. ironic. generally yes, but historically when has the US kept promises? also which promise are you going to reference? "U.S. Secretary of State James Baker’s famous “not one inch eastward” assurance about NATO expansion in his meeting with Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev on February 9, 1990, was part of a cascade of assurances about Soviet security given by Western leaders to Gorbachev and other Soviet officials throughout the process of German unification in 1990 and on into 1991, according to declassified U.S., Soviet, German, British and French documents"

NATO didn't need any more members...for what purpose? hope hundreds of thousands of ukranian lives were worth it. foolish. certainly not a "unprovoked" invasion.

"The background was that President Putin declared in the autumn of 2021, and actually sent a draft treaty that they wanted NATO to sign, to promise no more NATO enlargement. That was what he sent us. And was a pre-condition for not invade Ukraine. Of course we didn't sign that." "So he went to war to prevent NATO, more NATO, close to his borders" - NATO Secretary General Jens Stoltenberg 07 Sep 2023 https://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/opinions_218172.htm

what does the Lord say?

there needs to be serious prison time.

the only side that needs to re-equip and re-arm ain't the russian side.