Bring Back:

[slacker]

E6B whiz wheels. AF Form 70s. Ban FalconView. Cut up your own damn TPCs and make some shit happen by looking out the window.

[JarheadBoom]

A renewed focus on the Air Force's actual mission.

[BFM this]

Since somone mentioned Rosie Roads:

NAS Bermuda!

Or, in keeping with this thread's track: Kindley AFB.

[Guest schwabbeau]

Have you been waiting 3 years to reply so the "still no chutes" would be funny?

You caught me. I didn't even think of it like that. I guess I need to start adding the 'sts' to my posts.

Schwabbeau get to work!!

Hey, gotta find a laugh where I can. The 'funny radio calls' thread got some laughs between classes. Besides, if I don't check out the forum, I'll have to do something productive like work on my paper.

[Hvydvr]

Your cute little video proves the point there---pretty flashy...no content.

The stuff I listed were the tools of the trade before the almighty computer and shoe clerks with email accounts that could levy a requirement for you to do annual information assurance training and all that other queep.

We don't do fix-to-fixes anymore---we ask how to spell it. Anyone think Lemay or Olds would be bitching about the time to load that data card or taking an extra moment to make sure the data was "winded"? Yeah right. How f'ing gay is all that stuff?

I remember when you could get in a fight in the club and have nothing whatsoever happen. Come to think of it, that time for me started at Willie so bring that back too. As far as I'm concerned, the old Air Force ended when folks stopped asking where the booze and the party was at and wondering where the salad bar and the gym were. And people stopped asking for booze and parties about the same time pilots stopped using whiz wheels and looking out the windows and instead began to get carpal tunnel to do a level change...so FU2.

[Champ Kind]

As far as I'm concerned, the old Air Force ended when folks stopped asking where the booze and the party was at and wondering where the salad bar and the gym were. And people stopped asking for booze and parties about the same time pilots stopped using whiz wheels and looking out the windows and instead began to get carpal tunnel to do a level change...so FU2.

Missed those days by a long shot, but I'd knock out a fix-to-fix or two and hand-chum a chart every semi-annual period to see those days come back.

[slacker]

As far as I'm concerned, the old Air Force ended when folks stopped asking where the booze and the party was at and wondering where the salad bar and the gym were. And people stopped asking for booze and parties about the same time pilots stopped using whiz wheels and looking out the windows and instead began to get carpal tunnel to do a level change...so FU2.

Lighten up Francis.

The extinction of whiz wheels and fix to fixes have nothing to do with the demise of booze and the rise of salad bars and gyms. I share your sentiments on the later, but hand chumming charts from the big book sucked ass, and I don't want to do it again.

[Guest]

We don't do fix-to-fixes anymore---we ask how to spell it. Anyone think Lemay or Olds would be bitching about the time to load that data card or taking an extra moment to make sure the data was "winded"? Yeah right. How f'ing gay is all that stuff?

Shack. Now it can be a major deal when you tell a guy to anchor 030/10 perpendicular + 30 degrees to the target

Guys don't look at their maps unless it is a moving map on a display. They look for the target by slaving a sensor to coordinates or by "dipping the nose" to see what is under the TD container. No one looks at wind because they think the system and/or the weapons will correct themselves. We saw how wrong that can be during the first weeks of OIF when the winds were howling and most of the guys who were dropping LGBs (in all aircraft types) missed downwind because their training was all about keeping the targeting pod centered on the target in the MOA. Important things are missed when the fundamentals are skipped...things like targets.

I remember when you could get in a fight in the club and have nothing whatsoever happen.

Fucking A. To be fair, you might get in a bit of trouble but the consequences were not severe. Definitely not career ending and often times the opposite effect.

The extinction of whiz wheels and fix to fixes have nothing to do with the demise of booze and the rise of salad bars and gyms.

In the absence of empirical data it is impossible to know if your statement is true. The point is more that the focus has shifted with the advent of technology, increase in "productivity" and hence more free time to ask people to do stupid shit like "be healthy."

I share your sentiments on the later [sic], but hand chumming charts from the big book sucked ass, and I don't want to do it again.

Chumming master maps used to be done by Lts and young Capts in the NAVO shop and served the purpose of teaching them a whole lot about what was on those maps. It was a good thing for me when I was a young/new guy and I always did my own maps when I went to a new place because it taught me a lot about where I was going to fly. I cannot imagine it would be bad for a new guy today.

[bagasticks]

We don't do fix-to-fixes anymore---we ask how to spell it. Anyone think Lemay or Olds would be bitching about the time to load that data card or taking an extra moment to make sure the data was "winded"? Yeah right. How f'ing gay is all that stuff?

I remember when you could get in a fight in the club and have nothing whatsoever happen. Come to think of it, that time for me started at Willie so bring that back too. As far as I'm concerned, the old Air Force ended when folks stopped asking where the booze and the party was at and wondering where the salad bar and the gym were. And people stopped asking for booze and parties about the same time pilots stopped using whiz wheels and looking out the windows and instead began to get carpal tunnel to do a level change...so FU2.

all good points. . . but, i'm betting Olds would have used an FMS/NAV database if equipped. My theory on clubs and base-boozing, is that it all went to crap when the DUI's and ID checks came to. I can remember when the clubs on base would bus folks (read: towny-skanks)in and there would be a line around the joint to get in. The sky-cops would even take a drunk to his room, no questions asked.

Fast Forward 15 years. .at UPT some dudes i know got pickled out in town and made the call to walk instead of drive back to base, got picked up for public intoxication and nearly removed from training until some reservist IP called BS. .

As far as the original intent of this thread: I would like to bring back the barracks-rats of yesteryear, its been a long time since i've been walking the halls in billeting 0600 only to be greeted by some old dirty-leg battle-skank exiting the(only)locker room after her morning/crap and shower. . .anyone else remember these girls, true gems, that lived in the barracks and just moved from room to room?

Edited August 24, 2010 by bagasticks

[Guest]

My theory on clubs and base-boozing, is that it all went to crap when the DUI's and ID checks came to.

The big change started when this and this were first announced.

[Danny Noonin]

We don't do fix-to-fixes anymore

By "we" you mean "you." Some people still do them. they are not difficult.

[Guest]

By "we" you mean "you." Some people still do them. they are not difficult.

[slacker]

Chumming master maps used to be done by Lts and young Capts in the NAVO shop and served the purpose of teaching them a whole lot about what was on those maps. It was a good thing for me when I was a young/new guy and I always did my own maps when I went to a new place because it taught me a lot about where I was going to fly. I cannot imagine it would be bad for a new guy today.

I'm pretty sure you don't have to put a “[sic]” inside a quote box- everything in their [sic] should be [sic]. I fairly certain it’s implied.

In the absence of empirical data it is impossible to know if your statement is true. The point is more that the focus has shifted with the advent of technology, increase in "productivity" and hence more free time to ask people to do stupid shit like "be healthy."

I actually have a power point briefing complete with metrics that proves that demise of E6B’s did not cause the rise in shitty o’clubs or salad bars. It’s 700Mb so I can’t email it or post it or move it. You’ll just have to take my word on it.

I wonder if bomber crews in WW2 were nostalgic for the days of yore before the Norden bombsight made bombing so easy. Or pilots before them longed for the simplicity of an engine before the radial.

I am always suspicious of change, but not all change is bad.

[bagasticks]

By "we" you mean "you." Some people still do them. they are not difficult.

you're right! below taken from the -1:

1. windows, flight instruments, and airmanship - disregard, while looking down at FMS keypad (P,CP)

2. DIR softkey - press (P,CP)

3. fix - enter into scratchpad, ie. FAG069/69 (P,CP)

4. ENT softkey - press (P,CP)

5. Nutsack - resume thumbing (one's own) restlessly for the rest of the flight (P,CP)

Edited August 24, 2010 by bagasticks

[Guest CharlieDontSurf]

There's a great idea. Along the same lines- Maybe we should bring back word processors or better yet- typewritters and carbon paper- now that would be great.

I just don't understand why someone wouldn't want a better airplane and would purposely choose an outdated airplane.

...and by better airplane you mean the computer automated c-130 shaped beer can also known as the C-130 J model? Automation and full computer integration does not make "better airplanes" it makes lazy pilots.

Legacy Hercs Fo' life!!!

edited for clarity

Edited August 25, 2010 by CharlieDontSurf

[slacker]

Legacy Hercs Fo' life!!!

enjoy.

[Guest]

I wonder if bomber crews in WW2 were nostalgic for the days of yore before the Norden bombsight made bombing so easy. Or pilots before them longed for the simplicity of an engine before the radial.

To be clear, the technology I'm talking about was not better weapons/nav equipment/engines/weapons delivery computers. I was talking about flight planning related technology that caused us to lose something valuable.

I like new shit in the jet. However, a solid understanding of the basics (like how to go from my current position to some other position represented as a rad/dist...by turning immediately instead of typing first) allows a pilot to maximize the benefits of technology instead of depending on it for all their SA. Unfortunately, tasks that used to have more than one benefit (like chumming a map) can cause a loss of capability or general SA when they are overtaken by technology. It is up to us to make sure we train properly so we don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

BTW, the WWII bombers still had a hi-anus CEP even with the Norden bombsight.

[matmacwc]

Poll: Does the average baseops user know what CEP means?

[slacker]

I like new shit in the jet. However, a solid understanding of the basics (like how to go from my current position to some other position represented as a rad/dist...by turning immediately instead of typing first) allows a pilot to maximize the benefits of technology instead of depending on it for all their SA. Unfortunately, tasks that used to have more than one benefit (like chumming a map) can cause a loss of capability or general SA when they are overtaken by technology. It is up to us to make sure we train properly so we don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.

I agree.

[sky_king]

Poll: Does the average baseops user know what CEP means?

Not until I googled it. What would I have done without google?

[discus]

Poll: Does the average baseops user know what CEP means?

Depends on if you are Herb or Carn.

[nsplayr]

Or if you paid attention...they taught CEP at nav school when we were doing airdrops; not sure what you plane drivers learn. May have been because my flt/cc was a buff dude, YMMV.

Bring back: lingerie parties at the O-Club. So far before my time that it seems mythical and awesome. Also John Boyd jabbing generals in the chest with his finger in the Pentagon (great bio).

Edited August 25, 2010 by Toro
Spell check to prevent NSFW tag

[brickhistory]

Poll: Does the average baseops user know what CEP means?

Awww, you airplane guys are funny.

CEP with a Mk 12A, now THAT's a CEP...

[TheBlueMax]

Bring back Cannon!

[FourFans]

Bring back the days when the old heads didn't sit around and complain, they sat around and figured out how to make it better...and then executed.

By the way, you can have your old herk for life. I've flown both. The new one is better. Understanding the basics is critical regardless of what airplane you fly (shack on Rainman's quote).

FF