Pilot Physician Program

[Spartacus]

Ok, so here is a really weird questions, but one that I think is interesting. A lot of cadets at my Det want to be pilots, but a few of them are decided to go to Med school to be Flight Surgeons! I have a friend in the Navy who is a flight surgeon, (dang good one too! I guess he almost got flight surgeon of the year for the whole Navy!) This friend gets to fly F-18's and all too! What a deal!

My question is: Have you ever heard of anyone being a pilot for 10 and then going to Med school after that? To either be a doc and/or flight surgeon. Highly unlikely I know, but just wondering. I do know that many people change careers and go to med school in their late 30's and 40's even. Every med school has a few of those from what I can see.

Thanks for your help.

[Guest JoeMama]

Yes...it's actually an easier route becoming a rated pilot first, then going to medical school. There's an age limit for pilot training, but (although some medical schools don't like taking older students), there's no age limit for starting medical school.

One of the family practice interns at my hospital last year was in his 60's..he had been a pharmacist for many years before starting medical school. Of course, he's a rare exception, but it's not uncommon to have medical students in their 30's and 40's.

There's an AFI describing the Physician Pilot Program. Basically you become dual rated as a pilot and a physician. It's not as uncommon as you'd think. The current AD head of the PPP was a pilot in the AF, left to go to med school, and while he was a practicing physician, he decided he wanted to go back into the AF. He's now an F-117 pilot physician and head of the PPP.

Anyway, the people who I've talked to who are both pilots and physicians love their job(s). The 2 careers are very challenging, but they're also very rewarding.

[Spartacus]

So, how does that work with the AF and committments etc? I'm almost 26 and won't start UPT for another year. I assume that I will serve 10 as a pilot and then I could go to Med school? I guess I'm asking what the ins and outs are to doing this. I might just fly for 20+ but I have always been interested in being a doc too. Also, how does that work out financially? Does it make sense to go to med school that late? (At 38+)

[Guest doctidy]

There are people in the AF that have done the pilot-physician thing both ways (STS).

There are a lot of folks that go to med school in their late 30s.

If you PM me, I'll give you the POC for the Pilot-Physician program.

[scoobs]

So how long do you have to fly before you go to med school?

[Guest F16PilotMD]

JJ-yes, you can go to med school after flying for 10 years. They can then be flight surgeons. The USAF Pilot-Physician program is a program/career tract that is described as something you start early with a long-term plan. Doesn't have to be like that, though. There are several people out there who are BOTH pilots and physicians (some even flight surgeons) who do one or the other at any given time. Then add in the variables of AD, ANG, and AFRES. There are many ways to skin this cat.

[Guest JoeMama]

JetJock, yes I am.

Scoobs, I guess the only real answer to your question would be...you have to fly until you get accepted to medical school and until the AF lets you go to medical school.

Anything's possible...The PPP is described in AFI 11-405 and requires a minimum of 3 years of operational flying. It would be possible (although tricky) to get the AF to let you go to medical school after being a pilot for 2 or 3 years. Of course, waiting until your 10 year committment is over would be easiest, and you kinda have to be careful how you'd present your med school ambitions to your commander...easy for him/her to take it the wrong way.

If you're serious about the PPP, my recommendation would be to make sure you have all the med school prereqs and study for and take the MCAT now. Also , if you have no medical background, do a little volunteering in a hospital, so you can get exposure to patient care and have something to talk about on your med school interview.

Then join the Aerospace Medicine Association (AsMA) as a student member, which will allow you to join the International Association of Military Flight Surgeon Pilots (IAMFSP). I think the total fees end up being $60 a year or so. Once in, try to attend the AsMA yearly May meetings (This year's is in Kansas City, and I think the next 2 years are Orlando and New Orleans) and start networking with the PPP crowd.

If your MCAT scores are good, and it looks like you'll be a good candidate for med school, and you get to know the PPP leadership, you may be able to slip into med school before the magic 10 years.

As far as needs of the AF, an AF pilot jumping ship for med school only to return a few years later with more specialized training and get BACK into the cockpit would be more of an asset than a liability. You just have to play your cards right.

It's a long path though...PPP requires graduation from UPT and follow on training, 3 years operational flying experience, 4 years med school, one year internship, 6 weeks aerospace medicine primary course, and one year tour as an operational flight surgeon. Still... I don't think you'll be bored if you go that route.

[Guest FighterFlyer]

I'm an active duty pilot and interetested in the pilot physician program but I have no prior medical training. Does anyone know how I would apply to try and convince the AF to let me go to medical school after my next operational assignment? Also, any other details about the process/program or contact information for who might know would be awsome.

Thanks

[Guest P27:17]

I haven't seen Rage's PM...here is what I was able to find from a pilot/physician...hope it helps.

"I am by no means an authority in this, but I was a T-37 FAIP who was released from my pilot contract to pursue medical training in 1992. Overall there are two issues for a USAF pilot who wants to go to medical school:

1) getting into med school.

2) getting released by the line of the AF to be allowed to go.

For item #1: same for everybody: need to take prerequisites (chem, bio, mcat etc), have medical experience (volunteer in hospital etc), which can be done while an active duty pilot. USUHS is an attractive option!

For item #2, pilot needs to either wait for contract to expire, or get released by AFPC/personnel center/rated pilot career manager. I don't know how willing the current staff at AFPC might be, but AFI 11-405 pilot-physician program could be used to demonstrate line payback after med school. "

[Guest Flying Nole]

Does anyone know of an AF website that describes the process, or the pre-req's that are required to apply for USUHS?

[Guest Sparky]

So how long do you have to fly before you go to med school?

I have a buddy in the program right now, actually he is in his 4th year of med school. He didnt have to finish his pilot training committment either, he flew one eagle tour and then got picked up for med school. Last I heard he will be the first F-22 pilot physician.

[Guest tamer]

is there a similar program for dental school?

can anyone give me a quick description of what a "pilot physician" actually does?

[Guest Sparky]

is there a similar program for dental school?

can anyone give me a quick description of what a "pilot physician" actually does?

I am by no means the subject matter expert but in my almost 17 years in the AF..I have never seen a flying Dentist. I have known some flyers who have crossed over to the dental arena after serving their initial pilot training committment though. Pilot physicians are rated pilots whose additional duty other than flying is performing flight surgeon duties. I call that an "additional duty" only because this is after all the AF and we fly planes for a living, everything else is a support function. Hope that doesnt sound too arrogant:)

[Guest tamer]

hmm thanks for the info...if all goes as planned, it looks like it would be possible to do 15-20 years as a pilot, then go to dental school...is dental school something the AF would pay for? or is that only if i were to be a dentist in the AF?

[Guest Sparky]

hmm thanks for the info...if all goes as planned, it looks like it would be possible to do 15-20 years as a pilot, then go to dental school...is dental school something the AF would pay for? or is that only if i were to be a dentist in the AF?

Currently the AF will only pay Tuition assistance up through Master's degree, if you have the GI Bill you are more than welcome to use that to off set some of the costs. As far as scholarships or being a dentist in the AF...your best bet would be to stop by the dental clinic at your base and see if some of those guys can educate you on the various programs available. Good luck!

Sparky

[CrateOfThunder]

I have heard several rumors involving funding and timelines for this program. Reading AFI 11-405 makes it seem like you must have already completed med school to apply...this can't be the case.

Anyone in the know -- after I finish my first tour, can I then attend med school on the Air Force's dime?

If so, can I expect to go back to fighters afterwards?

What med schools are options -- only the Air Force run one or any?

Do you keep rank and active duty status while at school?

AFI 11-405 talks about still being eligible for WIC, is that only if you go back to the same airframe?

This sounds like an unbeleivable opportunity and I would love to find out more about it...thanks in advance for any help.

Edited November 16, 2007 by CrateOfThunder

[jimbobpow13]

Hello,

Currently I am a senior and Pilot select. I a physics major with a 3.5 GPA. I am curious about the Pilot Physician AFSC. From what I've heard. It's basically anyone who goes through UPT and wishes to go to Medical school afterwards and that there aren't many because it's so much school. Any advice/comments (How to get into it) would be great!

Thanks,

J

[Guest L Unit]

Can anyone point me in the right direction for more information on physician assistant opportunities in the ANG?

Specifically, where are the opportunities listed:

https://www.goang.com/

https://www.ang.af.mil/careers/mva/index.asp

https://www.usajobs.gov/

another source

. . . or a combination of these?

Can a PA function as a flight surgeon?

I also searched for an AFI but I didn't find anything relevant, possibly due to me being unfamiliar with the system.

Any other info would be appreciated.

[CPE1704TKS]

Can anyone point me in the right direction for more information on physician assistant opportunities in the ANG?

Specifically, where are the opportunities listed:

https://www.goang.com/

https://www.ang.af.mil/careers/mva/index.asp

https://www.usajobs.gov/

another source

. . . or a combination of these?

Can a PA function as a flight surgeon?

I also searched for an AFI but I didn't find anything relevant, possibly due to me being unfamiliar with the system.

Any other info would be appreciated.

Bump - Does anyone have experience or knowledge if the Pilot Physician Program is possible for guard flyers and how it would work, if an option?

Thanks.

[CPE1704TKS]

One more bump, and a question: For the PPP on active duty, do they pay for medical school, and do you still keep your rank and pay/allowances/time in service? Or are you actually separated from the Air Force while at medical school, with the intent to return?

Thanks.

[deaddebate]

Next selection board deadline is approaching in Jan 2015. More information available in AFI 11-405 or at:

https://kx2.afms.mil/kj/kx9/USAFPilotPhysicianProgram

[10percenttruth]

Good luck to the 20lb brains out there.

PM me & I can put you in touch with a pilot physician type if you want pointers.

[Jedi Doc]

I have heard several rumors involving funding and timelines for this program. Reading AFI 11-405 makes it seem like you must have already completed med school to apply...this can't be the case.

Anyone in the know -- after I finish my first tour, can I then attend med school on the Air Force's dime?

If so, can I expect to go back to fighters afterwards?

What med schools are options -- only the Air Force run one or any?

Do you keep rank and active duty status while at school?

AFI 11-405 talks about still being eligible for WIC, is that only if you go back to the same airframe?

This sounds like an unbeleivable opportunity and I would love to find out more about it...thanks in advance for any help.

The PPP can be entered both by doing UFT and military flight training first or by doing medical school first. I think the former is more common as by becoming a doc first, one typically needs an age waiver (> 30 years old) by the time it's all said and done. I don't know anything about guarantees to return to a specific aircraft.

Here is an article written by Lt Col Jay Flottman who is both a flight surgeon and F-15C/F-22 pilot. He describes the entire PPP and his particular route to becoming a PP.

https://goflightmedicine.com/usaf-pilot-physician-program/

[jcj]

I'm a medical school faculty member (have been for a long time) - one thing to know is that - as mentioned above - while it's probably easier to get into medical school when you're younger, it's not a "carved in stone" deal requiring a waiver like entry into UPT is. We have plenty of prior military folks come to medical school older than their classmates - some officers (pilots and others), some enlisted who do their tour, then go to college & med school. These days coming to med school later than your peers because you've been in the military really is no big deal. So the path of less resistance might be med school after you are a rated pilot.

There is a saying that it's easier to make a Soldier (Airman, Marine, etc) into a physician than to make a physician into a Soldier. Having trained a whole bunch of physicians and having been in the military and around a whole bunch of military people, I think that's right.

Also, don't think you have to major in biology or chemistry in college to get into med school. You do have to take the basic premed stuff (two semesters of biology, two semesters of physics, two semesters of general chemistry, two semesters of organic chemistry) - but other than that major in whatever you want & will make good grades at. We don't care as long as it's an actual college major and your grades are good. I've worked with two chiefs of surgery who were English majors and docs who were music majors, sociology majors, engineers & math majors. try to rock the MCAT - really high MCAT scores make you stand out in a good way although they won't compensate for bad college grades. And I think those people who tell you that prep courses for the MCAT don't make any difference are full of shit. It's a high stakes exam & I highly recommend serious preparation, usually with a prep course.

Edited February 20, 2015 by jcj