Blue Angels vs. Thunderbirds

[Guest regularjoe]

The Reds are impressive; putting nine jets up vs six is always cool.

However, it says much when one unit is flying a fighter, the other a trainer.

(and yes, I remember the T-38 T-birds. I would have loved to have seen the F-4 or even F-105 teams!)

I have seen both the Blues and TBirds when they flew their F-4's. That was nothing short of impressive seeing a fighter that large being flown in tight formations and the high speed passes were something that I won't soon forget.

[PaddyPilot]

Here's a short clip of the tbirds flying super sabres

Edited December 22, 2007 by PaddyPilot

[Guest LocoF16]

The original T-Clone video looks relatively old...note the 100ft passes and flying between buildings. I don't think even they can get away with much of that anymore. As far as grabbing stuff in the air with your right hand while turning the jet...not possible unless you're a jedi master.

On the topic of fighter dudes and FOD...hey, they put their pants on one leg at a time just like you...except after they're done putting their pants on they make gold records.

Just another reason I'm not a big fan of the T-Nerds...they just got brand new Block 52s, while the CAF is flying aging airplanes. Gimme a break...

[HuggyU2]

The original T-Clone video looks relatively old...note the 100ft passes and flying between buildings. I don't think even they can get away with much of that anymore. As far as grabbing stuff in the air with your right hand while turning the jet...not possible unless you're a jedi master.

On the topic of fighter dudes and FOD...hey, they put their pants on one leg at a time just like you...except after they're done putting their pants on they make gold records.

Just another reason I'm not a big fan of the T-Nerds...they just got brand new Block 52s, while the CAF is flying aging airplanes. Gimme a break...

Those videos are of Dean Wright, and he was on the team in '99-'00. Looks like the Chicago show they do every year. I haven't been, but I think they still fly between the buildings.

The Block 52 decision was made by CSAF. I think it was more about getting the Block 32's back to units that needed them.

T-Nerds? T-Clones? What's up guys? The name calling's a bit childish, don't you think?

[Guest Johann]

Not a pilot, but IMHO the Blues are way more impressive than the Thunderturds.

Obviously, they're both very good at what they do, but from a crowd perspective, I think the Blues do a better job.

I guess it says something that the Blues aren't wearing g-suits when they fly.

[Guest LocoF16]

The Block 52 decision was made by CSAF. I think it was more about getting the Block 32's back to units that needed them.

WTF? Um, no thanks guys we'd rather have Block 32s instead of 52s. We would rather not have the Gucci capabilities of CCIP jets. I'm pretty sure there aren't any more Block 32s in AD. Peddling them to Fresno was an easy excuse. Those 52s should be out in the CAF. I don't care who made the decision, it still doesn't make sense.

[Guest LocoF16]

I guess it says something that the Blues aren't wearing g-suits when they fly.

A g-suit might've saved that Lt that morted last year (speculation). I looked up the old thread and nothing has been posted on the reason for the crash. I guess it's still pending?

[Steve Davies]

The real question should be, 'Why are there huge gaps in the Thunderbirds' display sequence, where the crowd can turn their backs to the display line, walk off and grab a hot dog and a drink, and then come back to and still have not missed anything?'.

[Guest F16crewdwgg]

This is a question that I do not have the experience to answer and I was wondering what other people thought about it. As far as demonstrations teams go, are the Blue Angels more skilled than the Thunderbirds or the other way around? I've seen the Thunderbirds perform a couple of times and I got to say they are pretty tight

They do the exact same stunts. Just in a different jet. Like Nascar. They drive different cars but the concept is still the same and the drivers train the same... The diff between Nascar and the Military, there is no competition between the two. I even heard from a T-bird Crewchief that sometimes they switch pilots from T-birds to Blue-Ang... and other way around.. So there you have folks.. there is no difference. case closed.

[Guest Boom]

They do the exact same stunts. Just in a different jet. Like Nascar. They drive different cars but the concept is still the same and the drivers train the same... The diff between Nascar and the Military, there is no competition between the two. I even heard from a T-bird Crewchief that sometimes they switch pilots from T-birds to Blue-Ang... and other way around.. So there you have folks.. there is no difference. case closed.

Uh, you don't just "switch pilots" especially in jet demo teams.

[Guest F16crewdwgg]

Uh, you don't just "switch pilots" especially in jet demo teams.

Well I doubt a Crewchief who works on the T-birds and has first hand discussions with the pilots would be lieing.

I'm not arguing with anyone about this whether its true or not.. this is what was told to me. End of discussion.

[Guest Seagram]

Gentlemen:

Here is a complete set of Pix from the San Francisco Fleet Week. Some photos were posted earlier by someone else, but these shots are the complete set - most impressive. https://home.comcast.net/~bzee1a/

[Flare]

Gentlemen:

Here is a complete set of Pix from the San Francisco Fleet Week. Some photos were posted earlier by someone else, but these shots are the complete set - most impressive. https://home.comcast.net/~bzee1a/

Seagram....don't know if these are your pics or not, but the ones of the Blue doing the high speed pass were sweet! Very nice!

[HuggyU2]

Looks like a bunch of the argumentative posts (including mine) have been deleted (which is a good thing; sorry 'bout that Mods). One questioned what I had said (on an earlier post) that the Blues couldn't use G-suits because it makes control difficult. I didn't mention the ~40 lbs spring they use, that pulls the stick nose-down. The TBirds don't have a spring (due to the nature of the stick), but opt for full nose down trim. A friend of mine who was on the TBirds for 3 years said, if he had his choice, he'd want way MORE nose-down trim.

I emailed a guy who was the Blues' solo 4 or 5 years ago, and asked him if I remember correctly what the guys on the Blues told me, or if I was smoking something. He wrote me back with this:

"As you know, there is a spring connected to the stick to give us feedback on the stick position. Without that, there is a "void" near the center of the stick position where the stick can move 1/8 to 1/4 inch without triggering a flight control response. Bottom line it feels like "slop" if the spring is not connected. Not really noticeable unless you are flying 6 inches from a dude. What am I getting at? With 40 pounds of downward force, we have to rest our right forearm on our leg to act as a fulcrum. It is not humanly possible to hold 40 pounds the entire flight. So, with a g-suit under your arm and inflating and deflating throughout flight, there is no way you can stop that movement from transferring to the stick."

That should settle the argument.

[Guest Seagram]

Seagram....don't know if these are your pics or not, but the ones of the Blue doing the high speed pass were sweet! Very nice!

No, I cannot take credit for them, but I wish that I had been on one of the boats in the harbor that day! (Smile) The credits are at the bottom of the series.....

"If you liked these, you might want to check out some other pics I took...

Click on the Gallery Index link below.

BZ Gallery Index

If you have any comments, drop me a line at: szee1@comcast.net

Thanks! Bernard Zee"

Edited December 27, 2007 by Seagram

[Guest markkyle66]

The Reds are impressive; putting nine jets up vs six is always cool.

However, it says much when one unit is flying a fighter, the other a trainer.

(and yes, I remember the T-38 T-birds. I would have loved to have seen the F-4 or even F-105 teams!)

You mean these guys? Figured you all might wanna see some vintage thunderbird stuff!

Thunderbirds1

Thunderbirds2

[Guest Flying_Bulldog]

Those videos, despite not having any sound, are hot shit. Any vintage stuff from the blues out there?

[HuggyU2]

Any vintage stuff from the blues out there?

This only about 21 years old, and has probably been posted dozens of times, but ifyou haven't seen it, here you go:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OzMzGXRUlaM

Some guy edited a new version with the Hornet (circa 1995), and it's good too:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZUDPjsvjRkA

[HuggyU2]

this is my favorite movie of all time, hands down. i thought the part where the crap is flying around in the cockpit and the tbird pilot just reaches up and puts it away while completing his maneuver was pretty sweet.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=y8LF0xp53W0

It appears that particular clip is of a guy in the back of a two-seater grabbing the FOD, while the TBird pilot flies.

[Combat Platypus]

TClones -- Air Force Regs -- A list of things you are allowed to do, how to do them, what altitude, airspeed, and attitude to be at, and what you have to eat for breakfast before you do them. And if it is not written down you most certainly cannot do it. Improvising and free though are strictly prohibited.

Blue Angels -- Navy Regs -- Unless it says you can't do it, you can do whatever you want.

We were going to do a fly-by of whatever carrier was out in Japan last year and I was flying with an exchange Navy pilot. Apparently unless you’re doing a flare jettison over the flight deck, below 50 feet, or supersonic you get scoffed.

Cheers,

Beerman

I was surfing off Pompano Joe's in Destin today and at around 1400L the #7 Blue Angel did and nice slow pass at around 500'. Was really cool and random.

[PaddyPilot]

It appears that particular clip is of a guy in the back of a two-seater grabbing the FOD, while the TBird pilot flies.

yea i think he's an A-10 pilot

[HuggyU2]

yea i think he's an A-10 pilot

Just curious: how did you determine that?

[Guest regularjoe]

Just curious: how did you determine that?

It's his watch that gives it away....

Sorry couldn't resist, will be interested to see a real answer. man this thread has degenerated.

Edited December 28, 2007 by regularjoe

[PaddyPilot]

Just curious: how did you determine that?

because that's a clip from a video of an A-10 driver getting a ride from the t-birds. i think it was supposed to be funny because in all the clips there is FOD everywhere.

[Guest PilotKD]

I'm not going to attempt to judge who is more skilled, but I'd have to also say the Angels put on a better show than the Birds. Afterall, they've got Fat Albert! I enjoy watching both of them, but again, the Blue's just have that little extra sumt'n sumt'n. :D I remember seeing them when they used the F-4's and later on when the T-Birds flew the -38's.