Challenging Instrument Approaches

[Guest Wink]

I’m looking for some instrument approach procedures that are difficult or challenging or unique so we can needlessly beat ourselves up.

Take a look at the approach I attached, for example. The TACAN Y 13R at KNGP is much more complicated than it needs to be, just so they can use it to teach their students.

Have any of you come across any interesting approaches in your career?

ngp_vor_dme_y_or_tacan_y_rwy_13r.pdf

[ViperDriver77]

This one can get pretty hairy if it's your first time doing it. It's been referred to as the Widow Maker.

00354HI21.pdf

[Insubordinate & Churlish]

I thought this arc as a final approach was difficult, but then I looked at some of the above approaches.

Baltimore/ Martine State VOR/DME or TACAN Z RWY 15

Edited December 22, 2007 by C-130 Hopeful

[Guest Boom]

Approach really isn't difficult once you get past the fact the runway is about the size of the whole island and the constant 40 knot crosswinds.

https://204.108.4.16/d-tpp/0712/01246VDT10.PDF

[HerkDerka]

The TACAN-Y is always a popular pick for the Corpus grads.

The VOR into HAAB was a bear with the high terrain. The HI-TACAN into OAIX is probably the steepest descent I've seen on an IAP.

HD

[Carpetbagger]

Elk City, Idaho

Visual approach... with nosewheel steering...

[amcflyboy]

The TACAN-Y is always a popular pick for the Corpus grads.

The VOR into HAAB was a bear with the high terrain. The HI-TACAN into OAIX is probably the steepest descent I've seen on an IAP.

HD

yup! been there, done that, got the a$$ chewing!

[amcflyboy]

Flight Simulator comes in REAL handy if you want to "mess" around with these approaches without killing yourself!

[Combat Platypus]

This one can get pretty hairy if it's your first time doing it. It's been referred to as the Widow Maker.

00354HI21.pdf

Been there done that and got the T-shirt (they are sold at the FBO) in a T-37, T-1 and C-130 (had to have the gear and flaps out).

The Co-pilot killer at KLIT sucks.https://204.108.4.16/d-tpp/0712/00233VA.PDFATC will always make you circle southwest that gives you 3.2 miles to lose 1000' not including your offset and getting back on course after station passage.

Edited December 23, 2007 by Combat Platypus

[tac airlifter]

dude, we were just doing the VOR A at LIT thursday in the weather. my co had never done it, and i warned him "man this comes pretty fast if you circle south to 4R, you need to decend at 2000fpm and immediatly turn left to 220 within 1.7 then perch immediatly after that." we did a total of 3 go arounds because he couldn't align himself fast enough. finally his EFI displaying his HSI went tits up so we called it quits.

[HercDude]

T The TACAN Y 13R at KNGP is much more complicated than it needs to be, just so they can use it to teach their students.

That's not why it is complicated. Acccording to a C-12 sim instructor I had as a stud there, he was ordered to create it years ago so that there was a way to get in to Navy Corpus when their own TACAN was down.

The guy might still be there. Funny sounding dude who uses a sarcastic voice 95% of the time you are around him and offers to smash a simulated egg on your face when you do something stupid in the sim. Yeah - maybe not a full deck of cards up there for sure.

[Combat Platypus]

dude, we were just doing the VOR A at LIT thursday in the weather. my co had never done it, and i warned him "man this comes pretty fast if you circle south to 4R, you need to decend at 2000fpm and immediatly turn left to 220 within 1.7 then perch immediatly after that." we did a total of 3 go arounds because he couldn't align himself fast enough. finally his EFI displaying his HSI went tits up so we called it quits.

Happened to me on my Co check in the WX. Made the decent at 2000' min and got my offset alright only to loose sight.

The IP told me to continue and I was able to make the turn to final based on known visual ques (the river). Finally saw the 22L still at mda and almost over the approach end. The eng asked the IP if he was going to let me attempt the landing out of it. We didn't, but I got credit for the circle.

[Murph]

Yeah that Tacan into BAF is pretty gnar--got me on my first try.

[DeHavilland]

For confusion, I just have to look at many of the approaches in Europe. There was one in Pakistan that was just insane. You are doing some cloverleaf patterns passing back and forth over the station while avoiding some restricted airspace. I'll try to find it to post here.

[stract]

https://204.108.4.16/d-tpp/0712/00854COPTERV061.PDF

it's hard enough trying to figure out which road is "Natchez Trace Parkway". I did this one on a severe clear day and still couldn't ID the road we think they wanted us to follow.

[amcflyboy]

That's not why it is complicated. Acccording to a C-12 sim instructor I had as a stud there, he was ordered to create it years ago so that there was a way to get in to Navy Corpus when their own TACAN was down.

The guy might still be there. Funny sounding dude who uses a sarcastic voice 95% of the time you are around him and offers to smash a simulated egg on your face when you do something stupid in the sim. Yeah - maybe not a full deck of cards up there for sure.

Yup, I know that dude. He was also a T-44 sim instructor. Yeah, not all with it, but a super nice guy and works with you to help you understand. I believe his name is Buck.

[HerkDerka]

smash a simulated egg on your face when you do something stupid in the sim.

Yep, that guy was definitely a loon.

HD

[amcflyboy]

Yep, that guy was definitely a loon.

HD

but you know what, he made the sims that much more relaxing and enjoyable.....

[Champ Kind]

You can't talk about T-44 sims without at least mentioning Hank Hall.

Man law.

[Guest Boom]

Look at the approach to manas AB. If it is still hte same as it was a few years ago when I flew it, it should be more brain racking than any in the states. Consider also that theKyrg controller gave us altitudes in meters, and you chaneg the altimeter inside the iaf. It's a great training plate for co's.

If you're flying through the "corridor" you should of already been in meters.

[czecksikhs]

You can't talk about T-44 sims without at least mentioning Hank Hall.

Man law.

From my first-ever sim at Corpus with the legend, Hank Hall:

"GAWD DAMMIT! You boys are f#ckin LOSERS!!! I am gonna call the skipper and tell him he has a couple of $hitbags on his hands!"

Just to bookend my Corpus sim experience, my last sim was with him and in the debrief he sighs and puts his feet up on the desk and his hands behind his head:

"I'll tell you something boys, I'm tired and I need to get me a new job. I want the kind of job where I just eat Shakira's pu$$y all day."

I still can't believe he hasn't been fired or put in jail for some of the things he says. I love it!!

Edited December 29, 2007 by czecksikhs

[amcflyboy]

You can't talk about T-44 sims without at least mentioning Hank Hall.

Man law.

Oh yeah!!! *shuddering* He use to ask us what "color" paper we wanted our grade sheet on!! We use to always say white, as opposed to blue, yellow, and pink! Definitely a navy thing having the "scarlet letter" in your training folder!

[Guest AFBrandon]

Those guys are both still here. Definitely makes the sims a lot more enjoyable having characters like them in around.

I can't imagine how crazy I'd go if I had to sit in the sim all day. Especially if I could do this stuff as well as they can and had to watch newbies screw it up.

[amcflyboy]

Those guys are both still here. Definitely makes the sims a lot more enjoyable having characters like them in around.

I can't imagine how crazy I'd go if I had to sit in the sim all day. Especially if I could do this stuff as well as they can and had to watch newbies screw it up.

In the end, they've got a cake job. But, if they couldn't, no $hit, fly the T-44/TC-12 in real life after working this kind of job for as long as they have, then they would be the be all, end all of squadron jokes!!