Ground Combat Badge

[Cooter]

https://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htmoral/a...s/20060818.aspx

Since we were discussing it the other day, I happen to run across this article. Hope they can take time out away from their uniform boards for this.

Cooter

[Hacker]

Personally, I think it's a pretty good idea...but not for the whiny-assed reasons that the pogue Captain in the other article mentioned.

I don't mind seeing the guys who are on the ground get their due...and I don't feel particularly slighted as a pilot if I'm not eligible for it from the air. If I were an ALO, though, and I was excluded from being eligible I'd be f*cking pissed.

[Scooter14]

2

As long as they don't de-value it like they do everything else, it will be a good thing.

Of course, like everything else, if someone hears a gunshot in the distance, they'll be trying to put themselves in for it.

[Guest Rainman A-10]

Don't guys on the ground get medals now?

I thouht that was what the V on the Bronze Star was for.

[zrooster99]

As long as they don't de-value it like they do everything else,

The problem is that it's REMFs that de-value these medals and REMFs that decide who gets them.

[Cooter]

I think this is going to be an actual badge like Wings/Career Field badges. Wonder if it will resemble the Army CAB or if the AF will put a new age hip spin on it? Either way, good on'em for giving folks the recognition they deserve.

I will say that in fine AF fashion if you know someone who thought they heard a gunshot you'll probably get it so in the end it probably won't mean much... ...we don't want any of our new age troops feeling left out now do we?

Cooter

22 days until CAOC sentence over!

[ 18. August 2006, 23:59: Message edited by: Cooter ]

[HerkDerka]

This is retarded. We don't need a "ground combat recognition" badge. It will just be over awarded and then every non-combat AFSC will whine about how they think they rate it. After that it will be just another GWOT-S, Bronze Star MCF.

I say for the few AF guys who might actually rate such an award, let the Army award them the CIB or CAB and have Big Blue make it legal for them to wear. The Army doesn't take the CIB and CAB lightly. I think it would keep it out of REMF hands.

HD

[Herk Driver]

I'm with HerkDerka on this one. As soon as this is released, every person at Al Udeid (that has never left the confines of Al Udeid) will figure out a way to put in for it until it becomes meaningless as well.

[Guest Rainman A-10]

Al Udeid is not the worst example...

Some B-2 Mx officer at Whiteman will also find a way to get one...to go along with his Bronze Star.

[Guest RedMan]

What do you mean, "that hasn't left the confines of Al Udeid." There are people on this base that don't even know what Ops Town, or the CAOC are. But they still qualify for the gold border because it's a "combat zone"

[HerkDerka]

Yep, can't forget the CC warriors.

HD

[Guest SATCOM]

Originally posted by Rainman A-10:

Al Udeid is not the worst example...

Some B-2 Mx officer at Whiteman will also find a way to get one...to go along with his Bronze Star.

My all-time fave is the female bus driver at Bagram that got the BSM for "unflinching dedication to transportation readiness in-the-face of certain enemy forces..."

I was told to "Keep your thoughts on this (medals) to yourself" while attending my last Senior NCO PME course. The very subject of the B-2 BSM situation came up and I was on a roll.

[Hacker]

Anyone with any sort of SA can tell the difference in value between a BSM and a BSV.

[HerkDerka]

Yep, the REMFs with the bronze stars are the ones who have to tell themselves they earned it when they're trying to sleep at night.

HD

[Guest SATCOM]

Originally posted by Hacker:

Anyone with any sort of SA can tell the difference in value between a BSM and a BSV.

BSM is the Bronze Star Medal. BSM with V is Bronze Star for Valor. The V is supposed to indicate award for a valorous act. Typically involving actual gunfire etc. The BSM, however, has become the defacto senior NCO and O "I went to war and came back alive-look-at-me-I'm someone" medal. It has been watered down to a MSM in a supposed combat zone. People EXPECT the BSM, and I've seen some pretty sad tantrums from those that didn't get it.

Check this real-life conversation out that took place between myself and a MSgt at the Med Clinic recently:

ME "Afternoon, I'm here for a follow-up hearing test."

THEM "OK, just fill out this paperwork and the technician will see you shortly."

ME "I see that you have the Afghan Campaign Medal, were you at Bagram?

THEM "Yes, I was there for three months and handled some of the clinic duties there."

ME "Recently, what timeframe were you there because I was there a few months ago?"

THEM "I was there last year."

ME "You must have done a damn good job, is that where you got that Bronze Star?"

THEM "Yes, for my time in a combat zone."

I lowered my head and busied myself with the clipboard and paperwork.

[ 20. August 2006, 08:37: Message edited by: SATCOM ]

[Hacker]

Originally posted by SATCOM:

BSM is the Bronze Star Medal. BSM with V is Bronze Star for Valor. The V is supposed to indicate award for a valorous act.

Exactly my point. Either it's awarded for heroic or meritorious achievement. The citation itself specifies if the medal was awarded for heroism or merit. The V device on the ribbon highlights the difference when it's worn.

The same thing goes for a DFC and an Air Medal.

I don't disagree that medals are given away like candy these days, but if you know what you're looking for you can see past the medal-hounds and ID the guys who were really out there doing the J-O-B and getting their proper credit.

[HerkDerka]

Dos.

HD

[Hacker]

Correction...in my post above, the wording implies that the V device specifies the difference between heroism and achievement for the DFC and Air Medal, and that's not what I meant.

What I meant was that the DFC and AM are both medals that, like the Bronze Star, can be awarded for either heroism or merit, and that it says which it was awarded for on the certificate.

Just re-read it and wanted to clarify.

[Login Name]

Originally posted by Rainman A-10:

Al Udeid is not the worst example...

Some B-2 Mx officer at Whiteman will also find a way to get one...to go along with his Bronze Star.

i'll be that said mx officer in a few weeks and i'll be damned if i think i deserve one for doing an aef to guam. i've got too many friends that are on the ground getting shot at to actually think i deserve a combat badge, bsm (definately not a bsv) etc.

in fact, just to screw with them, i like telling them i'm fighting the war too over here in england while i drink at the pubs/clubs and nail single moms every weekend. not like nailing single moms is a big accomplishment over here, all the women here are single moms.

as for dudes on the ground needing some sort of recognition, i think there should be one. look at the Lt from 1st combat camera who went above and beyond what his duty description reads in his OPR. i think the only people that are deserving are the ones on the ground outside the wire. if you're a pilot playing with the army you should get one if so deserving, if you're a supply troop running convoy duties you get one too.

[Guest Rainman A-10]

Originally posted by Hacker:

I don't disagree that medals are given away like candy these days, but if you know what you're looking for you can see past the medal-hounds and ID the guys who were really out there doing the J-O-B and getting their proper credit.

I wish that were true.

There are too many guys with "real" medals theat are bullshit and even more who don't have medals for doing some extremely courageous shit to make this a single source ID criteria.

[Hacker]

Originally posted by Rainman A-10:

There are too many guys with "real" medals theat are bullshit and even more who don't have medals for doing some extremely courageous shit to make this a single source ID criteria.

It's been that way forever. My dad, who is a Korean War-era vet said the same thing about when he was on active duty.

[Beaver]

A bunch of my dudes have been awarded the Army's Combat Action Badge, but they aren't authorized to wear it on their uniform. The Army seems to be a doing a fairly good job limiting this to people who deserve it, I.E. direct fire contact, mortar attacks within lethal radius, etc. It would be nice if the AF had a wear policy for other service combat badges.

[ 23. August 2006, 08:39: Message edited by: Beaver ]