?s on ADSC (Active Duty Service Commitment)

[Vetter]

For the love of God, please stand your ground on this. They are going to fuck A LOT of people over with this, especially with the 10 year commitment. I wouldn't sign the damn thing. Fuck them.

[tac airlifter]

I'm inclined to agree with the above. Otherwise they'll be able to keep everyone beyond our commitment simply by giving us orders to a new airframe. I don't necessarily want to get out, but I certainly don't want to be forced to stay in past my initial 10; and this seems to be a backdoor method of forcing members to stay.

[Splash95]

I'm in a very similar situation right now. Nav with 3+ years left on my initial ADSC, last month (after just over 2 years in my first assignment, not even close to VML) got notified that I'd be PCSing and cross-training, neither of which I particularly wanted to do in the short term. I went along--Service Before Self and all that--"knowing" that I could punch in 2014 if I didn't like the way things were going.

Upon my return to the office this week, I found an email awaiting me with a Form 63 to sign which would incur an ADSC of 3 years from my grad date from training on the new platorm, taking me well into 2015 at the earliest. I'd rather not extend my commitment for an assigment I didn't want in the first place. A couple of questions:

1. Fine print on the form 63 seems to imply that I CAN'T decline the ADSC since I'm not eligible to 7-day opt. That's not correct, is it?

2. If I do check the "no" box, what happens then? Matmac and Hookemall are saying that I may or may not still PCS. I asked my functional (maybe a bad decision, "showing my cards" and what have you, but oh well) and he didn't know the answer himself but said he would find out. In the end it is his decision, right?

Just trying to get as well-informed about this deal as possible before signing any more of my life away...

Thanks, Rman

[matmacwc]

Your functional is probably the best person to ask. When I went through everything I'd ask everybody these questions at AFPC, and caveat my questions with I just wan't to know my options. Also tell him you wan't around the 7 day option until they get you the correct answer, they can do that in house or with an exception to policy letter.

[Vetter]

R-Man, I think the reg only applies if it takes you past 10 years of continuous rated service.

[LoneStar]

Are there current bonuses that people would become ineligible for if they signed a new adsc that brought them past the 10 year mark? Not quite sure how those things work and if they even are any right now?

[Tulsa]

Question on ADSC incurred for Transfer of Education Benefits for the new 9/11 GI bill. As it was explained to me and after researching it on the VA websites, was it commits you to four more years to utilize the benefits. However, the member can revoke the benefit at any time and the commitment does not prevent the member from leaving the service. So, it is four years if you use it, but doesn't prevent you from leaving if benefit is revoked. I am just wondering if anyone has better or correct information on this before making a decision. Most people I've spoken cannot give me a straight answer or I get conflicting guidance from base agencies and/or official websites. Thanks in advance.

[makinbacon]

I picked up the 9/11 GI Bill 4 yr ADSC but didn't think it was a big deal until I became a passover casualty in this joint assignment. AFPC said because I am using it for my spouse, I would have to pay it back if I voluntarily separated. If they kick me out then I pay nothing but risk not being able to get into the guard or reserves to finish 20 yrs. I want to separate before I get passed over again and shoot for one of the open O5 reserve billets but I can’t find anyone to tell me how fast the money has to be repaid.

[BONE WSO]

Tulsa-

Not true. Even if you revoke the benefit, you still are stuck with the ADSC. I already tried this with no luck. AFPC would not budge and there is no reg or AFI giving any direction one way or the other. It was my argument that they haven't paid anything so I shouldn't owe them any time.

[Guest Hueypilot812]

The ADSC for the GI Bill transfer is only a sticking point if you're separating completely from the military. If you're doing Palace Chase or Palace Front it shouldn't be an issue, and don't let AFPC or anyone else tell you otherwise because per the verbiage on the ADSC, it requires 4 years of service with either the active duty -OR- the reserve component. It doesn't state you are required to be active duty...the whole "Active Duty" part of the ADSC is a misnomer because even the reserves and Guard use the term ADSC (I had a 6 year ADSC with the ARNG for helo training....but I wasn't active duty).

[Everybody Knows]

Interesting. I've been wondering the same thing recently. I'm currently stationed overseas with a DEROS for the summer of 2013, although my GI Bill transfer ADSC goes through the summer of 2014. If they will not just drop the ADSC (as we have not used any portion of the transfer benefits) then it looks like I will have to stick around until 2014. Now, considering that a PCS back to the States would incur an additional 24 month commitment, and I would only have 12 months remaining, can they force me to sign up for the additional commitment.......even though I'll probably not want to take an additional assignment?

[Prozac]

I thought a PCS from OCONUS to CONUS was a 1 yr ADSC. Has this changed recently?

[Tank]

I thought a PCS from OCONUS to CONUS was a 1 yr ADSC. Has this changed recently?

The answer of course is: it depends. If you are coming off of a 1 year remote OCONUS to CONUS assignment, then it is 1 year. That changes though in regards to remote assignment vs command sponsored assignment. So, more information is needed to determine your PCS ADSC.

https://www.e-publishing.af.mil/shared/media/epubs/AFI36-2107.pdf

Edited September 29, 2011 by Tank

[thud]

Fellas,

My search efforts have turned up nothing, but I'm still hunting for clarification on 36-2107, table 1.1, note 1 regarding "crossflow to a different weapons system (basic qualification) or aircraft airframe."

Previous T-38C FAIP to 11F looking at an IFF job for the next assignment. Does anyone have SA on whether this would invoke the ADSC logic in the regulation? Despite the T-38C vs AT-38C designation difference, I'm not certain this counts as a different weapons system... or airframe for that matter. Any wisdom would be greatly appreciated... the ADSC Operations Office at AFPC was less than helpful (despite multiple Bronze Stars awarded to Total Force Service Center employees).

Thanks!

[Tank]

Fellas,

My search efforts have turned up nothing, but I'm still hunting for clarification on 36-2107, table 1.1, note 1 regarding "crossflow to a different weapons system (basic qualification) or aircraft airframe."

Previous T-38C FAIP to 11F looking at an IFF job for the next assignment. Does anyone have SA on whether this would invoke the ADSC logic in the regulation? Despite the T-38C vs AT-38C designation difference, I'm not certain this counts as a different weapons system... or airframe for that matter. Any wisdom would be greatly appreciated... the ADSC Operations Office at AFPC was less than helpful (despite multiple Bronze Stars awarded to Total Force Service Center employees).

Thanks!

PM Sent

[Freddriver]

The answer of course is: it depends. If you are coming off of a 1 year remote OCONUS to CONUS assignment, then it is 1 year. That changes though in regards to remote assignment vs command sponsored assignment. So, more information is needed to determine your PCS ADSC.

https://www.e-publish.../AFI36-2107.pdf

I'll throw the flag on this one. I just got back from overseas w/dependents, believe it or not as an IG. I dropped papers as soon as I got feet dry in CONUS. AFPC had a shit fit, but when I showed them their own reg i.e. OCONUS-CONUS is only 12 months, they backed down. I've got the retirement orders to prove it. FYI.

[thud]

Thanks to Tank and the rest of the baseops brain trust for the help...

PM me if you want more info or are in the same boat. It took a few calls/emails to AETC and AFPC, but everything got resolved.

Like Freddriver highlighted, know the reg and be prepared to quote it... and make sure you check the fine print on Form 63s or any base-level forms that your outbound assignment or training managers send your way.

[RTB]

The ADSC for the GI Bill transfer is only a sticking point if you're separating completely from the military. If you're doing Palace Chase or Palace Front it shouldn't be an issue, and don't let AFPC or anyone else tell you otherwise because per the verbiage on the ADSC, it requires 4 years of service with either the active duty -OR- the reserve component. It doesn't state you are required to be active duty...the whole "Active Duty" part of the ADSC is a misnomer because even the reserves and Guard use the term ADSC (I had a 6 year ADSC with the ARNG for helo training....but I wasn't active duty).

Has anyone on here successfully done Palace Chase despite still having a GI Bill Transfer ADSC? If so, would appreciate any data on how the process unfolded.

[Tonka]

Has anyone on here successfully done Palace Chase despite still having a GI Bill Transfer ADSC? If so, would appreciate any data on how the process unfolded.

...Or had to fight to separate if the GI Bill is your only ADSC? I have just over a year before my other ADSCs are up and that one is another year later I think.

[JPStryker]

Not sure about separations, but a MSgt I worked with that had signed up for post-9/11 transfer got them to waive the ADSC so he could retire at 20. They revoked the transfer benefits, of course, but he was OK with that. He was one of the guys who got jammed by commitment into an extra year of service because of the way they implemented the transfer ADSC for guys that would be retirement eligible within 4 years of transferring benefits.

[matmacwc]

I see a lot of people stuck in due to the transfer if GI bill benefits. You can transfer it once in AFRC/ANG, so freakin wait. I understand if you are scared they are going to take it away due to budget cuts, but if you want out and to take a bit of a risk, then Rolex your transfer.

[FLY6584]

I see a lot of people stuck in due to the transfer if GI bill benefits. You can transfer it once in AFRC/ANG, so freakin wait. I understand if you are scared they are going to take it away due to budget cuts, but if you want out and to take a bit of a risk, then Rolex your transfer.

Also to piggy back off that when you do transfer your benefits list everyone possible on the transfer. Your, wife, kids, grandkids, your dog, whatever. It doesn't matter who gets what amount and in the end all of it can go to one person or each person can get a portion, but the key is they have to be listed on the initial transfer or you won't be able to transfer it to them without another additional ADSC.

So wife gets listed as 50% and son gets listed at 50% initially, but 15 years down the road you can give 100% to your son if you choose to do so.

Edited October 24, 2012 by FLY6584

[Fifty-six & Two]

Also to piggy back off that when you do transfer your benefits list everyone possible on the transfer. Your, wife, kids, grandkids, your dog, whatever. It doesn't matter who gets what amount and in the end all of it can go to one person or each person can get a portion, but the key is they have to be listed on the initial transfer or you won't be able to transfer it to them without another additional ADSC.

So wife gets listed as 50% and son gets listed at 50% initially, but 15 years down the road you can give 100% to your son if you choose to do so.

This is absolutely false. I transfered 100% of my benefits to my wife 3 years ago. Just last month, I transfered all of them except for one month to my daughter (she wasn't listed on the initial transfer) and did not incur an additional ADSC. The ADSC you incur is to be able to transfer those benefits whenever/however you want (within the eligibility rules).

[Karl Hungus]

Why don't you just wait until you're out of AD and then transfer? That way you don't incur any ADSC. That assumes. wrongly of course, that either the Montgomery/ Post 9-11 GI Bills will still be worth something over the next ten years...

[JPStryker]

This is absolutely false. I transfered 100% of my benefits to my wife 3 years ago. Just last month, I transfered all of them except for one month to my daughter (she wasn't listed on the initial transfer) and did not incur an additional ADSC. The ADSC you incur is to be able to transfer those benefits whenever/however you want (within the eligibility rules).

Fact. However, listing all of your dependents as transfers prior to separation/retirement will make it easier to move your months around after separation/retirement. I understand it's something of an ass pain to add additional dependents after you've left the service, but it can be done.