Boomer6 Posted June 30 Posted June 30 (edited) 3 hours ago, HossHarris said: So the concentration camp guards “just following orders” is valid defense/excuse for you? This analogy is on par with, "if we can't trust them to wear approved patches, how an we trust them in combat?!" In the absense of a law passed ordering police to torture, maim, rape, or execute prisoners I don't expect them to be constitutional scholars. We have courts for this. Its the same reason I don't condemn college admissions officials for executing affirmative action for 60+ years. It was found to be unconstitutional, but I don't hold admissions officials personally responsible for following the law. Edited June 30 by Boomer6 1 1
Smokin Posted July 1 Posted July 1 11 hours ago, Boomer6 said: It's easy to say they should have just refused. They're officers that are trying to clean up their city and were given approval to execute per the new law. Pardon me for not immediately damning them to hell for doing what they're told. If leadership directs a subordinate to do something unlawful, I'd prefer to hold leadership accountable. Even moreso when leadership just passed a law making it "legal." They may have just been doing what they were told to do. But that's no excuse. If your commander gives you a direct order that you know is illegal, you have both a moral and legal obligation to not follow that order. You also took an oath of office (as the police did or should) to support and defend the Constitution. A single one hour continuing ed class on the Constitution should have told them that what they were doing was illegal. If they didn't know better than it is due to willful ignorance. We are rapidly turning into a police state and the better part of a dozen cops busting a weed store (don't legalize them in the first place) is just another example. If they really wanted to clean up the city, then go do it. Start with the violent crime. There are cities in third world countries safer than NYC. 1
Boomer6 Posted July 1 Posted July 1 1 hour ago, Smokin said: They may have just been doing what they were told to do. But that's no excuse. If your commander gives you a direct order that you know is illegal, you have both a moral and legal obligation to not follow that order. The whole point here is that there is a local law supportig this action. It's not simply a CC telling you to violate a reg. I'm advocating the politicians shoulder the majority of the blame for passing the law in the first place.
Smokin Posted July 1 Posted July 1 (edited) Edit to add: the real military equivalent is a WG/CC writing an illegal sup to a reg that violates Constitutional rights of airman. Someone has paper to hide behind and enforce it, but that doesn't make it legal/right. Takes some balls to stand up to him, but it should be done. I agree that politicians are ultimately to blame. They pass laws that are blatantly unconstitutional and face zero repercussions. Like in the case of the California gun laws I mentioned, courts should start holding politicians in contempt for violating the law. Or I'd love to see someone arrested under an unconstitutional law sue the sponsor lawmaker personally. Not the state or city, but the person that was responsible. Might get politicians to think twice about passing bad laws. Edited July 1 by Smokin 3
Lord Ratner Posted July 1 Posted July 1 21 hours ago, HossHarris said: So the concentration camp guards “just following orders” is valid defense/excuse for you? Well that didn't take long. If you can't tell the difference... To me the bigger outrage is *how* these officers enforced this stupid law. Like Boomer said, I don't expect them to be constitutional scholars, but a cop should be fired for treating a civilian like that during a non-violent encounter. 1
skybert Posted July 14 Posted July 14 2 hours ago, M2 said: Can anyone confirm its authenticity? I’d say if he can’t handle that, he’s probably not someone I’d want with more responsibility
SurelySerious Posted July 14 Posted July 14 I’d say if he can’t handle that, he’s probably not someone I’d want with more responsibility The fact the Lt Col couldn’t make the call is dumb. Make the UOD ABUs or whatever, who cares about a one time exception to an idiotic mandate? A shit unit commander. 1
Sua Sponte Posted July 14 Posted July 14 3 hours ago, M2 said: Can anyone confirm its authenticity? That's real.
DirkDiggler Posted July 14 Posted July 14 29 minutes ago, SurelySerious said: The fact the Lt Col couldn’t make the call is dumb. Make the UOD ABUs or whatever, who cares about a one time exception to an idiotic mandate? A shit unit commander. Agreed, that's some sackless shit.
tac airlifter Posted July 14 Posted July 14 5 hours ago, M2 said: Can anyone confirm its authenticity? Yep, that happened. I can't see the date on my tiny screen but I remember it as being maybe 16 years ago? it's funny to remember blues Monday; what a waste of time and effort that did not accomplish its objective of professionalizing the force, but certainly unified the troops in contempt for senior leadership. Having now retired and looking back I'm amazed at how seemingly smart people can climb the ranks to become senior officers and just do and say and think the dumbest possible shit.
Biff_T Posted July 14 Posted July 14 1 hour ago, tac airlifter said: Having now retired and looking back I'm amazed at how seemingly smart people can climb the ranks to become senior officers Especially a herk driver that looked like George McFly 1
SocialD Posted July 14 Posted July 14 7 hours ago, tac airlifter said: Yep, that happened. I can't see the date on my tiny screen but I remember it as being maybe 16 years ago? it's funny to remember blues Monday; what a waste of time and effort that did not accomplish its objective of professionalizing the force, but certainly unified the troops in contempt for senior leadership. Having now retired and looking back I'm amazed at how seemingly smart people can climb the ranks to become senior officers and just do and say and think the dumbest possible shit. Lol, I remember when he took over and an old college buddy tanker driver was all geeked about there FINALLY being a non-fighter CSAF. A few weeks later...blues Monday. I sent him a screenshot of the memo saying, yay non-fighter guy...he didn't respond! . 3
JeremiahWeed Posted July 14 Posted July 14 16 hours ago, SurelySerious said: The fact the Lt Col couldn’t make the call is dumb. Make the UOD ABUs or whatever, who cares about a one time exception to an idiotic mandate? A shit unit commander. Are we sure this wasn't a tongue in cheek facetious comment by the LtCol taken the wrong way? "Sounds like a pretty big problem Airman, you better forward that to the CoS". 2
uhhello Posted July 14 Posted July 14 1 hour ago, JeremiahWeed said: Are we sure this wasn't a tongue in cheek facetious comment by the LtCol taken the wrong way? "Sounds like a pretty big problem Airman, you better forward that to the CoS". Exactly how I envision it going down
SurelySerious Posted July 14 Posted July 14 Exactly how I envision it going down A pilot, maybe. Intel? Less likely.
brabus Posted July 14 Posted July 14 (edited) Blues Monday - gayer than a bag of dicks (fact, not opinion - Biff completed a blind study in Van Nuys and determined this to be true), but also Snuffy was too fragile to do his brief in blues and would be more comfortable in ABUs…there’s a chance his DO thought he was such a pussy that he deserved to do it in blues. Maybe. Edited July 14 by brabus 1 1
Biff_T Posted July 15 Posted July 15 (edited) 1 hour ago, brabus said: there’s a chance his DO thought he was such a pussy that he deserved to do it in blues. Maybe. This. Edit: @brabus I almost pissed myself again today, but this time it was from laughter. That was a fucked up study in Van Nuys, only a spec ops fighter pilot would understand. Edited July 15 by Biff_T Laughter 1 1
M2 Posted July 19 Posted July 19 I can't fathom why everyone hates AOC! I think she's very friendly with Taylor Swift! 1
Biff_T Posted July 19 Posted July 19 1 hour ago, M2 said: I can't fathom why everyone hates AOC! I think she's very friendly with Taylor Swift! Two gag balls and dibs! 1
Biff_T Posted July 24 Posted July 24 https://www.cnn.com/2024/07/23/science/cocaine-sharks-brazil-scli-intl-scn/index.html
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