The National Anthem

[discus]

#1 Roter, that .PPT kicks ASS! Nice work!

#2 I didn't know that when in civvies the hat was to be held in the left hand. Back in my young days when I was riding rodeo, myself and almost all of my fellow riders held our hats over our heart. Thanks for clearing this up! There is always something to learn!

#3 Yesterday, I was helping to work a concession stand as part of a squadron fundraiser ( ) at the OU football game. We had a bunch of Airmen in there who were also volunteers. As soon as the anthem started playing, myself and my co-workers froze, stood at attention with our hands over our hearts and looked straight ahead. One of the troops set down some jackasses nachos in order to do this. As the anthem played said Jackass said "Hey man, could you just hand me my nachos?"

I have never been so close to coming over a counter in my life. I saw red and had visions of taking this guys head and impaling his face with a napkin dispenser. I said "You can wait for a min. on your nachos dude" while giving him my most piercing gaze I could. He rolled his eyes, turned around and respected our anthem... SHEESH. Just typing this got me riled up on that again.

GREAT THREAD HERE!

[slacker]

Powerful. That powerpoint should be required viewing in every school in America.

Nice job.

[HuggyU2]

#2 I didn't know that when in civvies the hat was to be held in the left hand.

I read that it could also be held in the right hand, while the right hand was over the heart. That would put it up over the shoulder.

HOWEVER,... I believe this is what has led to the masses believing that holding the hat over the heart is the correct posture: folks see it held up there, and assume the hat should be over the heart.

Powerful. That powerpoint should be required viewing in every school in America.

They probably won't do it, but I'll be dropping this PPT off to the principals at my local high schools,... once rotorhead says it's ok.

[Guest Linda]

Goddammit, Rotorhead....

I get all choked-up during the "normal playing" of the National Anthem, and you lay something like this on us!?

I'm going to spread this one around as far as I can... I get the feelin' that some folks "just don't understand."

Thanks for the time you took to put this together - Lord knows it's time consuming. You did a helluva job.

Personal Note:

If you're around KIKR, hollar - I'm around for a couple of weeks, as the "powers that be" decided that I should try to teach these young kids something, and should go through Instructor Upgrade. I'll gladly buy you a beverage. No more 53s to break, so it's left to the 60s and the 22s... *chuckle*

Kind Regards ,

Linda

[Guest Michael]

"'The Star-Spangled Banner' is going on. I don't celebrate this shit. I'm black."

-Dallas Mavericks forward Josh Howard

https://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3592734

[Guest Linda]

Didn't we just have a whole damned thread dedicated to this jackass' buffoonery!?

[Guest Matt5]

How do you guys feel about people trying to run and hide when retreat starts?

I hate it when people do that. We have a problem with that where I'm at. They run into the gym or the chow hall (or just won't come out until it is done) . If you are going to be in the Military then you really need to give respect.

[HuggyU2]

I hate it when people do that. We have a problem with that where I'm at. They run into the gym or the chow hall (or just won't come out until it is done) . If you are going to be in the Military then you really need to give respect.

When you're about to exit the building during reveillee or retreat, and you have folks standing inside waiting who have obviously dodged it, consider walking outside and observing the event. They'll watch you through the glass and either

1. think "that's the better option".

2. think "that was dumb".

Don't worry about the folks from option 2: they're not salvagable. Just let them go away with time.

[08Dawg]

Awesome PPT! While I'm not sure how I feel about saluting in civies, it pisses me off to no end when people sit there and run their damn mouths while the Anthem is being played. The flag means something, stands for something amazing, and we should take the time to recognize that.

[lj35driver]

While I was stationed at KTIK, I had an incident with a couple of dependents making a run for their car at the BX. My family and I were headed to our car when the music kicked off so we stopped where we were. That turned out to be behind someone's minivan parked on the same row we were on. Just after the anthem started playing, two women in high heels and with shopping bags flying ran past us and started getting in the van. The driver yelled at us to get out from behind her car to which I replied the anthem will be over in 30 seconds. She then starts her car and revs the engine while screaming obscenities and threatening to run my family over. WTF! Are you really going to run over my two kids and pregnant wife for what is now about 20 second of your time? After the music stopped, we start walking away and the bitch has the nerve to follow us up the row so she can write down my name and tell me how she's the wife of an important person who I'll be standing at attention in front of before the day is through. She also decides to throw out that he's the DO of sqd XX. After we take a quick visit to my sqd CC and relay the story and how we're considering filing charges against the woman for attempted vehicular assault, her husband was the only one standing at attention before someone "more important" before the day was over.

I know there's no reg's that expressly state that dependents have to pay respects to the flag while on base, but damn it there should be. If my kids can stand at attention and put a hand over their heart for what amounts to 2 minutes, the so can everyone else. I witness a lot of the same crap here at KBIX. When traffic stops base wide for retreat, you'll almost always find someone driving around everyone else who is stopped.

[slacker]

KBIX a few years back:

Driving out the gate by the old NCO club, traffic was backed up to the credit union. I was patiently waiting to leave base when the National Anthem started to play. Traffic slowly pulled forward and I remained still. A gap between my car and the car in front of me developed, 2 car lengths, then 3, and 4. I guess about 5 car lengths was the right amount to piss off the Jackass behind me. He honked his horn during the National Anthem because I didn't pull up 50 feet. My blood started boiling, and traffic kept on creeping forward. The jackass honked again this time a little longer, I guess having 100 feet or more between me and the car infront of me was just more than he could take.

I waited to the end of the Anthem and I slung open my car door and briskly walked to the car behind me. The young SSgt eyes got big as I began yellling and pointing at him as I approached his car. I knocked on his window and gently counseled the young NCO on his behavior. I guess when you're blarring crappy rap music in your hoopty, you can't hear the Anthem. I'll bet the SSgt didn't make the same mistake again.

[The Kayla]

I know there's no reg's that expressly state that dependents have to pay respects to the flag while on base, but damn it there should be. If my kids can stand at attention and put a hand over their heart for what amounts to 2 minutes, the so can everyone else. I witness a lot of the same crap here at KBIX. When traffic stops base wide for retreat, you'll almost always find someone driving around everyone else who is stopped.

It's funny that you say that.

This past summer, I was at the Vance Pool a lot. The guys that would dodge retreat were MILITARY guys (I'm not sexist, but it was only guys that were dodging retreat. I have seen women in uniform do the same thing though.) All the dependents stood quietly, with his or her hand over her heart, till the end.

[lj35driver]

The guys that would dodge retreat were MILITARY guys (I'm not sexist, but it was only guys that were dodging retreat. I have seen women in uniform do the same thing though.) All the dependents stood quietly, with his or her hand over her heart, till the end.

I don't disagree because there's still plenty of mil personnel who dodge it, just that the primary population you see doing it here aren't in uniform.

[The Kayla]

OK, so yesterday I was at the base park with the kiddos I was watching.

Retreat came on. All kids stopped what they were doing, and stood at attention. When the National Anthem came on, we all put out hand over our hearts. I look over yonder, and guess what I see? I see guys in the pic-nic BBQ area (it has a roof), in uniform, standing up (yeah!) but they didn't solute nor did they put their hand over their hearts either.. WTF gives? If the little 2yr old can stay still for the WHOLE NA, with her hand over her heart, why can't these Lts-Capts do the same?

Now, I will let it go is someone can tell me that they were in the OK because they were under a roof?

[Jughead]

someone can tell me that they were in the OK because they were under a roof?

Kayla:

That's the short answer. In very broad terms, you only salute when wearing cover (hat); in equally broad terms, you only wear cover when not otherwise covered (indoors, or, in this case, under a roof). All kinds of exceptions, and all kinds of interpretations and local rules come into play (say, perhaps your location has the whole park as a "no hat, no salute" area; or on the other hand, perhaps there's a local rule that says the park pavillions are not cover for purposes of hat wearing).... Were the folks in question (a) in uniform and (b) not wearing hats? They should stand at attention, but not salute.

BTW--that's pretty cool that the 2yos were showing respect to the nat'l anthem. I know any number of adults who could learn from them....

EDIT: Actually, Nova answered this question in post #3 of this thread--in other words, the folks in question are "indoors" for purposes of this discussion.

Edited April 4, 2009 by Jughead

[The Kayla]

Thanks JugHead..

Edited April 4, 2009 by The Kayla

[M2]

Seriously, you actually thought that a couple of Air Force officers were being disrespectful towards the national anthem, during retreat, and on base?

[The Kayla]

Seriously, you actually thought that a couple of Air Force officers were being disrespectful towards the national anthem, during retreat, and on base?

I'm sorry, I can't tell if you are being sarcastic or not... but, since I have seen first hand AF officers being disresepectful towards the Nathional Athem, during retreat, and on base, this is why I asked if it was OK or not.

[stract]

In very broad terms, you only salute when wearing cover (hat)

That's a Navy thing. When I drive on base in my civvies, I return the gate guard's salute. If I'm told to report into the CC for disciplinary action, or something else equally formal, I salute. We don't wear covers indoor either, unless under arms.

[Jughead]

That's a Navy thing. When I drive on base in my civvies, I return the gate guard's salute. If I'm told to report into the CC for disciplinary action, or something else equally formal, I salute. We don't wear covers indoor either, unless under arms.

Negative. I'm AF, not Navy. As you quoted from my post, I said "very broad terms" (and emphasized the "very"). I salute in the circumstances you cite as well, without a hat on (and, as for the gate example, one always returns a salute, IMHO).

As for indoors, one certainly does wear cover sometimes, such as in a formation or in a "designated outdoor ceremony".... I can't possibly list all the exceptions (hell, I surely don't know all of the exceptions!), and made no attempt to do so.

[bfargin]

I just got this in an email. Not 100% sure if true, but would assume so and a good story nonetheless. I know all of you will be singing with the text at the end!!!!

THE MUSIC STOPPED

This is written by a Chaplain in Iraq

I recently attended a show here at LSA Anaconda. We have a large auditorium we use for movies, as well as memorial services and other large gatherings. As is the custom at all military bases, we stood to attention when the National Anthem began before the main feature. All was going well until three-quarters of the way through The National Anthem, the music stopped.

Now, what would happen if this occurred with 1,000 18-22 year-olds back in the States? I imagine there would be hoots, catcalls, laughter, a few

rude comments, and everyone would sit down and yell for the movie to begin. Of course, that is, if they had stood for the National Anthem in the first place. Here in Iraq , 1,000 Soldiers continued to stand at attention, eyes fixed forward. The music started again and the Soldiers continued

to quietly stand at attention. But again, at the same point, the music stopped. What would you expect 1,000 Soldiers standing at attention to do?? Frankly, I expected some laughter, and everyone would eventually sit down and wait for the movie to start.

But No!!... You could have heard a pin drop, while every Soldier continued to stand at attention. Suddenly, there was a lone voice from the front of the auditorium, then a dozen voices, and soon the room was filled with the voices of a thousand soldiers, finishing where the recording left off: "And the rockets red glare, the bombs bursting in air, gave proof through the night that our flag was still there. Oh, say does that Star Spangled Banner yet wave, o'er the land of the free, and the home of the brave."

It was the most inspiring moment I have had in Iraq and I wanted you to know what kind of Soldiers are serving.

Chaplain at Anaconda

[HerkFE]

Revival: The links to the .ppt do not work anymore. Does someone out there have the file and can post again?

[capt4fans]

Revival: The links to the .ppt do not work anymore. Does someone out there have the file and can post again?

2

I'd love to have it as well.

[HerkFE]

I have it at home and will try to put it on here later. Was hoping to get it sooner so I could give to a co-worker.

[Aerdale]

The National Anthem is not the blues, it's not hip hop, it's not country, it's not rock and roll. It should be sung with all the respect it deserves, straight and sincere. No wobbling around and gliding up to notes, it's beautiful just as it was written. (End rant!).

My band director in high school played the trumpet in a Navy band and said that while playing the Anthem at a large gathering of brass one of the trumper players was doodling around trying for effects and flourishes when he seriously went off key and screwed it up. The following day there was a Navy-wide notice, no one mess with the music, play it straight and proud. I fully support that!!!