JSTARS vs. Slick

[M2]

Go JSTARS; because if this decision isn't fucking obvious, then you don't belong in the Herc....

Cheers! M2

p.s. Oh, and no offense to the E-8 bubbas out there...

[Swizzle]

I always thought the plane was so bad ass that they put the blount end forward and the pointy end backward just to prove the badassness.

Hey hey now...don't mess w/ the beaver tail.

[nsplayr]

Don't sweat it too much man, either way you'll be fine and probably love your plane. BUT...if it were me, I'd take the slick because of the greater mission variety, the FAR better location, and the greater importance of the nav to the C-130 mission than to the JSTARS mission. Plus just from the instructors I knew the C-130 guys were cool as hell and I only knew 1 JSTARS guy who was just more removed and didn't interact with the students as much.

I was sweating my drop night decision as well (b/c our flight commander let us choose in rank order...is that what yours is doing?), and everything turned out great so far. Similar situation in that my wife wanted me to pick the "safer," burning orbits in the sky option and I kinda was leaning towards the more tactical option. I thought about both honestly b/c family should be an important consideration, but in the end I chose the later option b/c I figured you're only young once and I would regret it later if I had picked something "safer" when I could have been kicking ass a little more directly. Not a knock on the JSTARS mission or anyone else for that matter

Good luck & feel free to post your class' drop either in this thread or the track-select assignment night thread.

[TacAirCoug]

I always thought the plane was so bad ass that they put the blount end forward and the pointy end backward just to prove the badassness.

Nah, it's just that we fly so slow that the airflow over the fuselage actually goes from tail to nose, so they had to make the tail the pointy end.

Edit: Someone was going to say it...I just figured it wouldn't hurt as bad if it came from a Herk guy.

Edited March 13, 2009 by TacAirCoug

[Guest uscmas412]

Luckily for me, an E-8 came to Randolph yesterday and the crew did a brief for the students this morning. I decided to take the Slick to Peterson, I think the mission will be awesome.

The class drop:

MC-130 Mildenhall (#1 guy)

C-130 Peterson

2 BUFFs

2 AWACs

1 KC-135

1 E-8

Edited March 13, 2009 by uscmas412

[Guest CmbtWmbt]

Luckily for me, an E-8 came to Randolph yesterday and the crew did a brief for the students this morning. I decided to take the Slick to Peterson, I think the mission will be awesome.

The class drop:

MC-130 Mildenhall (#1 guy)

C-130 Peterson

2 BUFFs

2 AWACs

1 KC-135

1 E-8

You have chosen...wisely.

Edited March 13, 2009 by CmbtWmbt

[Guest Hueypilot812]

You have chosen...wisely.

Agreed...you won't regret the choice. And H3s to boot! (You'll know what I'm talking about when you compare the Es at Little Rock with the H3s at Pete)

[Herk Driver]

I talked to a JSTAR guy today, he had nothing but good things to say about the platform and community. On the other hand I don't see anyone saying his or her job sucked. The problem is I have to make my mind up by tomorrow morning.

I've was assigned to Robins AFB (I'm from GA). I've lived in C-Springs. I obviously am biased toward a particular platform.

You only have one choice here and it is the C-Springs assignment. C-Springs is way better than Warner-Robins. Slick mission, IMHO, is much better than JSTARS. Easy choice.

Edit: Didn't read the entire thread before posting. Good choice.

Edited March 13, 2009 by Herk Driver

[slacker]

Agreed...you won't regret the choice. And H3s to boot! (You'll know what I'm talking about when you compare the Es at Little Rock with the H3s at Pete)

Now take that comparison, multiply it by 69, and that is the H3 to the J. You'll know soon enough.

Congrats on the right choice (although, it was like choosing the fat chick or the super fat chick w/ a tumor on her face.)

[zach braff]

Great choice on the Slick/Peterson. In addition to losing the Macon Whoopee and Macon Music, Macon is also losing it's finest DJ to Davis-Monthan in two weeks. Combine that with a second home at Al Udeid (see "Leadership @ the Deid" thread) = great choice my friend.

ZB

[Guest Hueypilot812]

I'm looking forward to the J...but it won't happen immediately. The 62nd is short of bodies, so I'm sticking around there for a bit until they get healthy...maybe I'll have a class date spring/summer of 2010.

[contraildash]

Good choice on Peterson. I lived in C-Springs for just over four years before I got in the Air Force and I loved every minute of it. If you like to do anything outdoors, it's the place to live.

[hobbitcid]

I am a former JSTARS ABM, leaving the wing just before it became a Guard/AD unit. From the aircrew perspective, the JSTARS NAV position is something of a hybrid. First, the NAV position itself is actually back in the mission crew area (first console). The console is the same as other mission crew consoles with the addition of some flight instruments on the side. This means the JSTARS NAV has access to the same data, imagery and information as the rest of the crew. The NAV mission also involves more than getting the aircraft to tanker, then to the orbit, then back to base. On JSTARS the NAV works very closely with the onboard Intel Officer/Tech on defense of the aircraft. In this area, the NAV works directly for the Aircraft Commander and the Mission Crew Commander. So in some ways, the NAV is both Flight Crew and Mission Crew. One note of warning: The mission crew is primarily made up of ABMs. They start as controllers, moving to sensor management and battle management before becoming mission crew commanders. NAVs have not been selected as MCCs so if you are a NAV, you'll always be a NAV unless you go to ABM training like several of the 116th's WSOs did when they tuned in their B-1s for the E-8 JSTARS. NAVs have been commanders however (including squadron, ops group and wing commander) so they are recognized favorably in the Wing and in the USAF.

Bottom line, If you are going to be an ISR NAV, I think the JSTARS mission is more robust than say the E-3 or RC-135 because you are also part of the mission crew. Those who have flown ISR aicraft will testify to the distinct differences between the flight and mission crew aboard their systems. I have over 3000 hours in the USAF and NATO E-3 as well.

OK, having said that, you should know the downside to flying with JSTARS or any other ISR platform. Basically, you fly loads of hours but don't actually go anywhere. You take off, hit the tanker, then head to the orbit. You then fly a standard pattern for several hours and go home, or back to tanker if your mission is long enough. Missions routinely last from eight to fourteen hours but could go past twenty hours if required. My personal record was 18.5. When I left JSTARS the record was 21 though I think it may have been broken. You deploy to all the same places, all the time... There is very little variation in your schedule. Finally, all ISR systems including JSTARS are known as High Demand/Low Density (HD/LD) systems. As a result, you are gone all the time.

If you want to travel and do something more diverse, then C-130s are probably the best option. You should also note that while I was at JSTARS we got NAVs from all over the USAF (B-52, E-3, RC-135, EC-135, OC-135, KC-135, etc). It will probably be easier for you to go from the C-130 to the E-8C when they switch to the J model than vice versa.

Just my thoughts...