End of the ACU

[FlyinGrunt]

Because they like to think they're "Special" and don't have to play by the same rules as everyone else? Even if ABUs were the most tactically perfect uniform ever devised they'd wear something else to draw attention to themselves.

It's OK, dude. They're tougher than you. No need for the small penis syndrome.

[StoleIt]

Because they like to think they're "Special" and don't have to play by the same rules as everyone else? Even if ABUs were the most tactically perfect uniform ever devised they'd wear something else to draw attention to themselves.

Are you serious?

Please be serious...I need the amusement...

[FlyinGrunt]

Also, somewhat rhetorically, I must ask: what part of Special Tactics don't you understand?

[craino21]

Also, somewhat rhetorically, I must ask: what part of Special Tactics don't you understand?

I should have clarified, I'm speaking more specifically about the PJs in the RQSs. I can't tell you how many times I've seen PJs on alert wearing they're ACUs, MARPAT deserts, or whatever, then when they get alerted for a mission, or go on a training sortie wear a completely different uniform (usually nothing uniform or military about it). At the same time my FEs and Gunners are out preflighting, whatever and until a month ago couldn't wear 2 piece flight suits because they were an Army uniform. Is it jealousy, hell yeah it is.

On an only tangentially related note, I think this is only one symptom of PJs in RQSs drifting away from their core competency, actually rescuing people. Two CSARTFs in the last 6 months at Moody we've had live PJs at the start of the sortie (the only two times I've flown with live PJs in that 6 months by the way). Both times they wanted to do live infils to building take downs for the first half the sortie, then wanted us to fly home and drop them off before the actual CSARTF, you know, the rescue part.

I'm not saying these guys aren't bad ass, can't run farther than me, whatever you want to say. I am saying that they are ParaRESCUE Jumpers, and seem to think they're ParaSpecial Ops Jumpers. There is certainly a place for PJs in STSs, etc, and that changes they're mission set, but that's not every PJ in the AF.

[tac airlifter]

I should have clarified, I'm speaking more specifically about the PJs in the RQSs. I can't tell you how many times I've seen PJs on alert wearing they're ACUs, MARPAT deserts, or whatever, then when they get alerted for a mission, or go on a training sortie wear a completely different uniform (usually nothing uniform or military about it). At the same time my FEs and Gunners are out preflighting, whatever and until a month ago couldn't wear 2 piece flight suits because they were an Army uniform. Is it jealousy, hell yeah it is.

On an only tangentially related note, I think this is only one symptom of PJs in RQSs drifting away from their core competency, actually rescuing people. Two CSARTFs in the last 6 months at Moody we've had live PJs at the start of the sortie (the only two times I've flown with live PJs in that 6 months by the way). Both times they wanted to do live infils to building take downs for the first half the sortie, then wanted us to fly home and drop them off before the actual CSARTF, you know, the rescue part.

I'm not saying these guys aren't bad ass, can't run farther than me, whatever you want to say. I am saying that they are ParaRESCUE Jumpers, and seem to think they're ParaSpecial Ops Jumpers. There is certainly a place for PJs in STSs, etc, and that changes they're mission set, but that's not every PJ in the AF.

Of all the truely jacked up and retarded things we experience in the Air Force, you choose what uniforms PJs wear as the appropriate place to take a stand and pitch your bitch? Foul. They can dress like friggen clowns for all I care, those dudes are operators hacking the mission and their cosmetic appearence doesn't take away from their professionalism and the awesome job they've done everytime I've been around them. Seriously bro, can't we just stick to complaining about finance (who stole 400$ from me this month) or SFS and let the dudes fighting the war get on with it unmolested?

[craino21]

Of all the truely jacked up and retarded things we experience in the Air Force, you choose what uniforms PJs wear as the appropriate place to take a stand and pitch your bitch? Foul. They can dress like friggen clowns for all I care, those dudes are operators hacking the mission and their cosmetic appearence doesn't take away from their professionalism and the awesome job they've done everytime I've been around them. Seriously bro, can't we just stick to complaining about finance (who stole 400$ from me this month) or SFS and let the dudes fighting the war get on with it unmolested?

Fair point, and you're right. There's not another group of selfless patriots I want to come snatch my pink ass out of the fire than a couple of Jolly's with PJs in the back. Threadjack complete. So, Army wants new unis huh?

[Stretch]

Seriously bro, can't we just stick to complaining about finance (who stole 400$ from me this month)

Mini thread-jack...

2... they're trying to hit me for $2550.

And now back to your regularly scheduled thread.

[Guest Flyin' AF Hawaiian]

Looks like they're going to start wear-testing Multicam and another pattern called UCP-Delta within the next month or so.

Army Article

WASHINGTON (Army News Service, Sept. 17, 2009) -- Servicemembers fighting in Afghanistan will soon see two new test camouflage patterns on the backs of fellow Soldiers.

By the end of September, the Army will begin shipping uniforms with the "MultiCam" and "Universal Camouflage Pattern - Delta" to two yet-unnamed battalions that will serve rotations in Afghanistan -- one pattern each. Additionally, the Army will provide "ghillie suits," in the MultiCam pattern, to authorized units.

Soldiers, about 2,000 in all, will test out the uniforms to see how effective the camouflage patterns are at providing concealment in the varying terrain of Afghanistan.

The Army will gather feedback from Soldiers wearing the uniforms and use that, along with other testing and evaluation, to make a decision to produce and field alternative uniforms and operational clothing and individual equipment to some units serving as part of Operation Enduring Freedom.

"I think we will make decisions in Afghanistan in the January time frame, and also we will have finished the picture study," said Col. William E. Cole, a project manager with PM Soldier Protection and Individual Equipment.

Program Executive Office Soldier, the agency responsible for developing the uniforms, will additionally test the efficacy of several other camouflage patterns in Afghanistan -- though those will not be handed out to Soldiers there.

"That will determine what other uniform options they could have in Afghanistan," Cole added. "So to the commanders in Afghanistan, we'll be able to show them the data and say here's what we found, different results in different areas with different uniforms, what would you like to do? And of course we will support the commanders."

Cole said after a decision is made about fielding an optional camouflage pattern to commanders, uniforms bearing that pattern could be available in a relatively short time.

"We'd start fielding the first units easily within six months of the decision," Cole said.

Were new uniforms to be introduced, Cole said, they would be the same as what Soldiers are already wearing -- the ACU. It would be the camouflage printed on the fabric that would change. And the new uniforms would be an option for commanders -- something available were field conditions to warrant it.

"As a material provider, I want to be responsive to the Soldiers I support," Cole said. "I want to give commanders options, I want to be responsive to Soldiers. That is what we were trying to do -- we're working to give (them) more options."

The "MultiCam" pattern, one of the two to be issued in Afghanistan, is actually a commercial product and bears similarities to what was featured on the now discontinued "Battle Dress Uniform." The "Universal Camouflage Pattern - Delta," is similar to what Soldiers are wearing now, with the addition of the color "Coyote Brown."

[Guest ecupirate]

Since I'm in the army I'll give my two cents on this unifrom debacle. The problem is the same as every other service, desk surfing idiots making the decisions. The ACU was a mistake hell no one wanted it, when tested against what we had already BDU/DCU everyone said just sew some pockets on the sleeves of the DCU and drive on no need for a completely new uniform and especially no need for all that freakin velcro. Did the army listen? nope So now we have a uniform that does camoflauge the wearer as he makes his way to chow across the massive expanses of gravel on the FOB in which 95% of them never leave. The combat shirt does work good, the sleeves are kinda thick but hey the t-shirt like torso part is awesome. Talked to some AF guys at the DFAC the other day they said they were field testing an AF version of the combat shirt but they didn't like it because it had to many pockets, they said it literally had like 6 pen slots with flaps to cover them as well. In regards to multi-cam the army needs to field it to who needs it right now it does work better if it didn't the rangers, sf and others wouldn't use it. However the pogs back stateside will get jealous and we will end up wasting a shit ton of money to refit everyone. Alot of army folks are of the opinion to field the mutlticam to deployed units and keep the acu as a garrison uniform. However I doubt that will happen. It seems to me that the army, airforce, and navy are in a battle against each other to see who can waste more money on uniforms. If we switch completely to multicam I think we'll take the lead. IMHO the marine's got it right they're uniforms look good and actually work.

[usaf36031]

until a month ago couldn't wear 2 piece flight suits because they were an Army uniform. Is it jealousy, hell yeah it is.

Wait... You guys WANT to wear the 2 piece army flight uniform thing? All of the army guys here at Rucker bitch endlessly about the fact that they had their bags taken away. Am I missing something?

[stract]

tan two-piece flight suits are awesome! Yes, you are missing something. I think we discussed it in the Flight Suit thread...

[usaf36031]

Why are they awesome? Are they more comfortable than a bag?

[Fontus]

Why are they awesome? Are they more comfortable than a bag?

I believe they are much more comfortable than a bag, and come with several advantages. When it is hot, you can take the top off. (you don't have to do the unzip and tie your sleeves around the waist thing). When you have to take a deuce, it is much easier (should be self explanatory). I have always found the desert flight suits uncomfortable, though I don't know why they would be any different than the green ones. Two piece is the way to go if you can get them.

Fontus