F-15 RAPTOR being sold to Saudi!

[DFRESH]

I pictured the cleaning lady from family guy after reading your post, usaf36031.

Noooo.... misser superman no es here.

[AZwildcat]

Us: "Dude, your boldface is due NOW"

Saudi kid in T-6 class: "No...isss okaayyy...I do tomorrow...ok....no problem..."

Haha! This wouldn't be the same Saudi kid who lit up an airmen (and his supervisor) at the front gate for not saluting him?

[Guest Marshall]

Now all they need is a bunch of B-52 Lancers and they're good to go...

[Toro]

I have a metric shitload of Saudi assclownery stories. These are not mine, but good...

On the flying front, Saudi S-model crew has UTL A failure, decides to take cable. Lands well past cable (about the same distance as Seymour’s). Decides to stay on runway and take departure end. Never uses any braking (aero/emer/nothing) and takes dep end at nearly 120 knots. Drags it nearly past the overrun. Not a word spoken in jet for last 5 minutes of flight.

Saudi demonstration team lines up for 8-ship deployment (2+2+2+2 departure :15 second spacing). 1st two ship, uneventful. 2nd two ship, one gets airborne, one has problem, does way high speed abort, then punches out at end of runway. 3rd two ship decides 15 seconds is way too much and does about a 5 second spacing departure and high speed aborts behind wreckage (one more ejection apparently for mutual support). Last two ship again decides spacing too much and does high speed abort through wreckage. Remaining airborne 3 ship decides now to "land back on the single runway" to see how the bros are doing. FOD all quads. Demo team now grounded.

C-model starts/taxis/makes it through arming, with door 3R still propped open. Wingman finally notices while lining up for form T/O.

I finally got to fly last month. Second sortie (no-shit Blue vs Blue where the goal apparently is to keep aborting until Bingo) I say fuck this and press to merge. End up gunning the King’s son. In debrief he said my shot was not valid. I asked if he saw the tape. He says “No, but didn’t you hear my terminate for gas call a minute earlier?” to which I replied “well, why were you still putting out flares then?” He’s not happy with me.

[Steve Davies]

Hope they get on better with the F-15 Raptor than they do the Eurofighter.

On the day that they sign a Eurofighter training agreement with the Spanish, a Saudi Lt Col is killed flying one:

From Flight Global

A Eurofighter aircraft has crashed at Spain's Morón air base with one fatality, theSpanish ministry of defencehas confirmed.The combat aircraft, which was on a regular training flight, crashed into the ground "moments after take-off" from the base near Seville, according to the ministry's statement.

It was being piloted under dual control by a lieutenant colonel from the Saudi Arabian air force, who was killed, and a Spanish air force commander, who ejected before the crash.

The ministry says the Spanish pilot is "well" and required only a "basic" level of medical attention.

CITAAM, the Spanish body responsible for investigating military aircraft accidents, has despatched a team to Morón to identify the causes of the incident.

The Saudi lieutenant colonel was at the Spanish base after the two nations signed a Eurofighter training contract.

[usaf36031]

Haha! This wouldn't be the same Saudi kid who lit up an airmen (and his supervisor) at the front gate for not saluting him?

I dunno man...but I can still smell that kids cologne from here! Had to have been 7 full sprays prior to stepping out the door.

[Guest]

He says “No, but didn’t you hear my terminate for gas call a minute earlier?” to which I replied “well, why were you still putting out flares then?” He’s not happy with me.

Awesome. This is good stuff, keep the updates coming.

Reminds me of one of my first RF debriefs when a C-model guy was walking through an AIM-9 kill on a gomer. The gomer quibbled on and on about a wing rock and the C-model guy, who was obviously confident and trying to be cool about the whole thing said "Seriously dude? Ok then, let me look at my shot again. Ah, sorry I mispoke. What I meant to say was timeout Fox-3 kill the LGPOS supersonic and puking flares at 200' over the dog lady." The room got quiet, the gomer commander stood up and looked at his guy (who proceeded to look at his boots) and said "color him white." Buffonery beers at the big house.

[Guest Hueypilot812]

I have a metric shitload of Saudi assclownery stories. These are not mine, but good...

On the flying front, Saudi S-model crew has UTL A failure, decides to take cable. Lands well past cable (about the same distance as Seymour’s). Decides to stay on runway and take departure end. Never uses any braking (aero/emer/nothing) and takes dep end at nearly 120 knots. Drags it nearly past the overrun. Not a word spoken in jet for last 5 minutes of flight.

Saudi demonstration team lines up for 8-ship deployment (2+2+2+2 departure :15 second spacing). 1st two ship, uneventful. 2nd two ship, one gets airborne, one has problem, does way high speed abort, then punches out at end of runway. 3rd two ship decides 15 seconds is way too much and does about a 5 second spacing departure and high speed aborts behind wreckage (one more ejection apparently for mutual support). Last two ship again decides spacing too much and does high speed abort through wreckage. Remaining airborne 3 ship decides now to "land back on the single runway" to see how the bros are doing. FOD all quads. Demo team now grounded.

C-model starts/taxis/makes it through arming, with door 3R still propped open. Wingman finally notices while lining up for form T/O.

I finally got to fly last month. Second sortie (no-shit Blue vs Blue where the goal apparently is to keep aborting until Bingo) I say this and press to merge. End up gunning the King’s son. In debrief he said my shot was not valid. I asked if he saw the tape. He says “No, but didn’t you hear my terminate for gas call a minute earlier?” to which I replied “well, why were you still putting out flares then?” He’s not happy with me.

Reminds me of the Iraqis. Finally finished training some copilots. Next phase is they fly with IqAF instructors for the mission training...usually takes about 3 rides so they can get used to doing operational stuff. One of them is on ride 6 and still going...basically, he's a tard and can't talk on the radio and has trouble doing basic things. He was the only one of the copilots to Q-3 their US-administered eval, but we retrained him and sent him on his way. Anyways, he's in the scheduling office complaining about not being certed as a line copilot.

IqAF squadron DO asks me "what should I do about him? He doesn't want to fly another training mission because he is embarrassed that the others finished in 3 flights". I say so what, that's just how it is. The copilot explains to me that he cannot have another training flight...to do so would be a huge humiliation to him. I said fine, then tomorrow can be your mission eval. He backs up and says "but I am not ready".

"Great, then go have another training flight...easy decision to me" I say. The DO and copilot argue in Iraqi secure (Arabic). The DO is still pressing me to make a decision for him, and I keep saying "it's your squadron, your Air Force...and your decision". He's exasperated, and by this time the copilot is pulling his name off the schedule and crying like a kid. I look at the DO and say "if he was my guy, I'd pull him off the schedule for a month and let him think about his priorities".

After more back and forth, the squadron DO declares "I have a solution...he is certified effective today". I turned around and immediately said "WHAT THE ? THAT is your decision?". And that's how they solved that problem.

UFB.

Not all those guys were clowns...there were some really good dudes I flew with that genuinely cared and tried hard. But 70% of them were there just to strut around in a flight suit and call themselves Colonel.

------

Another day, we were scheduled to fly to Q-West and then Al Sahra to do a site survey for the Iraqi Air Force, along with some US CAFTT members. Morning of the flight, the Iraqi CAOC added a leg to our mission...to take some ministers up to Mosul and drop them off, and to pick them up when they were done. Because Mosul has shitty lighting, the IqAF pilots were restricted to daylight only flights, which meant we had to pick up the government ministers before sunset. Because of this, we had to cut one of the legs for the IqAF survey team, so we cut out Al Sahra and rescheduled it.

So now, our mission is ORBM, drop off the government officials, then head to ORQW for the survey team, let them do their thing for a couple hours, then reboard the survey team and pick up the government dudes at ORBM before dark and carry everyone back to ORBI (Baghdad). The CAFTT dudes were pissed, but that's how it went...DVs were more important.

We arrive at ORBM and offload the government ministers who then promptly board three IqAF UH-1H Hueys waiting with rotors turning. I ask the crew where they were headed to...one of them says "they are going to the funeral of a very important local leader". Ok, sounds fine. We finish the engine-running offload and depart for ORQW, which isn't far from ORBM.

On the ground at ORQW, the US CAFTT guys and the IqAF generals are talking to me about how much time they have to do the site survey. I'm looking at my watch and doing math and flight planning in my head and determine they have about two hours...not enough but that's all we can give them before they need to be back on the airplane so we can pick up our DVs up north.

Right as the CAFTT/IqAF team board vans and busses to take them around the airfield, I hear the distinctive "whop whop whop" of Hueys. Now, I'm a former Army aviator and I know the Army doesn't operate Hueys in Iraq...only the Marines and the IqAF do. I look over there, and here come three camo'd UH-1Hs of the IqAF landing on the ramp. I turn to the IqAF general and ask "hey, are those the same aircraft the government guys got on in Mosul?". He said "yes, yes, the funeral they are attending is here".

At that point, I just stare at him...and he said "they did not want to drive from Mosul..."

Yeah, got that. But did you bother to notice that WE are at the same airfield THEY are now at? Why didn't we just fly them here to ORQW, drop off the government guys here, and do the surveys here and at ORSH??? ORQW has good runway lighting, so the IqAF crews can fly here at night...

I didn't know if I should laugh or beat my head (sts) into the pavement at this point.

In the end, the IqAF generals asked why they didn't do both surveys, and they (Iraqis) blamed the American advisors...as usual. And as usual, our USAF staff officers in the green zone were asking us "why did you screw up?". I spent the next day writing email after email defending us from our own USAF leadership, when it was the Iraqi CAOC and JOC planners that planned the idiotic mission in the first place.

[Gravedigger]

I have a metric shitload of Saudi assclownery stories.

Reminds me of the Iraqis.

Wow.

Don't know what to say, keep up the good work guys!

Edited August 25, 2010 by Gravedigger

[Toro]

Awesome. This is good stuff, keep the updates coming.

Keep reading, I'll keep posting. Here are a few more....

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As we’re debriefing, lead is watching our tape and can hear a loud beeping in the middle of our engagement that he recognizes as the ILS beacon. So he asks me how I can fly with the ILS that loud. I told him that I never turn up my ILS volume and that the VTRS records the system volumes based off the settings selected by the rear cockpit. Now all eyes turn to my WSO. “Oh…that’s the ILS?” he says, “I thought that was the RWR”

---------

We were in the VFR traffic pattern and the student was practicing his landings. He seemed to think that the aircraft throttles were a Popeil “Set it and Forget It” cooker – he slammed them up to full power and forgot about it until I told him we were about to overspeed the gear, then he pulled them back to idle until the jet was about to stall

Me – “Push your power up, you’re slow”

Him – “Okay, copy”

Me – “Push your power up, you’re slow”

Him – “Okay, copy”

Me (as jet begins to buffet approaching stall speed) – “HEY, POWER UP NOW!”

Him – “Okay, copy”

Me – “I have the jet (power comes up). Do you understand me? Do you understand that I’m telling you to push up your power?”

Him – “Okay, copy”

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Note:Fox 3 is an AIM-120 AMRAAM radar missile, Fox 2 is a heat-seeker (AIM-9)

I briefed my sortie today with a senior-ranking major IP SEFE as my 2B. I briefed the motherhood, but had him start out with the BFM exercise - Radar Heat to Guns. It's the first time these guys have ever seen a BFM setup and he briefs 90% of the setup as "standard". Then he starts talking about taking shots and goes into a total tangent on his thoughts on weapons employment. He says that in this exercise "we will shoot the Fox 3," but normally in a close fight you don't want to "shoot the Fox 3," because....are you ready....I swear to God I'm not making this up, "the AMRAAM is a very expensive missile." I don't even know how to respond to this, and as I get on my G-strain and start to get back some of the light, he says, "The Fox 2 is cheaper to shoot, and it is much harder to defeat."

Major SEFE IP with over 1500 hours. Un-f***-ing believable.

[Cooter]

My old man builds the Mudhen at Boeing in STL and has had countles stories of thier buffoonery. Including one of a dude trying to check the wing tank and using his Bic lighter to see fatrther into it. The result was an F-15 burnt to slag. I think anyone who has ever dealt with "these" people knows they are either completely incompetent or just soooooo lazy they are ridicuously dangerous.

Cooter

[Buddy Spike]

----------

Note:Fox 3 is an AIM-120 AMRAAM radar missile, Fox 2 is a heat-seeker (AIM-9)

I briefed my sortie today with a senior-ranking major IP SEFE as my 2B. I briefed the motherhood, but had him start out with the BFM exercise - Radar Heat to Guns. It's the first time these guys have ever seen a BFM setup and he briefs 90% of the setup as "standard". Then he starts talking about taking shots and goes into a total tangent on his thoughts on weapons employment. He says that in this exercise "we will shoot the Fox 3," but normally in a close fight you don't want to "shoot the Fox 3," because....are you ready....I swear to God I'm not making this up, "the AMRAAM is a very expensive missile." I don't even know how to respond to this, and as I get on my G-strain and start to get back some of the light, he says, "The Fox 2 is cheaper to shoot, and it is much harder to defeat."

Major SEFE IP with over 1500 hours. Un-f***-ing believable.

Doesn't sound much different than us. "Use all your chaff because it's the end of the year and we have a shit ton..." "No wait, we're almost out.. only if you absolutely need it.." "Wait, nevermind, bad calculation... use it everywhere.. the pattern, takeoff, whatever you can manage."

[Guest Raptor08]

A few more golden gem stories like the ones above and I think this could turn into a classic thread.

[gmwalk]

Not a pilot story but still a good one. Back when I was at Chanute (this will give you an idea of how long ago this is.) A friend of mine was a Master Sgt and was cross training to missiles at Chanute. The AF was also training Israelis, Saudis and Iraqis at Chanute. They had to be kept separate to keep them from killing each other. Good times. Separate dorms, classrooms, and meal times.

Well the AF felt it was ok to mix theses guys in with US guys in the dorms. My buddy had an Iraqi dude as a roommate. My buddy was always complaining about the lack of showers and abundance of cologne his Iraqi roommate used. My friend complained directly to the guy about the smell and the reply was "that this is a good, manly smell."

Anyway, my buddy decided that it would be good to take his roommate out on the town one night. We were planning on going over to Champagne and hit some college bars over there. The Iraqi dude jumps in the front seat and off we go. My buddy turns on his CB radio and starts asking about speed traps on the way. Iraqi dude starts looking nervous. So I ask him if he is ok? The guy replies "In my country only secret police have radios in private cars." My buddy with missing a beat and completely straight faced "Yeah its the same here too."

I thought the Iraqi dude was going to mess himself right then and there. Next day, Iraqi dude moves out. Word was no other FN would move in with him.

[Guest Hueypilot812]

My buddy was always complaining about the lack of showers and abundance of cologne his Iraqi roommate used. My friend complained directly to the guy about the smell and the reply was "that this is a good, manly smell."

Ah, yes...the Iraqi man-stew smell. Imagine a C-130E flight deck, mid-summer. It's 120 degrees outside and probably 20 degrees warmer on the flight deck. There are four Iraqi aircrew on the flight deck, and others keep running up on the flight deck to do their man-kissing and schmoozing that Arabs love to do...so at any given time there are about 5-7 Iraqis on the flight deck. They all have their Sex Panther cologne on, and most haven't showered in a while...

And I'm in the middle of it all turning various shades of green, trying not to breathe.

The man-stew...that and the halitosis. No kidding, I would be in the left seat and the copilot or engineer would speak in my direction and I'd almost pass out. The chow hall was handing out free "Ice Cubes" gum, so we'd always grab a handful and give them to the Iraqis. They'd say "thanks!" and stick it in their pocket, but I'd say "no, I want you to put one or two of those in your mouth (sts) and chew...now!".

After upgrading one of them to Aircraft Commander (he was actually a really good dude flying-wise and I felt he would remain safe and not kill anyone), he dropped by my office to give me a gift for helping him upgrade. The gift was several bottles of Iraqi cologne. I said thanks and he walked out...the other dude in my office and I decided to check the stuff out...all I can say is HOLY SHIT that stuff is strong, and smelled of musk ox. We had to evacuate the office until lunch, to let it air out.

[Beaver]

I only fought the Saudi's once. Their 4 Eagles were blue, and our 4 Vipers were red, 2 escort and 2 strikers. Strikers were Aim-9 only. The highlights:

A) 2 Eagle dudes held hands in the brief

B) They were supposed to defend their BX but aborted to about 10 miles behind their target, to the point that 4 completely left the airspace

C) We bombed their BX

D) 2 different dudes touched each other in the debrief

[Toro]

Strikers were Aim-9 only.

It doesn't matter what you give them. The stories continue....

---------------------

With the RSAF recently acquiring AMRAAM, they decided to do 4v2 SAT sorties. Sounds great in theory except for the fact that nobody wants to try to practice their AMRAAM tactics, they want to keep doing the same thing they've always done. On this first sortie I was #2 of the 4-ship; the plan was for 3 and 4 to run in low as strikers while 1 and 2 push in high with no intent of killing the bandits, but rather turning tail at 20 miles to get the bandits to follow us off target and clear the way for the strikers. I ask why we don't plan on committing on the bandits and killing them rather than trying to lure them away. Flight lead tells me it's his plan and we're gonna do it. Uh...okay.

Fast forward to the push - flight lead calls commit and I go blitzing into 30s before I realize that lead is hanging out back down in the 20s because he doesn't intend to shoot. As I approach a WEZ, I have to roll and pull back down because I'm padlocked on lead. I still manage to get a shot off and even though the missile goes active, lead goes out. Of course, lead's plan doesn't work and the red air is not lured off target. Instead, they commit on the strikers at low altitude while we are running away like little bitches. Strikers try unsuccessfully to climb to commit - 2 dead strikers. We pitch back hot with no SA other than the comm-jam that's occurring on the radio between the read air and dead strikers. Terminate the entire engagement for loss of SA and strikers ghost to the target.

Great plan

-------------

Note: Spades is a brevity code for an aircraft with no friendly modes or codes, paints is an aircraft with friendly codes.

I'm leading the RSAF blue 4-ship. My plan is to marshal and ingress in a 4-ship wall. As I brief this, one of the RSAF guys raises his hand and says, "Why do we do this? 4-Ship wall is hard - why do we not do Fluid? It is much easier."

I tell him "noted" and we press with the plan.

I brief red air that they have standard threat replication limitations, but they can run whatever game plan they want. 30 miles from the target my wingman (low looker) picks up a contact down in the weeds. I press 3 and 4 to the target and tell 2 to target the group. Shortly after that I hear "Spades .... Paints....Fox 3". Turns out #2 put our IFF into their interrogator for some reason - and obviously got paints - then decided "WTF" and shot him. In the debrief I asked the bandit what his game plan was and he said he was beam-capping over the target at 500 AGL at 250 KCAS. After I put my jaw back in my mouth, we had a little discussion about Training Rules and the fact that his presentation was not only stupid, but completely tactically unsound unless he was trying present the picture of a MiG practicing his VFR traffic patterns. During the debrief I didn’t review the tapes for the target attack, but asked if everybody hit their target. 3B raised his hand and said that he didn't get a chance to map - because I did not build a mapping leg into the route and he therefore forgot - so he dropped on a NAV des despite me briefing A/G ROE of an 0.67 HRM des (they have no TPODs).

Let's summarize those objectives:

• Detect, Target, ID, Kill all Red Air...nope.

• 100% valid shots IAW ROE...nope.

• 100% DMPI capture IAW ROE....nope.

[SuperWSO]

I only fought the Saudi's once. Their 4 Eagles were blue, and our 4 Vipers were red, 2 escort and 2 strikers. Strikers were Aim-9 only. The highlights:

A) 2 Eagle dudes held hands in the brief

B) They were supposed to defend their BX but aborted to about 10 miles behind their target, to the point that 4 completely left the airspace

C) We bombed their BX

D) 2 different dudes touched each other in the debrief

Great stories one and all. I just wondered how A and D differed from a standard Eagle debrief?

I saw the shot and I took it....