mxfreak54 Posted January 14, 2014 Posted January 14, 2014 (edited) Well that it was I am trying to avoid, but I don't see any clear answer. I have also been searching through the other PCS thread. Buy a cheap shitty mo ped and put it in the trailer? seems to be the best answer to get the weight and not get butt raped in prison. Edit-Sounds good brabus Edited January 14, 2014 by mxfreak54
Jughead Posted January 15, 2014 Posted January 15, 2014 (edited) Can I argue that this is a "motorcycle trailer" even though I am not transporting a motorcycle in it so I can get reimbursed for the weight? It doesn't stop being a motorcycle trailer because you put a non-motorcycle item in/on it. The JFTR language that includes the trailer in HHG is "and/or the associated trailer"--the "or" is the key part in this case. JFTR App. A., Pt. 1, "Household Goods (HHG)" definition, Para A.4.e. You will likely have to fight TMO, but you will be correct. My last three moves (2x PCS & retirement) were under the current rules [those who said you can "always" count a trailer are thinking of the previous rules, it's no longer true], and I had to do battle with 2 of the 3 TMOs I dealt with [and, hell, I had 2 motorcycles on the damn thing!]... twice each (inbound & outbound, though the outbound PCS didn't put up too much a fight, since they weren't going to be paying it).... That's why I know that particular JFTR definition so well. Point out to TMO that they're relying on the wrong paragraph (A.4.h) when they try to deny your "utility trailer," and that A.4.e. clearly defines your motorcycle trailer as HHG. Make them appeal it to the JPPSO if no one local will approve it--I had to do that twice, and they got it right 2 for 2.... EDIT: Clarification Edited January 15, 2014 by Jughead 1
mxfreak54 Posted January 15, 2014 Posted January 15, 2014 It doesn't stop being a motorcycle trailer because you put a non-motorcycle item in/on it. The JFTR language that includes the trailer in HHG is "and/or the associated trailer"--the "or" is the key part in this case. JFTR App. A., Pt. 1, "Household Goods (HHG)" definition, Para A.4.e. You will likely have to fight TMO, but you will be correct. My last three moves (2x PCS & retirement) were under the current rules [those who said you can "always" count a trailer are thinking of the previous rules, it's no longer true], and I had to do battle with 2 of the 3 TMOs I dealt with [and, hell, I had 2 motorcycles on the damn thing!]... twice each (inbound & outbound, though the outbound PCS didn't put up too much a fight, since they weren't going to be paying it).... That's why I know that particular JFTR definition so well. Point out to TMO that they're relying on the wrong paragraph (A.4.h) when they try to deny your "utility trailer," and that A.4.e. clearly defines your motorcycle trailer as HHG. Make them appeal it to the JPPSO if no one local will approve it--I had to do that twice, and they got it right 2 for 2.... EDIT: Clarification Solid advice, exactly what I was looking for, seemed like there was a loophole there, I just wanted confirmation that it could/should be able to be done.
sky_king Posted January 15, 2014 Posted January 15, 2014 So what makes an enclosed trailer, a "motorcycle trailer"?
Jughead Posted January 15, 2014 Posted January 15, 2014 So what makes an enclosed trailer, a "motorcycle trailer"? In my case, pretty freakin' simple: I transported not one but two motorcycles on it. Additionally, it has two pairs of wheel chocks (front & rear) and tie-down points designed for motorcycles; transporting motorcycles is the purpose for which I bought it, and for which all modifications I've made to it have been designed. In the OP's case, I'm assuming his trailer is equally clearly a "motorcycle trailer," since he stated he bought it for a previous move but has since sold the motorcycle. If that's not the case, he may have a more uphill climb with TMO (which is already a PITA, as noted). He may need to prove his case (that it is a m/c trailer, was purchased and has previously been used for that purpose, etc.); so long as it is, in fact, a motorcycle trailer, he's good to go.... In the case of someone trying to say, "Look, it's a motorcyle trailer!" for a trailer that does not otherwise qualify as HHG, and who does not own or transport motorcycles on it, and which is not designed to transport motorcycles--i.e., which is not, in fact, a motorcycle trailer.... Well, now you're in the territory that ThreeHoler & brabus warned against--don't do it!
Rusty Pipes Posted January 15, 2014 Posted January 15, 2014 Maybe I'm just missing something here, but if you are just trying to make a couple hundred bucks as a poor LT and you have a motorcycle trailer for a motorcycle that you no longer have then why don't you just sell the currently useless trailer? If you are actually going to use it to move household goods instead of renting a u-haul trailer or something then you are just talking about getting paid for the weight of the actual trailer? If that is the case... hey, I remember being a poor LT too, but it isn't worth the hassle. I'd say just use it for your move getting paid for the weight of your futon, 19 inch tube tv and porn collection and then sell it for a few hundred bucks at your next base. The last thing you need is to walk in the door of your next Base and have some TMO clown calling your boss saying he has an LT trying to scam the system over $169.
sky_king Posted January 15, 2014 Posted January 15, 2014 So you're saying a 7x14 enclosed trailer filled top to bottom with everything except a motorcycle I probably shouldn't claim? Looking at the rules it says you can claim a trailer if it's less that 8x12. Is that total length (hitch to tail light) or nominal length (box size... stop laughing, pervs)? If so, I may be returning my trailer for a slightly smaller one.
Rusty Pipes Posted January 15, 2014 Posted January 15, 2014 WTF??? I've only PCS'd 9 times with a u-haul dragging behind me on all but 2 trips (not recommended to drive to or from Kadena) and I don't ever remember there being someone from TMO sitting there taking pictures of the size of my trailer or ever giving half a fuck what the dimensions were. I weighed it empty, I weighed it full... I gave them the receipts for both weights and they gave me money. Just don't go to Home Depot and buy a bunch of cinder blocks to put in the trailer or have a bunch of your buddies sitting in the back of it when you weigh it and you should be fine unless they have dramatically change the rules since my last PCS a few years ago. Of course I could have been doing it completely illegally the whole time... I ain't got time for that TMO rules shit!
Bender Posted January 15, 2014 Posted January 15, 2014 Are we talking about the weight of the trailer itself (i.e. as a HHG item), or simply the contents inside the trailer (be it motorcycles or other crap)? I think there may be two different conversations going on here. Bendy
mxfreak54 Posted January 15, 2014 Posted January 15, 2014 The weight of the trailer itself. The way I understand it I get the weight of the HHG items in the trailer either way. Under old rules (before 2009) you could count the empty weight of the trailer toward your HHG weight and get paid for it, The new rules require the trailer to be under 12ft tongue to tail, and only have sides 24 or 46 inches high or something like that. The JFTR link is above for those who care. However under a different paragraph as Jughead said, if its a motorcycle trailer the weight of the trailer itself can be counted. Seeing how the trailer is a motorcycle trailer, I want to try to count the empty weight of the trailer toward my HHG weight, I just currently don't have a motorcycle in the trailer. A old mentor of mine suggested to try to get the weight ticket to describe the trailer as motorcycle trailer (it has tie downs bolted in the floor). I have been told they may not even ask and push it through, if they do ask site the reg. If they continue to put up a fight just let it go. As I said above, I am not trying to defraud the gov, just would like to get extra reimbursement if legally possible. The trailer is 1500lbs, I am getting about 72 cents a pound, so that is about a extra $1100 bucks before taxes.
Bender Posted January 16, 2014 Posted January 16, 2014 Sounds like you're good to go with the way forward here then. I think getting the weigh ticket to state that is a good idea (as it could make things easier later), but I think you'll need to ask for that specifically. The guy should be pretty understanding of the fact you need this one to be correctly described (heck, he may have even seen this situation before, maybe). If it's a motorcycle trailer (motorcycle or not), claim it. If they give you a hard time, I would be ready to go with the JFTR references and some specs and pictures of the thing. If it's a HHG, it's a HHG. If you're correct via the regulations, just be professional, respectful, and humble as you fight your battles and you'll be fine. Not doing/being so is what will end you up in the Sq/CC's office in your blues at 0600. Bendy
Finance_Guy Posted January 31, 2014 Posted January 31, 2014 (edited) DITY W2s on my pay were wrong. DFAS is fixing the corrupted file and will post tomorrow Edited January 31, 2014 by Finance_Guy
Gravedigger Posted January 31, 2014 Posted January 31, 2014 Thanks FG! I have been asking what the deal was, and couldn't find a straight answer.
war007afa Posted March 1, 2014 Posted March 1, 2014 What's the going rate per pound per mile these days? Anyone have feedback on the uhaul pods?
baileynme Posted March 1, 2014 Posted March 1, 2014 I was quoted $1/pound for near coast to coast partial DITY. In an unrelated question, anyone know if I can count the weight of a pickup truck cap towards PPM weight?
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now