Air Force Reinstate Captain Selection Boards

[Hacker]

The question has been asked a couple of times, but with no reply. Is there any specific guidance out there that would make those 1LT dudes ineligible to get picked up by a guard/reserve unit? Or is it still up to the hiring unit if they want to select dudes who were passed over for O-3? And for you guys out there who wear the guard or reserve hat, how unfavorable would these guys look in the application process?

Thanks!

What possible motivation would an ANG or Reserve unit have to hire a passed over 1Lt??

[disgruntledemployee]

.... how unfavorable would these guys look in the application process?

If you have to ask, you're clueless. But your answer is, very. If you can't be in the top 95% of the AF, then how could you ever lead a crew or fly a plane?

Now, since you asked, you're probably thinking of trying to get cut from the team. Its your life to gamble with, let us know how it works out for you.

Out

[Karl Hungus]

If you have to ask, you're clueless. But your answer is, very. If you can't be in the top 95% of the AF, then how could you ever lead a crew or fly a plane?

Now, since you asked, you're probably thinking of trying to get cut from the team. Its your life to gamble with, let us know how it works out for you.

Out

I think it speaks volumes about people's job satisfaction with AD that they'd actually consider trying to get purposefully passed over.

It doesn't really matter anyway- I'd be shocked if the 5% who are cut come from an 11X AFSC.

[Karl Hungus]

What possible motivation would an ANG or Reserve unit have to hire a passed over 1Lt??

They get to pay them less to do the same job as an 0-3/ 0-4?

[Hacker]

They get to pay them less to do the same job as an 0-3/ 0-4?

I don't think that has ever been a consideration in ANG/AFRES hiring. I wouldn't expect it to start now.

[Jaded]

Considering that it used to be done up until 2002, what's the difference?

I have my "Capt PRF" and it looks nothing like the meticulously thought out and wordsmithed document that my O-4 and O-5 PRFs looked like. Unless Commanders decide that they're going to put that type of effort into it (which, clearly, isn't required based on the promotion rate) then that's their own doing.

You could say the same thing about an O-4 PRF though. Isn't the promotion rate to major around 95%?

For all we know, the 1Lt PRF will become the vector that decides ASBC in residence, SOS in residence, ACSC in residence, and your entire career. Better do that volunteer work doing UPT, or you'll never get stratted for the Wing CGO of the Quarter award, which won't make your Capt PRF, and you'll never make O-6. This is what the future looks like.

I agree that it's not something to worry about now, just days after the policy has been released.

[Ram]

Cluck cluck, the sky is falling!

Jesus Christ...it won't be that bad. This is how it used to be done...

[Napoleon_Tanerite]

Considering that it used to be done up until 2002, what's the difference?

I have my "Capt PRF" and it looks nothing like the meticulously thought out and wordsmithed document that my O-4 and O-5 PRFs looked like. Unless Commanders decide that they're going to put that type of effort into it (which, clearly, isn't required based on the promotion rate) then that's their own doing.

according to the article, the promotion rate is being adjusted for captain to 95% (current official rate for major) and major is dropping to 90%. That would seem to mean there will at least be some competetive process involved to make O-3, and that will inspire young shoeclerks to write glowing PRFs in the name of "taking care of their people". This leaves everyone else holding the bag of having to write ever better PRFs to compete with the people who go way too far writing a PRF for O-3

[contraildash]

Just got my notification for making Captain....yay

[Majestik Møøse]

according to the article, the promotion rate is being adjusted for captain to 95% (current official rate for major) and major is dropping to 90%. That would seem to mean there will at least be some competetive process involved to make O-3, and that will inspire young shoeclerks to write glowing PRFs in the name of "taking care of their people". This leaves everyone else holding the bag of having to write ever better PRFs to compete with the people who go way too far writing a PRF for O-3

Exactly, the people with the most time on their hands will spend the most time writing PRFs. Which leaves a bunch of Ops guys turning in "below average" PRFs. Hopefully whoever looks at these things can see the big picture and apply some common sense to the process.

[Guest Rubber_Side_Down]

Hopefully whoever looks at these things can see the big picture and apply some common sense to the process.

C'mon, now, Moose...you know better than that.

[osulax05]

I like the idea of not promoting people that suck and this is a good way to accomplish that. But what about the people that will be up for Captain before they even get to an ops unit (read: no OPR's)? I don't foresee them not getting promoted, but I've known a number of guys that due to long casual jobs, UPT, BIT, IFF, B-Course, etc, that make Captain sometime before they are MR. Are they going to use the copy and paste UPT training reports for their PRF's? Going forward this may not be an issue since BITs are getting shorter and guys aren't coming on AD until they are ready to start training but I'm sure it will apply to more than a few people each year.

[RescueRandy]

Just got my notification for making Captain....yay

Xerox!

[FlyingBull]

I like the idea of not promoting people that suck and this is a good way to accomplish that. But what about the people that will be up for Captain before they even get to an ops unit (read: no OPR's)? I don't foresee them not getting promoted, but I've known a number of guys that due to long casual jobs, UPT, BIT, IFF, B-Course, etc, that make Captain sometime before they are MR. Are they going to use the copy and paste UPT training reports for their PRF's? Going forward this may not be an issue since BITs are getting shorter and guys aren't coming on AD until they are ready to start training but I'm sure it will apply to more than a few people each year.

I was wondering the same thing. Here in Pcola due to the delays in standing up the CSO school house we've had people on casual for a full year before starting class. Almost everyone in my current class will be 1st Lt's by the time we're winged and that will be the case for several more classes that haven't even started yet. Add on all the additional training and it's possible a decent number will be very close to Capt before being MR.

Edited October 19, 2010 by FlyingBull

[RRRR]

I was wondering the same thing. Here in Pcola due to the delays in standing up the CSO school house we've had people on casual for a full year before starting class. Almost everyone in my current class will be 1st Lt's by the time we're winged and that will be the case for several more classes that haven't even started yet. Add on all the additional training and it's possible a decent number will be very close to Capt before being MR.

There are a lot of WSOs in your situation. I wouldn't worry too much about it.

[B*D*A]

What's a PRF?

[BQZip01]

What's a PRF?

Promotion Recommendation Form: basically an OPR on illegal steroids (plus an unidentifiable substance we believe to be an industrial strength fish tranquilizer). It is about 20 times the work for half the lines of usable text.

[Shiner]

So now we get to worry about PRFs to Capt, I'm not an exec but now I'm definitely glad to not be one.

Hooray more paperwork to keep me away from doing my flying duties...good job Fail Force!

I mean seriously, what is a O-3 PRF going to have in it from a flying squadron? Two training reports and an OPR? Sounds like a waste of time for everyone, just promote everyone except people who have an UIF...because that is whats going to happen anyways.

[Jughead]

Right. I'd like to see Do Not Promote Boards and DNPRFs for O-3.

...which is, in effect, the status quo....

[Herk Driver]

I met a promotion board to O-3 but did not get a PRF. That was in the early '90's. AFPC did all the leg work. First PRF was for O-4.

Not really going to get all worked up over a "requirement" that hasn't been identified yet.

Edited October 28, 2010 by Herk Driver

[pcola]

CC's--Select your bottom 10% of Capt eligibles and write DNP PRFs.

The worst written 5% "win"

Done.

[Hacker]

I met a promotion board to O-3 but did not get a PRF. That was in the late '90's. AFPC did all the leg work. First PRF was for O-4.

You sure about that? I went to my Capt board in '98 and I most definitely had a PRF written.

I never saw it until well after the fact...it was handled all at the CC/exec level in my squadron, I only got my hands on a copy purely by accident (a copy was in my PIF and I saw it when I PCSd).

CC's--Select your bottom 10% of Capt eligibles and write DNP PRFs.

The worst written 5% "win"

Done.

It would be very entertaining to sit on a promotion board and sort out which officers sucked the most. I'll bet those would be some very interesting PRFs to read!

[BQZip01]

It would be very entertaining to sit on a promotion board and sort out which officers sucked the most. I'll bet those would be some very interesting PRFs to read!

Coming soon to a PRF near you. Captains competing for the bottom 10%:

"Since my last report, this employee has reached rock bottom.....and has started to dig."

"His men would follow him anywhere...but only out of morbid curiosity."

"I would not allow this employee to breed."

"This employee is really not so much of a 'has-been', but more of a definite 'won't be'."

"Works well when under constant supervision and cornered like a rat in a trap."

"When she opens her mouth, it seems that it is only to change feet."

"He would be out of his depth in a parking lot puddle."

"This young lady has delusions of adequacy."

"He sets low personal standards and then consistently fails to achieve them."

"This employee is depriving a village somewhere of an idiot."

"This employee should go far...and the sooner he starts, the better."

"Got a full 6-pack, but lacks the plastic thing to hold it all together."

"A gross ignoramus - 144 times worse than an ordinary ignoramus."

"He certainly takes a long time to make his pointless."

"He doesn't have ulcers, but he's a carrier."

"I would like to go hunting with him sometime."

"He's been working with glue too much."

"He would argue with a signpost."

"He has a knack for making strangers immediately."

"He brings a lot of joy whenever he leaves the room."

"When his IQ reaches 50, he should sell."

"If you see two people talking and one looks bored...he's the other one."

"A photographic memory but with the lens cover glued on."

"A prime candidate for natural deselection."

"Donated his brain to science before he was done using it."

"Gates are down, the lights are flashing, but the train isn't coming."

"Has two brains: one is lost and the other is out looking for it."

"If he were any more stupid, he'd have to be watered twice a week."

"If you give him a penny for his thoughts, you'd get change."

"If you stand close enough to him, you can hear the oceans."

"It's hard to believe that he beat 1,000,000 other sperm to the egg."

"One neuron short of a synapse."

"Some drink from the fountain of knowledge; he only gargled."

"Takes him 2 hours to watch 60 minutes."

"The wheel is turning, but the hamster is dead."

[Herk Driver]

You sure about that? I went to my Capt board in '98 and I most definitely had a PRF written.

I should have said early/mid '90's and yes I'm sure about that. Senior raters are "required" to give you a copy of your PRF. They don't just show up in your record.

[Hacker]

I should have said early/mid '90's and yes I'm sure about that. Senior raters are "required" to give you a copy of your PRF. They don't just show up in your record.

Right or wrong, regardless, that's how it happened for me, and the document is there to prove it.