Guest SE Flyer Posted January 29, 2011 Posted January 29, 2011 By BGEN Greg Stroud (Ret) Some of you know that I was recently "retired" as the 162 Fighter Wing Commander. The decision was made by Brig Gen Mike Colangelo, the Arizona Air Commander, who replaced me because he "just wants to change the culture at the 162nd". Not for cause or performance or any other reason. This officer never commanded anything bigger than an Air Control Squadron and somehow he wound up in charge. Heck, the guy probably got beat up in grade school everyday. I think it is indicative of what is happening in our Air Force and reinforces what Bruce MacLennan and the anonymous author have to say below. Well, I also have something to say about our changing Air Force and it's quickly disappearing Fighter Pilot culture. How many scope dope drone operators does it take to change a lightbulb? Two. One to change the bulb, and one to kiss my ass. That's right. I said kiss my ass. 'Cause I've had it. The air superiority fighter and its PILOT are not dead and the Chinese are so far not impressed with drones. I am tired of Fighter Pilots suffering at the hands of all the pencil pushing REMFs and ladder climbing opportunists and shitty non-rated managers (who think they are leaders) just because the Air Force is currently more interested in feelings and sexual orientation than fighting. Not all officers have what it takes to lead warriors yet too many of them are in charge in our military. At this rate we may lose the next real war. These shit bird officers need to be run out of leadership positions and get out of my face already. We have too many people in our military that feel the need to play political victim and go to court instead of just dealing with it themselves, no one can have any kind of fun anymore. Men and women can't flirt, hug, look at anyone sideways, or drink beer out of mermaid mug because of you "victims" and your lawyers. Are you happy? And while I'm at it... Fighter Pilots, who are willing to die so that we can have low prices at the gas pump and shop at the mall, should be able to throw the wildest parties they can manage without one uptight biddy coming in and stopping it. There were scads of women at The '91 Tailhook party who were having the time of their lives, voluntarily being just as debauched as any of the men were. Everyone who flew a plane, or even knew someone who flew a plane, knew how wild those parties were and what went on. What does our society expect? A prayer service? It's worse now than it was then. "Victims" need to just throw some punches of their own whenever guys, gals, lesbos, or homos get out of line. Doesn't our tax money go to teach all of our military how to fight? I'm not trying to make the idiotic "she had it coming" argument here, which would go something like "of course they grabbed her breasts, look how big they are." Plus, just reaching out and grabbing some boob is wrong no matter what. When I was at Tailhook, even at our most drunken admin parties we never acted like that. No matter how hard I try I can't think of an excuse good enough to do something like that. But it's still nothing to lose a career over or get your panties in a wad. Besides, fighter pilots are supposed to be aggressive assholes. That's how we used to train them. I don't know about you, but I don't want a military of fighter pilots who are gifted at giving sensitivity seminars. I want mad-dog, rabid killers going to battle for me and mine. Man or woman. When our homeland is threatened by Middle-Eastern Muslim radicals, or when we want to force our form of government on some poor, unsuspecting poppy growing shit hole, or when uppity North Korean despots develop nuke weapons, I want to be able to call on men and women who like to fight and drink. I want an officer who knows how to whack some drunk in the balls when he grabs her tits, not call a press conference and a lawyer. If you're a wimp who doesn't know how to find the exit at a rowdy party, go fly a kite, not a jet fighter. Fighter Pilot should always be capitalized because it is a hard earned title - So there. Perhaps it's time for me to retire. Greg "Mongo" Stroud 3
bfargin Posted January 29, 2011 Posted January 29, 2011 Well said general. Craniums up though ... the homo lovers with popcorn are going to be "disappointed in you and your intolerance". 2 5
Napoleon_Tanerite Posted January 29, 2011 Posted January 29, 2011 By BGEN Greg Stroud (Ret) Some of you know that I was recently "retired" as the 162 Fighter Wing Commander. The decision was made by Brig Gen Mike Colangelo, the Arizona Air Commander, who replaced me because he "just wants to change the culture at the 162nd". Not for cause or performance or any other reason. We have too many people in our military that feel the need to play political victim and go to court instead of just dealing with it themselves Oh the irony! While I agree with his assessment of the no-fun Air Force and the social and political rot it's causing with our ranks, an otherwise on-point article is ruined by a thick stench of butthurt whining. He would have a lot more credibility if it was a "I quit and here's why" article, but instead it sounds a whole lot like "I'm a victim and here's why". I agree that our service is overrun by shoes. I also agree that the no-fun, risk averse culture being forced on us is destroying morale and unit cohesion, but what I don't agree with is his apparent attitude that if you ain't a figher pilot you ain't shit. (flame suit on)Fighter pilots tend to be the whiniest support guys out there. Sorry dudes, even YOU aren't the tip of the spear (though closer to it than most). Fighters were initially conceived, and continue to support bombardment operations, but don't tell fighter pilots that. You can't whine about people not knowing their place, and then clearly demonstrate your lack of knowledge of your own. While our fighter pilots may be some of the most skilled, dedicated and well trained aviators in the world, they still have a specific place in the puzzle, and the puzzle is, believe it or not, NOT a picture of a fighter. Ok, that's my piece, I'm ready for the indignant criticism sure to come from the fighter pilots on this board. 5 5
nsplayr Posted January 29, 2011 Posted January 29, 2011 ... the homo lovers with popcorn... Real mature. Not quite as eloquent as the Dear Boss letter and definitely addresses some different issues...either way it's popcorn worthy for the discussion alone. Either way, sir, you have huge balls for a post like that and thank you for your many years of service 1 1
Guest Scooby Posted January 29, 2011 Posted January 29, 2011 And while I'm at it... Fighter Pilots, who are willing to die so that we can have low prices at the gas pump and shop at the mall, should be able to throw the wildest parties they can manage without one uptight biddy coming in and stopping it. Biggest 2 I've ever given. If people are putting their lives on the line for highly questionable reasons, at least give us the privilege of letting loose. 1
di1630 Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 Ok, that's my piece, I'm ready for the indignant criticism sure to come from the fighter pilots on this board. Dude, this isn't a fighter v heavy argument so not even worth battling that aspect. The guy talks of how fighter pilots are because that is what he is and it is written from that aspect. BL is that fighter pilot traditions and way of doing things is on the way out and for those who love the culture and what it stands for, it sucks. What once was a proud fraternity of pilots, is being shit on/destroyed by people who have never been a part of that sort of thing and who do not understand the impact. The BGEN is right on. If you've never been in a fighter sq, you might not see his point fully but I think all good dudes can see the broad point of it. Unless you are one of the homo's causing the problems that is. 4 1
Napoleon_Tanerite Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 Dude, this isn't a fighter v heavy argument so not even worth battling that aspect. The guy talks of how fighter pilots are because that is what he is and it is written from that aspect. BL is that fighter pilot traditions and way of doing things is on the way out and for those who love the culture and what it stands for, it sucks. What once was a proud fraternity of pilots, is being shit on/destroyed by people who have never been a part of that sort of thing and who do not understand the impact. The BGEN is right on. If you've never been in a fighter sq, you might not see his point fully but I think all good dudes can see the broad point of it. Unless you are one of the homo's causing the problems that is. Like I said, I do believe there's a full on assault on the old way of doing things, and the changes are all for the worse. Problems always arise when people who don't play well with others are put in a position of authority. From the sound of it the author was one of these people, and unfortunately for him, so was his boss. I'm ALL FOR having your community and your own way of doing things; however, unless you can interface with the big picture in a positive way without thinking that you ARE the big picture, you are doomed to fail. While I don't know anything about the author beyond the article in the OP, it sounds like he overestimated his sphere of influence, and it bit him. 3 5
ViperStud Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 Oh the irony! While I agree with his assessment of the no-fun Air Force and the social and political rot it's causing with our ranks, an otherwise on-point article is ruined by a thick stench of butthurt whining. He would have a lot more credibility if it was a "I quit and here's why" article, but instead it sounds a whole lot like "I'm a victim and here's why". I agree that our service is overrun by shoes. I also agree that the no-fun, risk averse culture being forced on us is destroying morale and unit cohesion, but what I don't agree with is his apparent attitude that if you ain't a figher pilot you ain't shit. (flame suit on)Fighter pilots tend to be the whiniest support guys out there. Sorry dudes, even YOU aren't the tip of the spear (though closer to it than most). Fighters were initially conceived, and continue to support bombardment operations, but don't tell fighter pilots that. You can't whine about people not knowing their place, and then clearly demonstrate your lack of knowledge of your own. While our fighter pilots may be some of the most skilled, dedicated and well trained aviators in the world, they still have a specific place in the puzzle, and the puzzle is, believe it or not, NOT a picture of a fighter. Ok, that's my piece, I'm ready for the indignant criticism sure to come from the fighter pilots on this board. Stop trying to spin this into something it's not. There are a lot of dudes out there with a Fighter Pilot's mentality who just happen to work in MX, intel, etc. This is not a "we have the biggest dicks" argument. Disagree on the "irony" as well. Good on him for calling out some apparent BS behind the politics that are crushing our culture. I hope said shitbag BGen was front and center when he said all that too. Saddest part - it'll only keep getting worse. POS commanders are out there (just had one PCS not long ago) who care more about Green Bag Bible Study than they do about having a normal roll call in the squadron every once in a while. Douchebags that stand in the corner and wince when I correct a punk who starts singing by interrupting and asking "how does every good fighter pilot song start?" And they take care of their own. The SNAPs who refuse to drink out of principle and scoff when others do, who get offended at porn in the shitter, who don't understand that TDYs are not money-making events, some of these SNAPs latch on to said DB commander and become golden boys. The cycle continues. I still have a year or two left until I have to make the choice whether to sign on for more. I just hope enough guys continue to fight the good fight, there are enough good commanders out there to keep the SNAPs from taking over. If I never make it past O-4/O-5 so be it, but I have too much pride to not act like a Fighter Pilot. Even if it involves buying the frau flowers every once in a while. 3
di1630 Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 I'm ALL FOR having your community and your own way of doing things; however, unless you can interface with the big picture in a positive way without thinking that you ARE the big picture, you are doomed to fail. how often do fighter pilot traditions interfere with the rest of the gayness in the Air Force? I'd love to know the details behind the firing if anyone has it. I imagine the boss showed up at the sq and noticed there were not enough female or minority pilots on the books to get him opr fodder and went to take a piss and someone had a funny article over the urinal. Here's a guy I bet who loves fighter pilot traditions and way of doing things. bio at https://www.ng.mil/ngbgomo/library/bio/1148.htm
Shiner Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 Here's a guy I bet who loves fighter pilot traditions and way of doing things. Haha, I am sure. I am curious though, hes a WACer but apparently hasn't belonged to a flying squadron since 1988. BG with only 1500 heavy hrs...I wonder if he still wears a bag... As far as the argument posed by the good General, it is not only the fighter community suffering, it is everywhere. Until big Air Force stops acting like a spoiled teen-aged girl, worrying about how fashionable our uniforms are or how fat we look in the mirror, the warfighters' well-being will be on the backburner.
discus Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 Haha, I am sure. I am curious though, hes a WACer but apparently hasn't belonged to a flying squadron since 1988. BG with only 1500 heavy hrs...I wonder if he still wears a bag... 1500 hours of riding in the back end of an E-3. 1
Whitman Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 how often do fighter pilot traditions interfere with the rest of the gayness in the Air Force? I'd love to know the details behind the firing if anyone has it. I imagine the boss showed up at the sq and noticed there were not enough female or minority pilots on the books to get him opr fodder and went to take a piss and someone had a funny article over the urinal. Here's a guy I bet who loves fighter pilot traditions and way of doing things. bio at https://www.ng.mil/ngbgomo/library/bio/1148.htm He doesn't have his masters, must be a sucky leader. 4
pawnman Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 I've never understood the mentality. Obviously you don't want things to get wildly out of hand (hospitalizations, DUIs, public intox), but why are some people so anti-fun? Jesus H. Christ, it's fun! Loosen up and enjoy yourself, don't make your career any more of a slog than you have to. I'm amazed at these people. Hey, if this guy is taking over a wing to be the fun police, I wonder how that LT who tried to get the USAF to stop drinking is fairing in his career. In our current environment, he's got CSAF written all over him.
Guest Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 Perhaps it's time for me to retire. Greg "Mongo" Stroud Ugh. This post is bullshit. Mongo, you should be ashamed of yourself if this is really you. You look like a fucking crybaby Goofy Grape Guard dope. Take it like a man and be fucking glad you somehow got promoted to BG without ever having to really compete the hard way. If you really wrote this then it is definitely time to retire. Too bad you're going out with such an adolescent tantrum. If it isn't Mongo, then everyone else needs to know this is bullshit. Whether it is really Mongo or not, this is exactly the kind of political infighting fantasy world bullshit that can happen in the Guard. There is no real competition for quality leadership and positions/rank are given based on who is in power within the state organization...which is often controlled by someone in DC who has moved up to the ANGB and still pulls the strings back home at the state level. It is the most fucked up thing you've ever seen, believe me. BL: There is a "crazy aunt in the attic" side to the Guard that most guys never see. It's nuts. Fresno and Maxwell are just the beginning of what is to come. The budget cuts mean ANG is about to come under an increased level scrutiny. I think it will benefit the Guard but there will be a long line of people who are going to be pissed that they got fired. Good units and leaders, and there are plenty of them out there, will be highlighted. Then again, maybe not.
czecksikhs Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 Lame and unoriginal to boot! The "author" pretty much stole the thing whole cloth from Drew Carey, in addition to whining like a kid who skinned their knee. Dirty Jokes and Beer by Drew Carey 2
Shiner Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 Lame and unoriginal to boot! The "author" pretty much stole the thing whole cloth from Drew Carey, in addition to whining like a kid who skinned their knee. Dirty Jokes and Beer by Drew Carey Hahaha I love the internet! Awesome find. Farewell Mongo, if that is your real name...
PK... Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 Lame and unoriginal to boot! The "author" pretty much stole the thing whole cloth from Drew Carey, in addition to whining like a kid who skinned their knee. Dirty Jokes and Beer by Drew Carey Imagine that... --- PK...
Guest Posted January 30, 2011 Posted January 30, 2011 Craniums up though ... the homo lovers with popcorn are going to be "disappointed in you and your intolerance". WTF? Seriously?
KingGuy Posted January 31, 2011 Posted January 31, 2011 Heck, the guy probably got beat up in grade school everyday. That's about how far I got before you lost your credibility with me. All the accomplishments in the world can be decredited by trying to support a serious argument with third grade insults. "I'll bet the new guy is a stupid poo poo head..." 2
Guest Posted January 31, 2011 Posted January 31, 2011 Here's a guy I bet who loves fighter pilot traditions and way of doing things. Lt Col in 12 years (I knew a Guard guy that made Lt Col in 10 and he was even AGR), O-6 in 16.25 yrs. Nothing to see here...there's nothing wacky about the ANG promotion system...move along.
sputnik Posted February 3, 2011 Posted February 3, 2011 Has anyone figured out if that letter is real?
HuggyU2 Posted February 3, 2011 Posted February 3, 2011 (edited) I doubt it... https://books.google.com/books?id=vPpuJ8mAXGgC&pg=PA52&lpg=PA52&dq=drew+carey+tailhook&source=bl&ots=J3V9koOyDc&sig=4fTiTEpdz-dPYpraJVZCBRE0Wx8&hl=en&ei=X5tFTYD-GoH68AbJif20AQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=6&ved=0CDkQ6AEwBQ#v=onepage&q&f=false ... but who knows. Maybe he just likes to plagerize. Edited February 3, 2011 by Huggyu2
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