What's wrong with the Air Force?

[Ram]

I'm no general, but if I were, and I found out that my DS and/or aide called someone in on a weekend for a chickenshit thing like a GAL update, I would curbstomp them both and demand they apologize for bad judgment.

[17D_guy]

Mentioned it to the Vice when he came around for his immersion tours today. He said thanks/sorry. He seems like a stand up dude, so we'll see if the interaction changes.

Edited August 13, 2014 by 17D_guy

[Majestik Møøse]

I'm no general, but if I were, and I found out that my DS and/or aide called someone in on a weekend for a chickenshit thing like a GAL update, I would curbstomp them both and demand they apologize for bad judgment.

And that's why you'll never be a general!

[Herkasaurus]

How the f*uck is an SOS DG decided?

When I went through 3yrs ago it seemed to be completely based on grades. I say this because our DG had the highest grades in the flight and because of this had to go to an "academic meeting" before our peer evals were done. This meeting was used to determine who the Sq DG was going to be. He ended up being the Sq DG and competed at another "academic meeting" with the other Sq DG's to see who would get the #1/869 CGOs. Ooooh, fancy.

While this seems I'm bitching about SOS, I'm actually wondering if our future leaders are based on who can write a paper best? We all know SOS DG = school slots, staff tours, less flying, and the ever coveted Sq/CC where you get to be another worthless level of bureaucracy while your Wing & Group use you as a puppet via some bastardized level of "decentralized control".

I just can't imagine that our future commanders are determined by a bunch of capts/majs who read some shit and give it a grade based on grammar and proper documentation. It's all the same exact papers with the cookie cutter answers they're looking for written by Capt X and Y. The only differences are the names at the top.

So I say again, will we have a CSAF 15yrs down the road that's the best because he's real good like with them words?

Any SOS instructors out there care to chime in?

Disclaimer: my flight was 29/33

Edited August 19, 2014 by Herkasaurus

[HU&W]

How the f*uck is an SOS DG decided?

Quite simply, who kept their fridge continuously stocked with beer and the door to their room open.

[brabus]

Disclaimer: my flight was 29/33

Sounds like you guys did SOS right. Always cracked me up seeing the "motivated" flights studying, organized PT, working on the weekends (I shit you not), etc. while you're drinking your face off and using SOS for the vacation it is.

[Tank]

My flight didn't meet one weekly goal the entire time.

Our last weeks goal was to have 100% graduate and we didn't even accomplish that!

Flight ranking: 33/33

[discus]

YES! Our flight was 33/33 as well! We had a good time. No DG's and a lot of empty beer cans.

[zach braff]

Flight was 28/30. We had great camaraderie and partied but did sh-tty on all the team events. BUT - the DG system worked in our case.

Went in 2010. It may have changed, but at the time your ranking was a mix of flight (peer) input, flight ranking, grades, and flight/cc input - in that order. As I recall your peer input was worth 40-50% and flt/cc ranking was only 10%. They added them all up and the top 10% in the school were the DGs. So to make DG you couldn't be a self-serving dick because your flight mates would see it and rank you that way. Additionally, if you did well as a team you had a better shot at getting more DGs in your flight.

We did shitty and thus only got one DG. But it was the right person and everyone was rooting for her. She was a no-bullshitting ABM patch who was the first to bitch about the corniness of the school but also the first to help out anyone in the flight and give her all in the team events (even though we blew nearly every one). She led well when it was her turn to lead, and followed well when it was her turn to follow.

I agree that the SOS DG is given too much weight in one's career, but at least as the system was when I went through I disagree that SOS DGs are self-serving dicks. Because at least nowadays, the most important factor in the award is peer-input & feedback - I don't get how you can be a SSD (self-serving dick) and have your teammates rank you well enough to land in the top 10%. If it's changed then let me know - the cadre was pretty open about how the system worked with us back then.

zb

[pawnman]

Sounds like you guys did SOS right. Always cracked me up seeing the "motivated" flights studying, organized PT, working on the weekends (I shit you not), etc. while you're drinking your face off and using SOS for the vacation it is.

Damn. We did zero organized PT and bought kegs on two weekends while we were there...and we were #1/7 in the squadron with 2 DGs.

[FlyinGrunt]

Heck, I bought a keg for a Wednesday. Why wait for the weekend?

[StoleIt]

At SOS now and in our "welcome brief" they seemed to downplay DG.

According to the new CC out of the last 5 CSAF's only one was an SOS DG.

[Vetter]

In my US Airways indoc class, out of 7 military dudes, 5 were DGs from CGO level PME. If you want to get hired by an airline, make sure to check that container.

[Gravedigger]

In my US Airways indoc class, out of 7 military dudes, 5 were DGs from CGO level PME. If you want to get hired by an airline, make sure to check that container.

How did that come up? So to speak.

[SocialD]

In my US Airways indoc class, out of 7 military dudes, 5 were DGs from CGO level PME. If you want to get hired by an airline, make sure to check that container.

Edit: gravedigger got it first.

[Champ Kind]

Slight thread drift: feedback from airline interviews say that they also like to see AAD and some form of community service.

Granted, this is just for the interview, and I can't imagine they give two shits once you're hired, but it's still interesting nonetheless.

[Chida]

If by AAD you mean a Bachelor degree, then yes. Bachelor degrees in general are highly desired but not required. High school diplomas are generally required. Can't speak to community service. Of all the apps I've filled out I've seen it mentioned once, on AA as I recall.

[BitteEinBit]

In my US Airways indoc class, out of 7 military dudes, 5 were DGs from CGO level PME. If you want to get hired by an airline, make sure to check that container.

How this came up is a good question, but another question worth asking is why 5 dudes with career-enhancing DG accolades decide to get out of the AF? Of course this question is rhetorical since this thread explains a lot of it, but it is a question the AF should be asking but probably doesn't recognize the significance of it yet.

[Herkasaurus]

Went in 2010. It may have changed, but at the time your ranking was a mix of flight (peer) input, flight ranking, grades, and flight/cc input - in that order. As I recall your peer input was worth 40-50% and flt/cc ranking was only 10%. They added them all up and the top 10% in the school were the DGs.

zb

It may have changed since then. Granted I went on a waiver in 2012, but DG was decided about 3 days before our final peer evals were done. Unless they took the midterm eval and used it in your percentage breakdown. Either way, several guys I know that have DG'd around the 2011-2013ish classes all have 20lb brains and severely lack in common sense. Maybe that's what big blue wants for those particular years as GOs though.

Hence why I'm curious if anyone knows the truth of it all. I mean, it wouldn't surprise me a bit if our future leaders are just damn good at writing papers based off a movie we watched in class while I was tending to a hangover and counting down the hours before I could start again.

[Jughead]

If by AAD you mean a Bachelor degree, then yes. Bachelor degrees in general are highly desired but not required. High school diplomas are generally required. Can't speak to community service. Of all the apps I've filled out I've seen it mentioned once, on AA as I recall.

If you're talking about formal requirements, OK, college is only "highly desired." In reality, effectively zero guys without a college degree are getting hired (hell, getting interviewed) at the legacies without it right now....

[HossHarris]

But soon....

They'll be throwing signing bonuses at anyone with a restricted ATP that doesn't lick the window in the interview room!

(Cue butters)

[Marco]

When I interview a candidate for a position with my company, the question of whether or not they are PME complete and their DG status is the first. This is followed by a line of questions regarding their ability to lead by PowerPoint, their PT score, and whether they prefer to backstab or openly roll over their bros on their way to their next promotion.

[17D_guy]

So, back to things that are wrong:

Deploying 60% of your support force (Comm, FSS, Finance, SF, etc) while flying operational missions out of the base. Because AEFNEXT or whatever shit we're calling it now.

Don't forget those TCN taskings that came up last second or the reclama's that come down.

Enjoy the ESD boys, at least they'll have people around to pick up the phone... eventually.

[matmacwc]

But soon....

They'll be throwing signing bonuses at anyone with a restricted ATP that doesn't lick the window in the interview room!

(Cue butters)

Nope, they will be paying for full ATPs soon

[Herk Driver]

So, back to things that are wrong:

Deploying 60% of your support force (Comm, FSS, Finance, SF, etc) while flying operational missions out of the base. Because AEFNEXT or whatever shit we're calling it now.

It should be called AEFPAST. This is how we deployed at one point in time. I am not sure about this one yet, but generally speaking deploying as a unit instead of onesie, twosie is how I would prefer to go.

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