Saddle up for Syria? Or Op Deny Christmas '13

[herkbum]

Sounds like they have confirmed facial recognition and DNA.


Sent from my iPhone using Baseops Network mobile app

[MechGov]

But if we don't fight them over "there", we'll fight them "here".....

The Powell Doctrine is a useful litmus test for deciding when to start a war, but by design, doesn’t address when you’re already in a war.

Like it or not, once committed, how to end a war invites it’s own set of consequences.

[waveshaper]

On ‎10‎/‎7‎/‎2019 at 11:07 AM, waveshaper said:

- Dust off/update/Prep/train/review lessons learned/etc from Operation Pacific Haven/Operation Quick Transit I, II, III.  Also prep Incirlik AB and Anderson AFB for a heavy influx of thousands of Kurd refugees/asylum seekers. Also, prep Little Kurdistan USA (Nashville) for this new/latest batch (Round 4) of potentially thousands of Kurdish refugees/asylum seekers (this should be the easiest task since Little Kurdistan USA has gotten pretty good at this stuff).

 

Update on this particular piece of the U.S. Withdraw From Syria Policy/Puzzle (When/Status = TBD); IMHO, we will probably not use Incirlik or Guam this round. Most likely these Kurd refugees will fly directly from Iraqi Kurdistan to the USA and I wouldn't be surprised if Erbil is used as the main airport hub for the movement of these folks.

"Bill introduced to give special immigrant visas to Kurds who helped US in Syria:"

https://thehill.com/policy/defense/468046-dem-introduces-bipartisan-bill-to-give-kurds-who-helped-us-in-syria-special

"A Democratic congressman, with support from a bipartisan group of co-sponsors, has introduced a bill to provide special immigrant visas to Syrian Kurds who partnered with the United States in the fight against ISIS."

"The bill would give special immigrant status to Kurds and other Syrians who partnered with the U.S. government in Syria, as well as their spouses and children. It would authorize 4,000 special immigrant visas for qualifying Syrians per year."

 

[gearhog]

7 hours ago, waveshaper said:

Update on this particular piece of the U.S. Withdraw From Syria Policy/Puzzle (When/Status = TBD); IMHO, we will probably not use Incirlik or Guam this round. Most likely these Kurd refugees will fly directly from Iraqi Kurdistan to the USA and I wouldn't be surprised if Erbil is used as the main airport hub for the movement of these folks.

"Bill introduced to give special immigrant visas to Kurds who helped US in Syria:"

https://thehill.com/policy/defense/468046-dem-introduces-bipartisan-bill-to-give-kurds-who-helped-us-in-syria-special

"A Democratic congressman, with support from a bipartisan group of co-sponsors, has introduced a bill to provide special immigrant visas to Syrian Kurds who partnered with the United States in the fight against ISIS."

"The bill would give special immigrant status to Kurds and other Syrians who partnered with the U.S. government in Syria, as well as their spouses and children. It would authorize 4,000 special immigrant visas for qualifying Syrians per year."

 

Recently took an Uber ride in San Francisco with an Afghani interpreter who was given asylum status for him and his family a few years ago. Amazing conversation. I'd place his patriotism far above 90% of the people we drove past (which may not be saying much).

[Homestar]

I really wish more had been done for Afghan interpreters.  They risked life and limb.

[Sim]

 

 

[zach braff]

8 hours ago, torqued said:

Recently took an Uber ride in San Francisco with an Afghani interpreter who was given asylum status for him and his family a few years ago. Amazing conversation. I'd place his patriotism far above 90% of the people we drove past (which may not be saying much).

Pretty sure I rode with this same dude in SF earlier this year.  It was such a great story, I only wish there more cases like his than of those who were killed/imprisoned trying to gain the asylum they’d earned.

 

zb

[Bigred]

There’s a decent population of Iraqi Kurds in San Diego that drive tow trucks. From 2016-2018 I was in the process of restoring an old Jeep and had to get towed home several times so I met a few of them. Incredible stories of both persecution and also getting out and settling in the US. 

[Clark Griswold]

Hell yes

https://warontherocks.com/2020/10/defund-centcom/

 

[hindsight2020]

2 hours ago, Clark Griswold said:

Hell yes

https://warontherocks.com/2020/10/defund-centcom/

 

wish in one hand...

Perpetual War is not the bug silly wabbit, it's the feature. Besides, those tax-free apportionments, sTrEeT cReD discounts on Grunt Style apparel, and turkey-shoot BOGO AMs aren't gonna issue themselves you see...  

But since we're on the Xmas wish list this early, hell tack on EUCOM to that list afaic. 😄 

[Clark Griswold]

wish in one hand...
Perpetual War is not the bug silly wabbit, it's the feature. Besides, those tax-free apportionments, sTrEeT cReD discounts on Grunt Style apparel, and turkey-shoot BOGO AMs aren't gonna issue themselves you see...  
But since we're on the Xmas wish list this early, hell tack on EUCOM to that list afaic.  

Yeah but the time is now to take "them" on, the MIC-Swamp-Deep State-Globalists-Illuminati-yada yada yada who want the US everywhere and never pulling out sts while telling us its our solemn duty to fight everywhere for nebulous reasons of late.
I think we are underestimating the damage to the Republic by endless, pointless wars.  Preaching to the choir likely but if we don't stop "them" we are nothing more than slaves of a sort.
What the hell can our working and middle classes think when the leadership and chattering classes of this country think nothing of keeping a 50-70 billion dollar gravy train going to fight half-way around the world for people who hate us, their neighbors, have no intention of changing their ways and their is no definable end state or one that is realistically feasible when those said working and middle classes are losing ground.  
You'll spend money into oblivion in Afghanistan but f you little people if you want to secure the borders, remove violent illegal aliens and fix infrastructure.  
Rant finished.
Concur on reducing the European footprint, the countries of Central and Eastern Europe are the only ones who truly need a deployed US force to deter Russia.  Keeping some air/naval basing in the Med for access is fine but only sparingly IMHO. 

[Alpharatz]

Here's a quote from about 2oo years ago...Afghanistan   "the veritable home of murder, battle and sudden death".  Here's a more recent one..."No promotion this side of the ocean"......add billions of dollars...deploy...

[Clark Griswold]

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/12/world/asia/trump-milley-afghanistan.html

I get that no one wants to be in the seat when the fall of Kabul happens and seeing the last helicopter get the hell out with the last group as the inevitable happens but the CJCS has got to realize this is going to happen, America is no longer interested in continuing this operation and that we are leaving come hell or high water.

He doesn't have to like it but don't drag your feet.  

[uhhello]

1 hour ago, Clark Griswold said:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/12/world/asia/trump-milley-afghanistan.html

I get that no one wants to be in the seat when the fall of Kabul happens and seeing the last helicopter get the hell out with the last group as the inevitable happens but the CJCS has got to realize this is going to happen, America is no longer interested in continuing this operation and that we are leaving come hell or high water.

He doesn't have to like it but don't drag your feet.  

"Senior military officials have argued all year that a quick withdrawal from Afghanistan would effectively doom the peace deal reached in February with the Taliban."

Do you think they honestly believe this "peace deal" is the real deal?  That place is doomed.  

[Clark Griswold]

"Senior military officials have argued all year that a quick withdrawal from Afghanistan would effectively doom the peace deal reached in February with the Taliban."
Do you think they honestly believe this "peace deal" is the real deal?  That place is doomed.  

No I think they know it is wishful thinking at best but no one wants to be there and then get the blame and scorn of history put on them, unfairly I might add but those are the breaks.
I also think there is a reluctance on the CJCS as he is an Army GO and the withdrawal from the Stan will lead to a loss of funding for the Army and to some degree operational prestige as the large scale ground operations in the ME are wrapped up.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Homestar]

Kind of weird that the CJCS would straight up reject the policy of the President re: Afghanistan redeployment.  Then again, it's kind of weird that Trump announces defense policy on Twitter.

[Clark Griswold]

Kind of weird that the CJCS would straight up reject the policy of the President re: Afghanistan redeployment.  Then again, it's kind of weird that Trump announces defense policy on Twitter.

True POTUS could choose more conventional means of major policy announcements but so be it

No matter which way it goes Nov 3 just end it POTUS


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[FLEA]

2 hours ago, Clark Griswold said:

True POTUS could choose more conventional means of major policy announcements but so be it

No matter which way it goes Nov 3 just end it POTUS


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I think it may be Trump's reality star status, but I honestly believe he is on to something with the Twitter thing. He has changed the rules to public communication and found a way to bypass the media on his messaging. Unfortunately, the media might have done some gracing for him on some of those messages. 

[Waves]

22 hours ago, Clark Griswold said:

No I think they know it is wishful thinking at best but no one wants to be there and then get the blame and scorn of history put on them, unfairly I might add but those are the breaks.
I also think there is a reluctance on the CJCS as he is an Army GO and the withdrawal from the Stan will lead to a loss of funding for the Army and to some degree operational prestige as the large scale ground operations in the ME are wrapped up.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You're probably right, but it's kinda crazy to think of the Army being the proud owners of the geopolitical situation we're currently in. 19 (or 30+, depending on how you count it) years later and we have made little to no progress in regional stabilization, all while costing us multiple trillions of dollars.

I would be significantly more impressed with the CJCS is he could call a spade a spade and admit that we are assuredly in the region of diminishing returns. The Air Force and the Navy are maintaining relevance and securing funding currently by focusing messaging on the future fights and the need to meet that threat. Maybe the Army should do that.

[jice]

On 10/17/2020 at 8:38 AM, uhhello said:

"Senior military officials have argued all year that a quick withdrawal from Afghanistan would effectively doom the peace deal reached in February with the Taliban."

Do you think they honestly believe this "peace deal" is the real deal?  That place is doomed.  

I understand the sentiment, but is having an enduring presence in an “unconquerable” land that borders China in the West worth (some) blood and treasure? Maybe even some embarrassment in negotiations? 

[Clark Griswold]

I understand the sentiment, but is having an enduring presence in an “unconquerable” land that borders China in the West worth (some) blood and treasure? Maybe even some embarrassment in negotiations? 

No


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[jice]

35 minutes ago, Clark Griswold said:

No


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I think anybody who grew up playing Go would disagree. 

[Clark Griswold]

I think anybody who grew up playing Go would disagree. 

Understand your point but in this case the juice is not worth the squeeze

No enduring / residual presence in the amounts being suggested could either generate offensive combat power to keep China out or intimidate them. It would just be a liability to us that gives our enemies a tempting target to harass, embarrass and distract us if they choose to.

I’m more familiar with Chess than Go so does one pawn moved well forward with no pieces behind it and in an exposed portion of the board really do anything other than provide a convent point of attack for your opponent?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[uhhello]

1 hour ago, jice said:

I understand the sentiment, but is having an enduring presence in an “unconquerable” land that borders China in the West worth (some) blood and treasure? Maybe even some embarrassment in negotiations? 

Are you volunteering as tribute to be the next casualty in a "mission" that has no objective other than to maintain a presence?

[Hawg15]

22 minutes ago, jice said:

I think anybody who grew up playing Go would disagree. 

I think anybody who lost a son, daughter, father, mother, brother, or sister for no purpose or benefit to national security would disagree. 
 

An Afghanistan presence isn’t even close to a deterrence for major powers in that part of the world, and certainly has no real quantifiable objective or reasoning behind it. People’s children who weren’t even born when this shit started are going off to get killed and kill people in Afghanistan who weren’t alive when it started either. We shouldn’t have a single American in that place.