Electronic flight bags could boost operational safety, effectiveness

[HoHum]

Any updates? Which holder did you mean (the spring clip)? Not to down play the initiative, but I wonder how the industrial suction-cup to a cockpit window works? Has anyone tried it?

Ram mount w/ suction cup on the lower right of the swing window worked pretty well on the right side. It gets in the way of the tiller on the left, so you may have to move it aft a bit.

[TrainerModel]

Question, we just started flying with iPads and we're all getting used to them. Throwing mine up in the dash seemed pretty convenient but the thing was getting hot as f*ck from the sun. I know electronics in the sun getting hot isn't a great idea but anyone accidentley tested the limits with this or seen any problems with iPads getting too hot from the sun?

[nunya]

anyone accidentley tested the limits with this or seen any problems with iPads getting too hot from the sun?

Eventually it shuts down and is a paperwight until it cools. Shows a message about thermal something-or-other.

[Tonka]

Ram mount w/ suction cup on the lower right of the swing window worked pretty well on the right side. It gets in the way of the tiller on the left, so you may have to move it aft a bit.

Perfect, that's probably what we'll get... I'm being told we will have to disable the internal GPS and use an external antenna, haven't seen anyone mention that aspect, anyone using a moving map (cheaper alternative to foreflight)?

[HU&W]

This works awesome.

[Swizzle]

Phaero is ok. It isn't great. It could be really great though, if they set up the files as vector graphics instead of image PDFs.

I'll pass this along to the Phaero app creator.

...I know electronics in the sun getting hot isn't a great idea but anyone accidentley tested the limits with this or seen any problems with iPads getting too hot from the sun?

Mine auto-shutdown for high temperature once in the African sunshine. Put it in the shade for several minutes then it worked again.

Any updates? Which holder did you mean (the spring clip)? Not to down play the initiative, but I wonder how the industrial suction-cup to a cockpit window works? Has anyone tried it?

Anyone successful in getting their Sqd to pay for Foreflight?

My version 2 iPad holder is/was delayed. The fabrication shop I used botched the 1st sample of version 2, then they put it on the back-burner for a lucrative corporate project. Money talks...unfortunately. I'm moving onto another fabricator and have PCS'd, thus the delay.

[Tonka]

My version 2 iPad holder is/was delayed.

Might not be a bad thing, since the 7inch IPAD will be out in 2 months.

https://allthingsd.com/20120825/confirmed-new-ipad-mini-will-debut-in-october-after-latest-iphones-september-bow/

[Majestik Møøse]

Also, we can't go online with Wifi until a secure network is set up (next year some point IIRC), even then I don't know how useful something like ForeFlight will be because I don't know if we'll be allowed to access the interwebs.

Does this mean I should stop posting to baseops.net with mine?

Sent from my AMC iPad

[Swizzle]

Might not be a bad thing, since the 7inch IPAD will be out in 2 months.

https://allthingsd.co...-september-bow/

I have a plan for the iPad 7 inch version or any tablet. The baseplate I designed can actually accommodate nearly any tablet. It's as simple as loosen, remove-from-baseplate, swap, tighten.

[B747IP]

Glad to see the Air Force entering the 21st Century. There was a time during my career that you were not able to use a 4 function calculator on the flight deck. To save wearing these units out quickly they should be checked in and out at crew briefing as we had to do with weapons during my time. Taking them home and playing with them will simply wear them out faster and eat up all the memory. If stored properly with a person in charge of them that could keep them up to date and charged to be ready for flight would be the best way to go..

[ThreeHoler]

Have you ever used an iPad? How exactly do you "wear it out?" It is a fucking touchscreen.

No one is allowed to install any additional apps, so I don't think there is much concern for "eating up the memory." Unless you count that the DoD Phaero app takes up 7gb because the digital FLIP is all image PDFs. It is over 3gb per cycle.

[Apollo]

Glad to see the Air Force entering the 21st Century. There was a time during my career that you were not able to use a 4 function calculator on the flight deck. To save wearing these units out quickly they should be checked in and out at crew briefing as we had to do with weapons during my time. Taking them home and playing with them will simply wear them out faster and eat up all the memory. If stored properly with a person in charge of them that could keep them up to date and charged to be ready for flight would be the best way to go..

There are no moving parts on the iPad that can wear out. The lithium ion battery cannot develop memory like nickle cadmium, therefore no need for proper charging procedure (besides not letting them drain to a minimum, battery destroying level). The battery is the only thing that can wear out, and that is through the normal charge/discharge cycle that is inevitable whether used or shelved. As far as "eating up all the memory", I don't know what that means.

Keeping the iPad up to date and charged is being handled the same as keeping any pubs up to date. Aircrew responsibility with associated regs to back it up. Simple really, new FCIF comes out, go update your iPad on the dedicated station.

Half of the reason for purchasing these things was so aircrew could study and mission plan on the ground. As of a year ago we are no longer issued paper pubs (speaking from the J side of things, don't know about others). That led to a void where new pilots where expected to stay in the books, but weren't really given a practical solution to. This helps with that tremendously. Also, all of the planning flip and most airfield information you'll need is on the device, which helps tremendously during mission planning. The in flight application is marginal when you're doing anything but cruising airways and shooting approaches (though when you are doing those things, the EFB is great). I've I've spent more time with the EFB during ground based planning than actual strapped-to-my-leg flying.

As a side note, we still have to check out weapons. Mostly so we don't eat up all the memory.

[contraildash]

I had an AE crew recently loading large pelican cases that felt like they were full of lead. I asked what they had inside...."pubs". In a jet where space is an extreme premium, that shit has got to go. I carry my paper pubs per to stay legal, but use an iPad in the cockpit because it's practical, fast, and safe (kicked off AP in cruise more than once with my pub kit).

But just like anything else in the AF, this change requires money, time, and some poor sap to run the program in your SQ. I don't see it happening anytime soon...or quickly for that matter.

[nsplayr]

Glad to see the Air Force entering the 21st Century. There was a time during my career that you were not able to use a 4 function calculator on the flight deck. To save wearing these units out quickly they should be checked in and out at crew briefing as we had to do with weapons during my time. Taking them home and playing with them will simply wear them out faster and eat up all the memory. If stored properly with a person in charge of them that could keep them up to date and charged to be ready for flight would be the best way to go..

I think you need to go out and use an ipad once or twice...like others have said, I'm not sure how you can "wear one out." On the other hand, our squadron crunched some numbers and it would literally be cheaper to issue each aircrew member a new top-end ipad each year than to continue to get paper FLIP. A new ipad every single year and that was the cheaper option! Obviously that's not needed, so there is significant cost savings going to the EFB concept and that's ultimately what sold the idea to leadership. The fact that the ipad is infinitely more capable at pre-mission planning and ease of use was not nearly as persuasive to the money men as it was to the day to day crew dawgs.

No one is allowed to install any additional apps...

Depends on what program your EFBs are under.

[Swizzle]

Anyone know a quality machinists/fabricator in Albuquerque? I'm doing it right this time - locally - not long distance.

[Tonka]

No one is allowed to install any additional apps,

Unless you're in AFSOC.

[ThreeHoler]

Unless you're in AFSOC.

Then AFSOC better watch their memory so they don't run out of it!

[B747IP]

I waited over a year before I posted here because I wanted to get a "feel" for the posts and responses here before I dipped a toe in. So, I post what I thought was a simple post about possible abuse that could happen to an electronic item. To answer some questions concerning my knowledge of iPads I can say this: After aging out of aviation I returned to school to obtain an MS in Computer Science. Then I was hired at a hospital as Manager of the MIS Office and later at a major finance company in the same capacity. In those positions we repaired and replaced many computers, iPads, Electronic Readers both Kindle and Fire that was furnished to certain employees. If you believe these items can not be "worn out" or broken and scrached screens then you are in for a surprise. I am not much into profanity at my age since I've out lived that behavior so I won't be bothering you youungsters any more with my "poor" knowledge of iPads.

[guineapigfury]

Welcome to the board. Instigating debate over semantics and meaningless minutiae is a bit of a sport around here. Don't let it keep you from participating. What's your aviation background?

I'd argue that's a game; bitching is THE sport around here.

[Guest]

Instigating debate over semantics and meaningless minutiae is a bit of a sport around here.

I'd argue that's a game; bitching is THE sport around here.

WTF! I said "a" sport, not "the" sport. Are you having trouble identifying simple definite and indefinite articles of the English language? Clearly, I was not specifying trivial debate as the one and only sport typically associated with this forum. Also, bitching is no more a "sport" by the literal definition than arguing over minutiae. Comprehension failure typical of a liberal SNAP.

Case in point...

[Apollo]

I waited over a year before I posted here because I wanted to get a "feel" for the posts and responses here before I dipped a toe in. So, I post what I thought was a simple post about possible abuse that could happen to an electronic item. To answer some questions concerning my knowledge of iPads I can say this: After aging out of aviation I returned to school to obtain an MS in Computer Science. Then I was hired at a hospital as Manager of the MIS Office and later at a major finance company in the same capacity. In those positions we repaired and replaced many computers, iPads, Electronic Readers both Kindle and Fire that was furnished to certain employees. If you believe these items can not be "worn out" or broken and scrached screens then you are in for a surprise. I am not much into profanity at my age since I've out lived that behavior so I won't be bothering you youungsters any more with my "poor" knowledge of iPads.

We're issued otter box cases with them to help protect the hardware. It comes with a screen cover to prevent scratching. Part of this test run is to see if in fact these eReaders will survive daily use by aircrew. I'll be interested to see the results more so of desert use than the damage that can come from aircrew bringing the devices home.

[guineapigfury]

We're issued otter box cases with them to help protect the hardware. It comes with a screen cover to prevent scratching. Part of this test run is to see if in fact these eReaders will survive daily use by aircrew. I'll be interested to see the results more so of desert use than the damage that can come from aircrew bringing the devices home.

With all due respect, I think you've evaluated your threats incorrectly. Nothing is pilot proof. I once had a friend short Code 3 a MFD when he spilled a Diet Coke on it.

[HossHarris]

I've had an unprotected iPad survive a 7 and 5 year old and wife for almost a year and still going strong ... with an otter box it should be nearly indestructible.

/edut for spellin

Edited September 11, 2012 by HossHarris

[cragspider]

I've had an unprotected iPad survive a 7 and 5 year old and wife for alomst a year ... with an otter box it should be nearly indestructible.

By far the best quote in this thread. That right there is proof that it is now safe for all aircrew to use on a daily basis.

[nsplayr]

We have otter containers issued with out ipads but most people took them off because they more than double the bulk. I have an apple smart cover on mine and it covers the screen and that's it. We've yet to have anyone hurt or break their ipads, and like I said, it's cheaper for the command to by every flyer a new ipad every single year than it is to continue getting paper FLIP.