Multicam 2 piece flightsuits

[Fozzy Bear]

Multicam is obviously worn by the Army and those going outside the wire downrange.

In AFSOC, though we go outside the wire and have purchased a ton of the 2 piece multicam flightsuits, we are not allowed to give them out yet. This is mainly because we do have written guidance on proper wear. I am trying to run down who has the authority to ram this thru, and who is the person I should speak to about writing a reg that lets us wrap this up.

[Festivius]

If there's a AFSOC Sup to 36-2903, it should list a MAJCOM POC and that would be your dude. If no such Sup exists, you may need to write one.

[Guest CombatWombat]

Stupid place to ask the question. Its.already in the works.and there is.guidance, its the same as the abu two piece. Its.being approved presently. If you were able to.fast track

.anything worth a shit you would already know.the answer.

Edited January 4, 2012 by CombatWombat

[Fozzy Bear]

Stupid place to ask? No. This forum often has great advice.

As far as it being in the works, yes, it is and has been for a great while, and it is getting nowhere. Every week I send guys out the door without the best uniforms. I guess you are saying I should sit back and wait for the Air Force and AFSOC to do this. That's like waiting around for 5 years for new cadillacs at the Died because "it's already in the works." Or waiting around and not doing anything on million issues that are hampering us. Of course it's in the works, but squadron commanders cannot get a good answer, so evidently, General Snap, you are so in the loop that I will ask you to please release me to wear these downrange.

[Guest CombatWombat]

Stupid place to ask? No. This forum often has great advice.

As far as it being in the works, yes, it is and has been for a great while, and it is getting nowhere. Every week I send guys out the door without the best uniforms. I guess you are saying I should sit back and wait for the Air Force and AFSOC to do this. That's like waiting around for 5 years for new cadillacs at the Died because "it's already in the works." Or waiting around and not doing anything on million issues that are hampering us. Of course it's in the works, but squadron commanders cannot get a good answer, so evidently, General Snap, you are so in the loop that I will ask you to please release me to wear these downrange.

I personally approve you to wear them.

Have you even attempted to talk to other squadron RAs to get specfics? You are using the Deid as an example and i'm the SNAP? Easythere Air Commando.

[KWings06j]

They're being issued in ACC. Right now we're limited to two per person deploying, trying to get a third at least.

[RescueRandy]

They're being issued in ACC. Right now we're limited to two per person deploying, trying to get a third at least.

He's right. ACC is issuing them. Active HH-60 guys started wearing them this fall for OUP. Unfortunately, I'm not in the know on who you can go through to make it happen for AFSOC. Sorry.

[C-21.Pilot]

Stupid place to ask the question. Its.already in the works.and there is.guidance, its the same as the abu two piece. Its.being approved presently. If you were able to.fast track

.anything worth a shit you would already know.the answer.

What he meant to say was that "I get the record for using the most periods in a post."

[usaf36031]

Though we're wearing them downrange, there still isn't (as far as I know) any published wear guidance. I think we made it up.

EDIT: The convention was tan undershirt, tan web belt, tan boots, brown name strips, black or brown rank (depending on the color of your insignia). E's wore brown chevrons. American flag on left sleeve, squadron patch on right...oh, and lots of morale patches. (because show me in the reg where it says they aren't authorized on my two piece flight suit)

Edited January 5, 2012 by usaf36031

[backseatdriver]

The key is CJSOAC approving them for wear in the AOR - then you can issue them. That's how we started getting the ABU flight suits.

[Fozzy Bear]

I saw something written down for the ABU flightsuit. I'd still just give those out if we could get them - damn company went out of business. Another is supposed to make them, but it's taking a while. I have a warehouse of Multicams that I'm not allowed to issue. I'll try to find something thru the CJSOAC for wear. That's the big stopping point. I see them downrange with no hassle, but need something formal to give them out to my squadrons. Thanks for your help.

[raimius]

Stupid place to ask the question. Its.already in the works.and there is.guidance, its the same as the abu two piece. Its.being approved presently. If you were able to.fast track

.anything worth a shit you would already know.the answer.

Really!? A guy asks for help to get new stuff issued to his troops and you criticize him?

...and we complain about bureaucracy and crap?

[Guest CombatWombat]

Really!? A guy asks for help to get new stuff issued to his troops and you criticize him?

...and we complain about bureaucracy and crap?

yeah really. Its a MAJCOM issue and some dude on baseops asking who to talk to is probably the last guy to affect any faster an approval. If said dude really was the type to fast track a MAJCOM uniform change then he'd already know who to talk to without asking the chuckleheads on baseops. Get it or am I totally off here? Edited January 5, 2012 by CombatWombat

[Guest CAVEMAN]

yeah really. Its a MAJCOM issue and some dude on baseops asking who to talk to is probably the last guy to affect any faster an approval. If said dude really was the type to fast track a MAJCOM uniform change then he'd already know who to talk to without asking the chuckleheads on baseops. Get it or am I totally off here?

Obviously he is not in the position to fast track this through the MAJCOM. He probably got tired of asking superiors that did not have the answer nor care to find out what the status is. So if he is willing to pick up the phone and call or fire the email to the guy holding up the process, what gives?

We give sh!t to the mediocrity in the system but also turn around and give sh!t to pro-active individuals that want to get answers rather than the standard shoe clerk party line bullsh!t.

[M2]

Knock off the debate and stick to the topic...

[nsplayr]

Guys in my squadron have been working in this for years with no joy. Post something if you make any progress. The ABU 2-piece ones are better than nothing but still not what we wanted, especially since we bought the multicam ones and now they're sitting in storage.

[uhhello]

We're wearing them in the 60 world like Hella said earlier. There is no specific guidance for the flight suit mutli-cams. We just pull from all the regs and made our own standard. Army shits their pants every now and then when they bitch about us wearing "their" uniform but other than that haven't had any issues.

[Champ Kind]

Army shits their pants every now and then when they bitch about us wearing "their" uniform but other than that haven't had any issues.

I would think that since you AF helo bubbas have gotten into the CASEVAC business and save lives every day, the Army wouldn't give two shits about what you're wearing .

I know that if I were ever to require your services, you could be wearing a clown suit with all of the morale patches you could velcro on the thing and it would still be beers for life.

Edited January 5, 2012 by Champ Kind

[M2]

I would think that since you AF helo bubbas have gotten into the CASEVAC business and save lives every day, the Army wouldn't give two shits about what you're wearing .

I know that if I were ever to require your services, you could be wearing a clown suit with all of the morale patches you could velcro on the thing and it would still be beers for life.

My vote for post of the week!

[busdriver]

Section 3.7 of AFCENT 36-2903 authorizes the "tactical flight duty uniform" aka two-piece flight suit for HH-60 and C-130 crews, but does not refer to any color scheme. The multi-cam two piece is in the system and different than the fire retardent version of the multi-cam patterned ACU which is section 3.6. Wear guidance for patches is IAW unit desert flight suit colors and policies. Pretty open ended, the catch is you're only supposed to wear it when flying or on alert. We're always on alert.

[brock]

I would think that since you AF helo bubbas have gotten into the CASEVAC business and save lives every day, the Army wouldn't give two shits about what you're wearing .

I know that if I were ever to require your services, you could be wearing a clown suit with all of the morale patches you could velcro on the thing and it would still be beers for life.

I'm curious as to what Army guys give two shizats about this? Is it fellow aviators or some ground guys? In the Army the aviators worst enemy is the Sargent Major. They want our A2CU to look as much like the ground uniform as possible. So morale patches and other such acutraments are frowned apon. The active duty unit my guard medevac was attached to hated how we wore our uniforms. My advice to you guys is put as much stuff on the Multi Cam flight suit as possible and tell the big Sarge to beat feet when he gets into your kitchen.

By the way, are you guys wearing the Drifire version? Seems like a superior product to the Army A2CU.

[Standby]

There is actually a list of units authorized to wear the TFDU and MultiCam 2-piece, which is currently under revision. Bottom line: if your unit is not on the list, then IEU won't hook you up. I'll try to e-mail some folks and see if anything has changed.

Edited January 5, 2012 by Standby

[uhhello]

I'm curious as to what Army guys give two shizats about this? Is it fellow aviators or some ground guys? In the Army the aviators worst enemy is the Sargent Major. They want our A2CU to look as much like the ground uniform as possible. So morale patches and other such acutraments are frowned apon. The active duty unit my guard medevac was attached to hated how we wore our uniforms. My advice to you guys is put as much stuff on the Multi Cam flight suit as possible and tell the big Sarge to beat feet when he gets into your kitchen.

By the way, are you guys wearing the Drifire version? Seems like a superior product to the Army A2CU.

Some Sergeant Major in the chow hall before work. Didn't like the way we wear our flags (AF). I think he rolled in hot on us thinking we were Army dudes at first but then realized his mistake but didn't have the power for a go around :)

[brock]

Uhhello,

Pretty typical of an army Segeant Major. That is their lot in life. Are you guys wearing our version or the Drifire version with leather name tags?

[Fozzy Bear]

We bought the Drifire version, with more on back order.

FWIW, I and others have gotten AF regs and AFI's changed even when we had only been in a few years. It takes the individual to run it down and bulldog an issue. That is how I see things change.

Today I went by several units that are USAF but wear multicam downrange. It appears my next step is emailing colonels at the Pentagon. That's what they did to get a letter to approve their wear. Also, things like the color of text on nametapes are not standard, so I plan on going with the Army's burnt sienna, or whatever it is. Also things that are different from Special Tactics to others is the type of American flag and the shoulder on which one wears it. The letters/ memos outline how USAF is to wear multicam, but doesn't mention the 2 piece flightsuit. No answer from AFSOC/HQ. One of the basic issues is that these units list the multicam not as a uniform, but as PPE, and therefor excempt from uniform regulation.

Tomorrow I'll email the names at the Pentagon I was given. I assume next week I'll be writing a form 847 or creating a wear policy. Personally, I wish we could choose which person to person (I wear a pencil patch on my left that we have made overseas.) If anyone has thoughts on rules I should write in, please let me know.