Drone Pilots: We Don’t Get No Respect

[Royal]

How many years until SkyNet becomes self aware?

It already is as of 29 August 1997; right now it's just waiting.

[TheGuardGuy]

AF Crimes -

https://www.airforcetimes.com/news/2013/01/air-force-rpa-promotion-rate-010713w/

[Fuzz]

“There may be good and sufficient reasons for that, but the concern is you can’t treat these RPA operators as second-class citizens and expect that to be the core of the Air Force of the future”

[17D_guy]

AF Crimes -

https://www.airforcet...n-rate-010713w/

I couldn't imagine getting racked/stacked and "taking one for the team" based on AAD/christmas party reasons...

[matmacwc]

That's because all the viper pilots are now flying predators.

Nope

[HU&W]

[billy pilgrim]

Not affording a US Citizen due process in accordance with the constitution is a bigger issue (and risk) than "mitigating risk" of a terror attack.

Sometimes one must sacrifice a little security in the name of freedom and liberty. Ideals and ideas like this are what used to make this country great. (Gun control and warrant-less electronic eavesdropping on US citizens are just two more examples off the top of my head of the same erosion of this nation's ideals.)

The easy road is usually the cowardly one.

It is of my opinion that this entitled baby-boomer generation is absolutely destroying our country (fiscally wise, liberty wise, security wise). Fortunately, I have met some incredible people while serving and it gives me hope that some of you guys out there will someday help fix all this and get us back to where we used to be.

[PapaJu]

Looks like the Pentagon is taking a second look at the special medal for drone operators: https://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/03/12/official-hagel-orders-review-new-cyber-medal/

[Magellan]

Looks like the Pentagon is taking a second look at the special medal for drone operators: https://www.foxnews.c...ew-cyber-medal/

This is interesting...considering one of the justifications for the medal was to be an alternative to the Air Medal. That said I don't think they considered the backlash that would come from veterans groups viewing it as an attack on Bronze Stars and Purple Hearts.

I could be wrong on this one, but I think Hagel will stand behind Panetta's decision on this medal.

[ruckerstud]

I'm going to have to disagree with you that Hagel will agree with Panetta on this. From a political perspective, it is pretty hard to not listen to a bunch of veterans who are missing limbs (the military order of the purple heart) who say you are slapping them in the face. It is even harder when you can't say what this medal would awarded for because most of the drone things that it would be awarded for (DFC level work from the wording) are classified. The merits of this medal are something different, but at the SECDEF level, it is a completely different discussion

[Fuzz]

I'm going to have to disagree with you that Hagel will agree with Panetta on this. From a political perspective, it is pretty hard to not listen to a bunch of veterans who are missing limbs (the military order of the purple heart) who say you are slapping them in the face.

You seem to think that the politicians and appointees actually care what you think.

[PapaJu]

You seem to think that the politicians and appointees actually care what you think.

Normally true, but call me an optimist in thinking that Hagel might have a different perspective on this given his own military experiences.

[Spaceballs]

This is interesting...considering one of the justifications for the medal was to be an alternative to the Air Medal. That said I don't think they considered the backlash that would come from veterans groups viewing it as an attack on Bronze Stars and Purple Hearts.

As a person with drones on my list for my next assignment, I don't think drone operators deserve the Air Medal. Drones definitely have their place and make a huge difference, but the drone operator is never in any danger. They never see true combat. I think the new medal has its place for drone and space operators, but I don't think it should be nearly as prestigious as they made it. It should be a much lower medal being nowhere near the purple heart or the Air Medal. Just my two cents.

[Magellan]

As a person with drones on my list for my next assignment.

Copy, you are a subject matter expert perfectly entitled to tell Panetta that he was dead wrong.

[backseatdriver]

As a person with drones on my list for my next assignment...

Step 1: Stop calling them drones.

[Jeepers21]

Step 1: Stop calling them drones.

^this

https://www.nbcnews.com/technology/technolog/dont-call-em-drones-wide-world-unmanned-flying-machines-1C8857699

[herkbum]

Step 1: Stop calling them drones.

2

Edited March 15, 2013 by herkbum

[BFM this]

Step 1: Stop calling them drones.

This.

Senator, these are not the droids you are looking for.

[polcat]

This.

Senator, these are not the droids drones you are looking for.

FIFY. Sounds better.

[HU&W]

Step 1: Stop calling them drones.

Dude, you just got droned!

If we allow one man to charge Americans as enemy combatants and indefinitely detain or drone them, then what exactly is it our brave young men and women are fighting for?

[Danger41]

I have no beef with the RPA operators earning a medal. I don't think it should be of greater "value" than an Air Medal or a Bronze Star, but they should be recognized for the contributions they're making to the war effort. It's definitely more than many other platforms out there.

[guineapigfury]

I have no beef with the RPA operators earning a medal. I don't think it should be of greater "value" than an Air Medal or a Bronze Star, but they should be recognized for the contributions they're making to the war effort. It's definitely more than many other platforms out there.

We rack up plenty of Aerial Achievement medals. Most of the guys aren't happy with where this medal ranks, because it brings down even more derision upon us. They probably should have put this thing between the Purple Heart and DMSM.

[Fuzz]

We rack up plenty of Aerial Achievement medals. Most of the guys aren't happy with where this medal ranks, because it brings down even more derision upon us. They probably should have put this thing between the Purple Heart and DMSM.

I hope that was sarcasm, shouldn't rank above the Air Medal IMO. And what is wrong with the Aerial Achievement Medal?

Quoting from wiki: "The decoration is intended to recognize the contributions of aircrew members who would, otherwise, not be qualified for the award of the Air Medal."

Seems about right, I personally think we have too many medals, but if they do want one just rank it right below the AM.

Edited March 17, 2013 by Scaredfuzz21

[HU&W]

I hope that was sarcasm, shouldn't rank above the Air Medal IMO. And what is wrong with the Aerial Achievement Medal?

Quoting from wiki: "The decoration is intended to recognize the contributions of aircrew members who would, otherwise, not be qualified for the award of the Air Medal."

Seems about right, I personally think we have too many medals, but if they do want one just rank it right below the AM.

So let me get this straight. You think this medal, which is supposed to be awarded on a very limited and selective basis, for actions that would a approximate a DFC if the person was actually in the aircraft, should rank below the Air Medal (which we all know the criteria for) and the bronze star (deployed MSM). You do realize that the Aerial Achievement Medal, which is already routinely awarded for RPA operations already ranks directly below the Air Medal, right?

Note: I did read that you don't want to add any additional medals, and I agree with that sentiment. I posted somewhere in this convoluted mash of 6 threads on the same topic that I think these outstanding combat actions from remote locations can be appropriately recognized within our existing medal structure. If, however, they insist on creating a 'special' medal for these kind of remote combat achievements, my opinion is that the placement is appropriate. It just needs to be awarded at least as selectively and rarely as a Distinguished Flying Cross.

ETA: I agree with it being right below the Purple Heart, but above DMSM and especially MSM. It is a little strange since it's flight but not anywhere near the airplane, it's combat but dislocated from the combat zone, it's vanilla but at the same time chocolate...

Edited March 17, 2013 by HU&W

[Fuzz]

So let me get this straight. You think this medal, which is supposed to be awarded on a very limited and selective basis, for actions that would a approximate a DFC if the person was actually in the aircraft, should rank below the Air Medal (which we all know the criteria for) and the bronze star (deployed MSM). You do realize that the Aerial Achievement Medal, which is already routinely awarded for RPA operations already ranks directly below the Air Medal, right?

Note: I did read that you don't want to add any additional medals, and I agree with that sentiment. I posted somewhere in this convoluted mash of 6 threads on the same topic that I think these outstanding combat actions from remote locations can be appropriately recognized within our existing medal structure. If, however, they insist on creating a 'special' medal for these kind of remote combat achievements, my opinion is that the placement is appropriate. It just needs to be awarded at least as selectively and rarely as a Distinguished Flying Cross.

I guess I wasn't reading the selectivity part, I just see a DoD push for an RPA medal. You don't foresee the AF lining up 15-20 people as soon as this passes and turning it into a photo op?

On second thought I was looking through the available medals none really fit this area it covers. Most are non-combat or for higher ranking members. So i retract my earlier statement, if it is awarded selectively I personally don't have a problem with where it is placed or if it was moved just below the Purple Heart. I'm in no way looking to shaft our RPA brethren, I think they truly need to be recognized for the work they do.

Edited March 17, 2013 by Scaredfuzz21