Command Sponsorship vs. Non-command Sponsorship

[The Kayla]

Hey!

I'm hoping someone can give me answers...

I have a friend who's husband is going to England. She was denied medical clearance. They have a son together, who was not. She is planning on going over there regardless.

I think she is under the impression that since their son is on his orders, that they will still receive everything that they normally would, except that she'll have to pay for her ticket out of pocket.

1) Will they receive dependent rate OHA? (And, how would this play in the mandatory live-on-base policy?)

2) Medical? I was under the impression that non-command sponsorships weren't allowed to use the base hospital and/or were allowed to use it, but as stand by only. (Sorry, I've heard both...)

3) BX/Commissary privies.. yea or nay?

4) Moving... Will their entire house be moved, or just a select portion of weight?

Thanks!

[Cap-10]

I took my wife and kid non-command sponsored on my 1 year remote to Korea back in 08-09. I don't think much had changed since then, but take it with a grain of salt:

1) Yes. When the AF sent me remote, they still had to pay a housing allowance because I left my wife/kid "behind". Since they have to pay a BAH/OHA anyway, they don't care the location, as long as they don't have to pay to move the family there. I think they will get OHA with dependents for the England location.

2) Osan had a full up hosipital as well and my wife and kiddo used it on a space-a basis. They could also only make appointments the day of, so it was space-a, Having said that, hospitals have ER rooms, so when out kid had a high fever and we couldn't see the flight doc until 1630 that day, we just walked into the ER and were immediately taken care of. There's no much trauma going on on a daily basis so the ER always had someone available, Our daughter also came down with a bad rash that they thought may have been food/allergy. We were sent up to Yongsan to the large Army hospital to see a dermatologist....all of this was done on a non-command sponsored status.

3) Yea

4) This might be slighly different because I was going remote, but i could only ship 10% of my max allowable weight. I was a O-4, so my max was 17,500lbs so I could ship 10% of that....not sure of your friends scenario becuase he/she is PCS's to a normal assignment, not a remote.

Hope this helps!

Cheers,

Cap-10

[The Kayla]

Cap! That does help! The sticky part is housing... England has a mandatory live-on-base rule right now. So, would be be given a house on base or allowed to live off base?

[Steve Davies]

Out of interest, why does anyone need "medical clearance" to come to the UK?

[OL Patch]

why does anyone need "medical clearance" to come to the UK?

For the food. Just kiddin Steve.

EDIT: Best Indian Curry I ever had was whilst at a TAC Air Meet at RAF Waddington.

Edited June 15, 2012 by OL Patch

[The Kayla]

Out of interest, why does anyone need "medical clearance" to come to the UK?

To make sure that you don't have a condition that the medical facility can't handle.

[17D_guy]

To make sure that you don't have a condition that the medical facility can't handle.

We had one of these happen for a PCS to Alaska, individual was just routed somewhere else. That not an option?

[Steve Davies]

For the food. Just kiddin Steve.

EDIT: Best Indian Curry I ever had was whilst at a TAC Air Meet at RAF Waddington.

^ Nicely done.

To make sure that you don't have a condition that the medical facility can't handle.

Shame that she's being penalised. Someone should tell the Air Force that we do have hospitals here.

[nunya]

Steve, I'm sure the UK could handle anything medically that the US could, but the Air Force doesn't necessarily have arrangements with every specialist that a family might need. No specialist when one's required = family not cleared. For example, if a child needed their teeth cleaned, they would have to be medevac'd back to the US for treatment.

[Steve Davies]

Steve, I'm sure the UK could handle anything medically that the US could, but the Air Force doesn't necessarily have arrangements with every specialist that a family might need. No specialist when one's required = family not cleared. For example, if a child needed their teeth cleaned, they would have to be medevac'd back to the US for treatment.

The logic makes sense, Nunya - I suppose that I am just surprised that since the USAF took over operational control of The 'Heath in 1948, they'd have solid relationships with just about every man and his dog by now. I am obviously oversimplifying things, though.

[Guest]

Careful. They deny medical for a reason, which your friend may well find out the hard way when they get there.

That said...your friend might want to look into their potential access to the NHS.

We were command sponsored when we were at RAF Alconbury. I don't know if being command sponsored made any difference or not but we used the NHS and the military facilities.

My oldest son was born in Hinchingbrooke hospital which had the best maternity ward in the UK at that time. We could've gone to the Lakenheath hospital but the Hinchingbrooke option was much better, and closer. Hinchingbrooke was the best hospital wrt service and process of any hospital, military or civilian, of the four my kids were born in...according to my wife. We even had a community midwife who came by our house for a month or so after my son was born and we became fast friends with her and her husband. Her husband was an RAF F-1 IP at RAF Coningsby. He worked it out so that I could fly with him and I went up there a couple times and flew DACT in the F-1 against Hogs and Mudhens...which was a nice benefit to the NHS system as far as I was concerned.

[Toro]

1) Will they receive dependent rate OHA? (And, how would this play in the mandatory live-on-base policy?)

2) Medical? I was under the impression that non-command sponsorships weren't allowed to use the base hospital and/or were allowed to use it, but as stand by only. (Sorry, I've heard both...)

3) BX/Commissary privies.. yea or nay?

4) Moving... Will their entire house be moved, or just a select portion of weight?

Kayla,

Cap-10 was pretty much on, but I'll add my 0.02, having been there (albeit a decade ago). Bottom line, he needs to talk to somebody smart at the FSS/MPF and/or Airman and Family Readiness Center to make sure non-command sponsorship isn't an issue - and whatever he is told, get it in writing.

1) Yes. If his son is on his orders, his entitlements are paid out as such.

2) This might be the iffy area. Unlike Korea - where it is fairly standard to have non-command sponsored dependents - they aren't accustomed to dealing with non-command sponsored dependents. You would normally inprocess the family and provide their medical records, so I think (as Rainman said) he would probably run into some issues here.

3) Yes. There is nothing required to enter base facilities other than an ID card. That being said, she might potentially face problems in the MPF/FSS if she ever tried to renew her ID card.

4) Entire house, though you are given extra weight based on dependents.

[The Kayla]

Thanks Everyone!

[guineapigfury]

My wife was initially denied dental clearance to go to Japan. I, as a stupid LT, had her get a bunch of teeth removed on the promise of dental care upon arrival. We got to Japan and and were told dependents are seen "on a space available basis". My wife got no medical attention for 2 years and her situation deteriorated to the point that she needed $50K+ in surgery which by a miracle and the intervention of one hell of a SNCO we were able to obtain. What's the point of this? IF YOU DON'T PASS THE CLEARANCE, DON'T FUCKING GO.

[Guest]

What's the point of this? IF YOU DON'T PASS THE CLEARANCE, DON'T FUCKING GO.

Shack.

[itsokimapilot]

Careful. They deny medical for a reason, which your friend may well find out the hard way when they get there.

That may be the case in general. However, my wife was denied her clearance because no common sense was applied to the governing regulations. It's still a bureaucracy. If x occurred in the last five years then no medical clearance. She had x three years ago and requires no further treatment, but was denied. We missed out on an awesome assignment because the medical team couldn't see the forest through the trees.

Not every case is cut and dry. Use common sense and know your family. If you think it could be an issue later then, yes Rainman I totally agree with you. I knew my wife was good to go, but I chose not to take the assignment (or challenge the wing CC) because the Wing commander has made it clear no non-command sponsored family members at his base.

[Guest]

That sucks but be glad you are not regretting going for it.

[contraildash]

My wife had asthma as a kid and occasionally had attacks up a couple years back. Had to get a medical clearance to move to Germany. Not a big deal. But since that clearance is in her records, we have to get another clearance to move back to the states for the same condition. Go figure.

[mudhen69]

Another thing to consider is that if the dependant is not command sponsored, they are not eligible for a dependant visa. What this means is that, while for all practical purposes, the non sponsored dependant will be able to enter and exit the UK on a "tourist visa", they technically and legally will be an "illegal immigrant". . If the passport agent is in a bad mood or a jerk, they can deny you entry if you don't have a means of exiting, normally in the form of a return ticket. For example, the non sponsored dependant will probably not be able to buy a one way airline ticket or a round trip ticket which terminates in the UK. While you may luck out and get into the UK, if you ever leave, say for example to go to the continent for the weekend, you may be denied entry back into the UK. Worst case, they could get deported back to the US from that port of entry.

Having been through UK passport control several of times and just like any other type of law enforcement, you see varying levels of actual enforcement of this rule. When my parents visited, they got through the Heathrow passport control with no problem without having to show anything and got the standard 6 month tourist visa stamp. However, when we went through the passport control at the Calais Ferry terminal, the UK Border agent made us furnish evidence of their return plane ticket (we had the e-ticket confirmation email so if was no big deal) before they let them board the ferry.

Additionally, on the tourist visa stamp it says something like "no recourse to public funds". I have had no experience with the NHS since I go on base for medical treatment but this condition may limit the types of services you could receive at the hospital. Obviously if you get your arm chopped off and you are bleeding out, they will patch you up. While there is some sort of agreement between the NHS and Tricare since I know of a few people who have been treated off base with ailments outside the scope of the base hospital, I don't know if they apply to a non-command sponsored dependant since they are not "supposed" to be there.

Lastly, when my wife applied for a job she had to show that she was allowed to legally be in the country. So this could come up later if the non sponsored dependant tries to find work.

Certainly, they could get by Heathrow passport control with no issues, but the winters here are depressing enough without the prospect of never being able to travel and not being able to find a job.

[itsokimapilot]

Another thing to consider is that if the dependant is not command sponsored, they are not eligible for a dependant visa. ..Certainly, they could get by Heathrow passport control with no issues, but the winters here are depressing enough without the prospect of never being able to travel and not being able to find a job.

I can't speak to all of the legalities of the UK. For the country we were going to be residing in, they would allow my spouse to get a resident visa once we arrived. We just needed to take a trip to the capital city and fill out the paperwork at their immigration office. Tricare standard covers family members overseas that don't have command sponsorship at the local base. Healthcare is available, but you may have to pay up front depending on the location. Tricare will reimburse you. Info available on the tricare webpage. The one thing I found that was sketchy was that without command sponsorship your family members can't be med evac'd. So, if they get injured in a bad accident or get sick and need to get back to the states you'll have to foot 100% of that cost.