Return of the orderly room?

[Bones19]

I suppose I shouldn't hold my breath for a finance specialist, since that seems to be the larger issue for most folks than MPF...but may "administrative operations manager" will cover that sort of thing.

Dude that ship sailed with the advent of DTS and there is no way to un###### it. Although the epic failure of the CSA cards may have opened some eyes to how broken that system is...but probably not.

[TarHeelPilot]

The last Orderly Room I saw was about eight years ago... and then there was DTS.

[backseatdriver]

If only CE had the same expectations we do.

Don't sell yourself short - our expectations are just as low for CE as they are for Comm.

[Guest]

Don't sell yourself short - our expectations are just as low for CE as they are for Comm.

Speak for yourself.

[Winchester]

Don't sell yourself short - our expectations are just as low for CE as they are for Comm.

CE has lost more people during GWOT than anyone else in the AF. 17 last I remember and that was a year ago. But I'm sure they still have the time and manning to answer your demands. Edited August 3, 2012 by Winchester

[BQZip01]

Don't sell yourself short - our expectations are just as low for CE as they are for Comm.

Perhaps if we weren't abusing our CE troops ALL THE F**KING TIME filling army deployment billets because the Army undermanned their CE positions and refused to fix the problem. Our CE personnel are tired of 1 year tours in the kitty litter with less than a year home and divorce rates are HUGE. Thanks Schwartz [/rant off]

[backseatdriver]

CE has lost more people during GWOT than anyone else in the AF. 17 last I remember and that was a year ago. But I'm sure they still have the time and manning to answer your demands.

Easy Francis. I wasn't talking about EOD or Red Horse, but the base CE that take 2.5 years to fix a water leak in the vault (true story) among other things.

[17D_guy]

Easy Francis. I wasn't talking about EOD or Red Horse, but the base CE that take 2.5 years to fix a water leak in the vault (true story) among other things.

Same.

I meant that when CE has an outage, water for example, it's less "what did you do, fix it now!, I want a full AAR on why email was down for 20 min" or "why are the emails I sent to my wife's yahoo account taking so long to get there" (Wing King request.. wish I was kidding) and more "they're working on it, they're undermanned, etc". I've yet to have that experience in Comm even though the majority of our outages are:

1) Pushed by higher level leadership (consolidating services, pushing patches not tested)

2) Underfunded Contractors/Incompetent GS Civilians

3) Underfunded equip maintenance(most Comm equip "upgrades" are EOY funds, last base had 8yr old EOL servers, Wing refused to "upgrade" them because they were working)

4) Black Magic

5) Lack of training & experienced Amn

Additionally if I had an Amn working early '09 tickets into Nov of '10, then refusing to do the work because we moved the TV... I'd expect to get shit on. For CE.. that's just how they work and it's ok with the majority of leadership.

EDIT - Forgot the jab at GS Civilians

Edited August 4, 2012 by 17D_guy

[StainedClass]

Man oh man, could I tell some stories from the 80s in SAC and MAC when we had full up orderly rooms that did it all for you.

No there weren't finance specialists in the squadron; they were actually at Finance, where you filled out your voucher at the Travel Pay counter, sat down, read half a magazine article and then walked back to the counter when your name was called to be paid your voucher claim in CA$H.

It happened, not that long ago (relatively speaking).........

......<wait>, oh was I dreaming?? Wake up, grandpa, time for your meds.....

[Guest]

No there weren't finance specialists in the squadron; they were actually at Finance, where you filled out your voucher at the Travel Pay counter, sat down, read half a magazine article and then walked back to the counter when your name was called to be paid your voucher claim in CA$H....MINUS WHAT THEY HAD ALREADY GIVEN IN CASH AS AN ADVANCE.

It happened, not that long ago (relatively speaking).........

......&lt;wait&gt;, oh was I dreaming?? Wake up, grandpa, time for your meds.....

fixed

[skibum]

So I checked my UMPR doc (has not changed for years) and saw "Orderly Room" as a heading with a several posiitons listed under it. At least in my unit there has been and continues to be an orderly room.

[StainedClass]

fixed

thank you, kind sir, for the correction...

[Karl Hungus]

So I checked my UMPR doc (has not changed for years) and saw "Orderly Room" as a heading with a several posiitons listed under it. At least in my unit there has been and continues to be an orderly room.

As usual, AD could not be more different (worse) than the guard.

[Gravedigger]

What does a "knowledge operations manager" do?

At my base they basically have all of the shitty additional duties that nobody else in the OG wants to do. (Records management, forms and pubs, GPC, SVRO etc). They are also responsible for the OG sharepoint and all comm-related issues for the OG staff, which is their primary job. There are 4 SSgts assigned, although 1 or 2 are deployed at any given time. They work 12-hour days and receive zero praise. After talking to them, their jobs pretty much suck wherever they are assigned, and most of them try to cross-train.

As a career field, they work in offices for O-6 and above folks doing basically anything that needs to be done, but primarily focusing on comm. If you have a GO in your office, you have knowledge ops.

[Azimuth]

At my base they basically have all of the shitty additional duties that nobody else in the OG wants to do. (Records management, forms and pubs, GPC, SVRO etc). They are also responsible for the OG sharepoint and all comm-related issues for the OG staff, which is their primary job. There are 4 SSgts assigned, although 1 or 2 are deployed at any given time. They work 12-hour days and receive zero praise. After talking to them, their jobs pretty much suck wherever they are assigned, and most of them try to cross-train.

As a career field, they work in offices for O-6 and above folks doing basically anything that needs to be done, but primarily focusing on comm. If you have a GO in your office, you have knowledge ops.

In a previous lifetime I was a Personnelist. Thankless job filled with the bottom end of the ASVAB/AFOQT scorers. Bringing back CSS/Orderly Rooms is a step in the right direction. That will help aleviate the 69 additional duties most flyers have so we can focus on the big things like gettings AAD's and PME.

[17D_guy]

At my base they basically have all of the shitty additional duties that nobody else in the OG anyone wants to do...They work 12-hour days and receive zero praise. After talking to them, their jobs pretty much suck wherever they are assigned, and most of them try to cross-train.

FIFY & Truth.

Edited August 6, 2012 by 17D_guy

[Jimmy.The.Engineer]

I have been absolutely screaming for years about the loss of orderly rooms. I too, like the other old codgers here, remember those days well. The admin dudes/dudettes were called, "702 troops". Then, they became, "IMs". Then, they became gone. Finance was a trip to the CBPO (consolodated base personnel office) building to sign out your gangsta roll for your trip. If you actually had a Diner's Club credit card, you just stapled your receipts to your voucher, upon return, turned them in to the desk, waited 15. The finance officer would review it and the A1C with the pistol in the cash cage would issue you some cabbage. Even the mere mentioning of bringing back "O" rooms makes a bit of drizzle run down my leg. You young guys are in for a real treat, if this is true.

P.S.

I hope the guy who invented DTS lives a thousand years with his shame.

[17D_guy]

Tried to explain what the Orderly Rooms were like to a new Lt. He couldn't wrap his head about not having to constantly be at finance/MPF for stuff.

[GovernmentMan]

At my base they basically have all of the shitty additional duties that nobody else in the OG wants to do. (Records management, forms and pubs, GPC, SVRO etc). They are also responsible for the OG sharepoint and all comm-related issues for the OG staff, which is their primary job. There are 4 SSgts assigned, although 1 or 2 are deployed at any given time. They work 12-hour days and receive zero praise. After talking to them, their jobs pretty much suck wherever they are assigned, and most of them try to cross-train.

As a career field, they work in offices for O-6 and above folks doing basically anything that needs to be done, but primarily focusing on comm. If you have a GO in your office, you have knowledge ops.

Pretty much this. I was KM for a number of years, and had 10+ additional duties at any given time. And FWIW Records Management is not an add'l duty...it's one of like 5 "core competencies" for that AFSC. As long as a sq has a 3D0 assigned, the RM program should not be jacked.

[17D_guy]

Pretty much this. I was KM for a number of years, and had 10+ additional duties at any given time. And FWIW Records Management is not an add'l duty...it's one of like 5 "core competencies" for that AFSC. As long as a sq has a 3D0 assigned, the RM program should not be jacked.

You'd think so, but often they just add'l duty it out to each shop and have the 3D0 do "inspections" on everyone's files and make sure they're in line with the file plan.

God I wish I didn't know all this file plan shit...