RPA/Cyber has their medal on the way

[Keydet]

Sorry, I meant the AAM, not just AM.

[HU&W]

Sorry, I meant the AAM, not just AM.

Copy. That make more sense.

[ATIS]

So what medal do you award for playing Tic-Tac-Toe with a 80's supercomputer hell bent on launching a world ending nuke attack?

Cheers

ATIS

[Hacker]

I'll repost the wise words of a then-Major (now a Brig Gen) who had similar critiques about the way the USAF handled medals during ALLIED FORCE in '99 (posted to David Hackworth's website back in the day). Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose:

From the Air Force

Sir, good morning from Montgomery, Alabama as I stumble through the USAFs Air Command and Staff College (aka Air Command and Golf) - three months of work crammed into a year to appease the local chamber of commerce. I have been a USAF fighter pilot for 14 years with the last 8 years overseas in the Pacific and Europe.

As every military member under the current administration, I have performed my fair share of goofy political military operations: Boring holes in the airspace over Iraq to keep our foot in the door in defense of lower gas prices (we used to call it Provide Comfort until we realized how cynical it was to advertise protection for the same people the Turks were bombing - not much comfort there). Boring holes over Bosnia to appease the world that we were serious about ethnic cleansing (we called that one Deny Flight - the pilots thought it was because the Serbs were doing all the flying and we were doing all the denying).

In 1995, we finally grew a pair and started bombing in Bosnia - I was in F15E's and we were fragged with some targets that although insignificant to the effort - were too hard for the Navy to hit therefore we were performing a USAF political airshow while risking the lives of aircrews to look good to congress. While we were wearing out planes, parts and pilots in these contingency operations, those pilots wishing to log the sorties as combat time were allowed to - resulting in an Air medal every 20 times the landing gear successfully retracted.

Most did, but some of us only logged a combat sortie when we employed ordnance or performed a threat reaction to Iraqi fire. The result was that the true swordswingers ended up with fewer merit badges but retained their dignity while the careerists (who were scared shitless anyway) rode these fake accomplishments to stardom.

These practices drove the best and the brightest to United Airlines, and after 11 years in the USAF I came close to the same. I then stole a page from your book and cashed in all my blue chips by turning down school, aide jobs, joint jobs, etc. and volunteered for a real career killer - an exchange job in Australia flying F/A-18's for the RAAF at their Fighter Weapons School - best move I could have made to regain my sanity.

The RAAF has avoided the political correctness wave, the female social combat experiment, and has retained a culture that emphasizes war fighting over politics - how refreshing. It was interesting to watch the convicts from down under absolutely pummel visiting US fighter squadrons with their Ivy league commanders, their low morale, poor proficiency from contigency ops and low retention.

I chuckle at the USAFs bloated self press of "the most respected air and space force in the world" - funny, with all these billion dollar sattelites, platinum toys and ray guns, these bumpkins from down under treat us the same way the North Vietnamese Air Force treated us 35 years ago - they are kicking our platinum ass with 20mm gunshots from 2000' back like the Red Baron.

I wrote all this in my last station report which I am sure was lost at PACAF somewhere. But nevertheless, after 2.5 years in the tropics, I had purged all the vinegar for political hate from my veins. The Aussies were very appreciative of my efforts to their fighter force and pressed the highest levels of the USAF to reinstate my slot at staff college - here I am.

After arriving at ACSC, I began hearing what a cluster the whole Kosovo air war had been from my buddies from Europe with targets being selected at 1600 Penn Ave, D.C., only after approval from the French only to be missed by incompetent aircrews due to all the cuts in training and all the contingency flying. Anyway, none of this could upset my newly found "no worries" attitude and I just chalked it up the crazy political times.

Then some of my close fighter brethren relayed to me the medal frenzy - it went something like this: If you supported the operation from Missouri, England or Aviano and you're a LtCol - you get a Bronze Star.

If you saw a Surface to Air missile in flight - you apply for a DFC. If you threat reacted - you're a shoe-in. Each wing gets a Silver Star to distribute - What, a fucking lottery for a Silver Star? My buds told me it became fighter wing versus fighter wing versus bomber wing to see which wing commander could win the most Kosovo Olympic Gold. You either jumped on the team bandwagon or you were considered against it.

It further inbred worse since it was primarily an Air Force show - therefore our LtCols with their Bronze Stars could outperform the other services when competing for those hallowed joint jobs - You Gotta Be Shitting Me! The service with the motto "Integrity in all we do" is mortaging its dignity to promote its manufactured self image.

Sorry this litany is so long - I'd love to see an article comparing all the sorties of WWII - pilot KIA in WWII - to the DFC ratio of WWII and then compared to the Kosovo debacle.

As a closing note, there is an Army Ranger in my ACSC class who lost his kneecap and another chunk of his leg in Somalia - I don't know what decorations he received along with his Purple Heart from that event, but I am embarrassed to look him in the eye as we pass in the hallway thinking of the medal charade we paraded out of our last demonstration of impotence and the real sacrifice he and his brothers made on the ground.

Thanks for your ears - you should send me a therapy bill for just having an address for me to type to. As dedicated as a whitehouse intern.

[Spoo]

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose:

Sorry, I don't speak Spanish. Is that anything like "the more it changes, the more it's the same thing"?

[Guest one]

Thanks for sharing that.

I think that it is a good thing that they made a separate medal. It will allow people to instantly know they earned that medal from cyber warfare or from being a drone pilot. When you see someone with a Bronze star or Silver Star you instantly think that they did something heroic to earn it. That is how it should be. Before coming into the military I did not realize a military commander could get a Bronze star from Qatar for something their troops did in Iraq. I think that is much more messed up than creating a new medal for people who do great things as UAV pilot.

[Magellan]

Air medals are currently routine. If I was a betting man, I'd go all in on the idea that this medal will be handed out to just about everyone.

You are stupid, and need to spout off on the internet less and do your job more.

Aerial Achievement Medals are NOT Air Medals.

This medal will not be handed out like candy, and the guys doing the job that will be eligible for it aren't clamoring for recognition. They are just guys going to work and doing the JOB.

So if a guy gets in a fire fight after an IED explosion and saves his buddies lives he may get a BS with V device. However, if an RPA unit manages to tirelessly track someone for days to months that is recruiting IED enplacers/suicide bombers/jihadists, training them, coordinating funding, and equiping them to go take part in these fire fights, and then they manage to kill this HVT thus crippling the enemies ability to stage the kind of attacks that would prevent guys from needing to be in a situation to be eligible for a BS with V in the first place they should go completely unrecognized?

As my Grandpa who served in WWII would say "an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure." Why would you be butt hurt over handing out a medal that is lower than the DFC if what they are doing is important enough to prevent countless BS with V devices from being handed out or more importantly protecting innocent civilians who are being targeted OFF OF THE BATTLEFIELD.

America isn't about fair fights...we are about one sided victories. If we have figured out how to find and eliminate our enemies abroad without having to put boots on the ground maybe we should consider the value in that rather than branding the people who are doing the job as unworthy. Especially considering most of them don't want to be doing that job in the first place, but they suck it up and honor their end of the agreement with the Air Force.

[Toro]

I'll repost the wise words of a then-Major (now a Brig Gen) who had similar critiques about the way the USAF handled medals during ALLIED FORCE in '99 (posted to David Hackworth's website back in the day). Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose:

I do believe I've seen that one before.

Great words.

[nsplayr]

Duffle Blog is on this development already.

[Keydet]

You are stupid, and need to spout off on the internet less and do your job more.

Aerial Achievement Medals are NOT Air Medals.

Yes, I corrected myself prior to you doing so.

I'm not sure how much more of this post is directed at me, or if it is more directed at the news article, but you are shacked on exactly what my thought processes are regarding this career field. I find it hard to believe that a good amount of Americans make a big deal out of a technology that saves lives, manpower, and money (for the most part). By all means, oppose putting our ground forces in harm's way, but also harshly criticize technology that actually allows the government to continue taking the fight to the enemy without unnecessary human risk.

Edited February 15, 2013 by Keydet

[Vno]

https://petitions.wh...-medal/5KdnkBBN

White House petition to lower precedence.

Edited February 18, 2013 by Vno

[HU&W]

https://petitions.wh...-medal/5KdnkBBN

White House petition to lower precedence.

From the petition.

Bronze Stars are commonly awarded with a Valor device in recognition of a soldier's service in the heat of combat while on the ground in the theater of operation.

Valor devices are absolutely not commonly awarded.

[guineapigfury]

Isn't the real problem here the criteria for the Bronze Star? It's either an award for valor in battle or essentially a PCS medal for deployed personnel. That split causes problems. The DWM should rank below the Bronze Star with V, but above the Bronze Star for being a deployed towel folder.

[Danny Noonin]

Isn't the real problem here the criteria for the Bronze Star? It's either an award for valor in battle or essentially a PCS medal for deployed personnel. That split causes problems. The DWM should rank below the Bronze Star with V, but above the Bronze Star for being a deployed towel folder.

So what about the air medal? Can be awarded simply be for flying X number of times regardless of mission complexity or threat or it can be awarded for valor. Same deal in your mind or not?

[Guest one]

If you see a Colonel with a Bronze Star, 99% of the time it was for doing their job. When you see an E-4 with a Bronze Star you know they most likely did something very signifcant to earn it. The story behind the medal is more important than the medal.

[kabagram]

Medals. Serious Bidness.

[17D_guy]

If you see a Colonel with a Bronze Star, 99% of the time it was for doing their job. When you see an E-4 with a Bronze Star you know they most likely did something very signifcant to earn it. The story behind the medal is more important than the medal.

Whoa whoa whoa... who put this E-4 in for this. My little chart here says an E-4 can only be awarded a AFAM. I'll work an AFCM for you, but it's going to need a serious push note.

[magnetfreezer]

Whoa whoa whoa... who put this E-4 in for this. My little chart here says an E-4 can only be awarded a AFAM. I'll work an AFCM for you, but it's going to need a serious push note.

Yep... had a 'command' chief (who apparently was in the chain of command for E medals) try to deny a MSM for a tech (who had actually been promoted to master by the time the paperwork finally made it). Literally wanted to see that the guy had gotten 5s on all his EPRs *ever*. O-6 intervention later required.

[Guest one]

Whoa whoa whoa... who put this E-4 in for this. My little chart here says an E-4 can only be awarded a AFAM. I'll work an AFCM for you, but it's going to need a serious push note.

This is almost exactly what was said when they put me up for a JSCM as an E-4. Even though our chief would just copy paste bullets from our awards for his DMSM.

[17D_guy]

Yep... had a 'command' chief (who apparently was in the chain of command for E medals) try to deny a MSM for a tech (who had actually been promoted to master by the time the paperwork finally made it). Literally wanted to see that the guy had gotten 5s on all his EPRs *ever*. O-6 intervention later required.

That's what the base E9 said when my OTS pkg went up for a Letter of Recommendation from the Wing King. He wanted to know why I was being nominated since I had 2 EPR's with single markdowns. Still 5's... just markdowns in single areas.

Back on topic - with the news of the "new" Chinese cyber attacks out I wonder if people will back of the pissy-ness on the precedence. I doubt it.

[Techsan]

Yep... had a 'command' chief (who apparently was in the chain of command for E medals) try to deny a MSM for a tech (who had actually been promoted to master by the time the paperwork finally made it). Literally wanted to see that the guy had gotten 5s on all his EPRs *ever*. O-6 intervention later required.

Sounds very similar to a guy that PCS'd from our squadron. Still waiting for O-6 intervention though.

[17D_guy]

Was just wondering if there was this much fanfare when the flying medals were initially introduced. Were the infantry officers enraged that those people high above the danger were getting glittery things too? I remember reading about the fight just to get dependable weather for the fliers, real life/death stuff.

[BFM this]

Yes, here was a bit of a dust up when the AM was introduced.

.

What I wonder, is if back then were the people actually in line for this award thinking "WTF?", like they are now.

Edited February 21, 2013 by BFM this

[guineapigfury]

Was just wondering if there was this much fanfare when the flying medals were initially introduced. Were the infantry officers enraged that those people high above the danger were getting glittery things too? I remember reading about the fight just to get dependable weather for the fliers, real life/death stuff.

The Bronze Star was introduced as the counterpart to the Air Medal. So we have officially come full circle.

[nsplayr]

Got an email today from a vets organization soliciting input (i.e. complaints) about the DWM to be packaged and sent to the SECDEF. Here's my question...nothing in the description of the medal says you have to be remote/cyber/whatever. Wondering if CCs could start putting dudes in for the DWM for actions that rank below a DFC but are still one-off major contributions to the war effort...I guess above the rarely-given single-mission AM? Just spitballing here...agreed that the hierarchy is a little screwed up.