FY 14 Force Management Program (RIF, VSP, TERA)

TERA applicant · May 20, 2014

Congrats to all of the VSP people. Any TERA III approvals out there?

lossofclocklossofdata · May 20, 2014

Even after approval AFPC can't not fuc! Up. First email was approved 29 Sep. Second email was 1 Aug date change request denied. Still 29 Sep, which is what I want now that the approvals were delayed 2.5 months. Today's email says "please disregard system generated emails. Your actual separation is 31 july." WTF! Get it right just once AFPC. Now I have to apply under hardship (terminal starts last week) to get it changed back to 29 Sep.

Chuck17 · May 20, 2014

Maybe you have more update info than I do but I got a call from a buddy in the 17th about two weeks ago saying they were told they were being cut next year.

Pure speculation on my part.

As far a CHS not losing a sq - believe it when I see it. But if your leadership wants even less people to do the same amount of work, sweet.

Chuck

Vspapplicant · May 21, 2014

Any approvals today? Anyone else still hanging on to hope?

jsanto1 · May 21, 2014

There are a couple of us still hanging on to a small amount of hope, mostly bomber pilots I think.

BoneIP · May 21, 2014

Any approvals today? Anyone else still hanging on to hope?

despite the sinking feeling in my chest, and the low probability of approval, I am holding on to hope... because it truly is the best thing for my family right now and I strongly believe that my next move is out of Active Duty, no matter which program gets me there.

Azimuth · May 21, 2014

The C-17 side at KLTS took a huge hit in Pilots and Loads. The -135's only lost four Pilots (Booms weren't eligible).

Mish_Hacker · May 21, 2014

There are a couple of us still hanging on to a small amount of hope, mostly bomber pilots I think.

Not sure why bomber applications require additional scrutiny....

Dupe · May 21, 2014

Not sure why bomber applications require additional scrutiny....

My spit-ball guess is that the number of applicants vs the number of bodies to be cut is way more. On the 11M side, we had a bunch of folks sitting in an airframe that's going away... thus making cutting with an axe much easier.

Nasty2004 · May 21, 2014

Not sure why any of the applications needed 60 days of additional scrutiny...

FUSEPLUG · May 21, 2014

The C-17 side at KLTS took a huge hit in Pilots and Loads. The -135's only lost four Pilots (Booms weren't eligible).

Checks. Without getting into numbers, AFPC has dealt the C-17 FTU a major shit-sandwich. While I think a message has been sent, I do not believe it will be received by leadership. Somehow it will all be worked out and timelines will be met (read Powerpoint slides for the O-6 in the green). Meanwhile, the burden lies with the guys still left in the squadron fighting the good fight.

C-21.Pilot · May 21, 2014

Here at Randolph, just under the T-6 PIT side, we "lost" (their gain) 8 folks yesterday/today to the VSP. Another one is about to separate under no Force Mgt programs within the next 30 days.

Mish_Hacker · May 21, 2014

My spit-ball guess is that the number of applicants vs the number of bodies to be cut is way more. On the 11M side, we had a bunch of folks sitting in an airframe that's going away... thus making cutting with an axe much easier.

Sure, the ratio of applicants to overages could be higher in the bombers, but only if the published metrics are all wrong. For 05 11Bs, we were about 11% overage (7/62). However, I would argue we have a much lower application ratio compared to the 11Ms. From 3 of the 5 bomber bases, I only counted two applicants in my year group (again, I don't have all the numbers).

Just using Dyess as an example, we had 5 total bomber pilot VSP applications for 2+ squadrons. However, we had 40 applications from the two 130 squadrons. That may not translate exactly across the AF, but I don't think we are applying at a higher rate than 11Ms, and our overages are fairly similiar for most year groups.

I do agree that losing an airframe would also help, but then there's the Altus C-17 IP exodus (airframe not going away). Based on the numbers I've seen, I still can't understand the difference. Especially since NO bomber pilots with UPT ADSC have been approved yet...

Maybe we're just too good at CAS :)

LookieRookie · May 21, 2014

Here at Randolph, just under the T-6 PIT side, we "lost" (their gain) 8 folks yesterday/today to the VSP. Another one is about to separate under no Force Mgt programs within the next 30 days.

Any of the pit students get VSP?

Azimuth · May 21, 2014

Any of the pit students get VSP?

A guy I know just finished T-6 PIT and had just got to Laughlin when he found out he got it yesterday.

outlaw05 · May 21, 2014

Mish Hacker,

For what its worth, no one on the C-130 side at Dyess has heard anything either. At least none that I know of, but I'm TDY so I may be off the pulse. Back to your point, I'm really confused about how they went about notifying folks, or why they would wait to deny everyone that's going to be denied until next week.

BitteEinBit · May 21, 2014

Just using Dyess as an example, we had 5 total bomber pilot VSP applications for 2+ squadrons. However, we had 40 applications from the two 130 squadrons. That may not translate exactly across the AF, but I don't think we are applying at a higher rate than 11Ms, and our overages are fairly similiar for most year groups.

Holy sh*t, did I read that right? 40 apps from the C-130 side at Dyess? I wonder how many were pilots. I can't imagine many of those bubbas getting approved, but AFPC has proved logic wrong many times before...

Checks. Without getting into numbers, AFPC has dealt the C-17 FTU a major shit-sandwich. While I think a message has been sent, I do not believe it will be received by leadership. Somehow it will all be worked out and timelines will be met (read Powerpoint slides for the O-6 in the green). Meanwhile, the burden lies with the guys still left in the squadron fighting the good fight.

I'm happy for the bubbas who got the VSP. Take advantage of the great opportunities on the outside, and deal with the AF BS part time. I don't think the AF really loses here if even half of those VSP bubbas finish in the reserves (STS). While life will probably suck for those who decided to stay in dealing with the temporary shortages, things will still move along in the AF even if it isn't pretty.

I just have a suspicion that although lessons were ~~learned~~ observed here, AFPC will still f*ck up the next round of RIFs. Go ahead and start the thread now...it is going to happen eventually. We know...AFPC "couldn't have predicted this" "The force management process is complex, fluid, and dynamic." "You're the best!" "Service before Self" "Blah Blah Blah"

Congrats and good luck to everyone! I'm drinking JD in your on-her...onner...honor!

Dubs · May 21, 2014

Does anyone know if the Career Data Brief page pulls its info from MILPDS? I'm now showing a DOS on CDB, but nowhere else. If CDB does pull from MILPDS, I want to do that initial separations brief ASAP to get the ball rolling to get orders.

Right Rudder · May 21, 2014

Still not sure on the rationale about how these are being handed out; have any 11M C-130(H/J) individuals got a confirmed vsp response yet? We seem to be lacking in confirmed notifications compared to pretty much every other 11M airframe.

Edited May 21, 2014 by Right Rudder

gator2 · May 21, 2014

Right Rudder, I'm a C-130 legacy guy in a T-1 billet. I got approved along with another legacy guy in my sq.

Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App!

32off · May 21, 2014

Who's up for a FY14 force management discussion forum reunion in 10 years? I vote chizz as the forum president!!

Did anyone else get an email saying they needed attachment 3 from psdm 14-08 for further application processing?

Lumbergh · May 21, 2014

Still not sure on the rationale about how these are being handed out; have any 11M C-130(H/J) individuals got a confirmed vsp response yet? We seem to be lacking in confirmed notifications compared to pretty much every other 11M airframe.

My post from 2 days ago below

Approved!

'06 11M

3 yrs 5 mo UPDT ADSC

RDTM - HB (C-130)

Drank a beer immediately. Good luck to those still waiting

Edited May 21, 2014 by Lumbergh

chizz · May 21, 2014

had an 05 11M IP approved yesterday at the rock

Mish_Hacker · May 21, 2014

Dear AFPC,

Please consider adjusting your communication process. A weekly (sometimes) update that reads like a staff meeting powerpoint slide to your superiors (ie processed x of y applicants with z ineligible) shows that you check the box for "communication" and "timely updates," but it provides marginal utility to those who NEED the information only you can provide. Likewise, any time you take an action that raises questions (like approving a bazillion 11M applications on one day while not processing others), you should consider releasing a statement then.

For example on Monday afternoon send an email/Tweet/FB post/Pulse, "Due to the variations in final considerations of Force Management numbers from different components of Air Staff, AMC pilot applications are being processed first. We anticipate Air Staff approval/disapproval for 11X applications by ____day, and will notify those members as soon as ____day. Additionally, we have updated the FY14 voluntary matrix based off of the applicants already notified. It is attached/available on MyPers. This information is also being sent to your local FSS and commanders. If you have any specific questions regarding your year group/afsc status, please contact your commander who will have direct access to their equivalent here at AFPC. Thanks for your patience, and may the odds be ever in your favor."

Love,

The "Hopefuls"

Mish_Hacker · May 21, 2014

Dear AFPC,

Please consider adjusting your communication process. A weekly (sometimes) update that reads like a staff meeting powerpoint slide to your superiors (ie processed x of y applicants with z ineligible) shows that you check the box for "communication" and "timely updates," but it provides marginal utility to those who NEED the information only you can provide. Likewise, any time you take an action that raises questions (like approving a bazillion 11M applications on one day while not processing others), you should consider releasing a statement then.

For example on Monday afternoon send an email/Tweet/FB post/Pulse, "Due to the variations in final considerations of Force Management numbers from different components of Air Staff, AMC pilot applications are being processed first. We anticipate Air Staff approval/disapproval for 11X applications by ____day, and will notify those members as soon as ____day. Additionally, we have updated the FY14 voluntary matrix based off of the applicants already notified. It is attached/available on MyPers. This information is also being sent to your local FSS and commanders. If you have any specific questions regarding your year group/afsc status, please contact your commander who will have direct access to their equivalent here at AFPC. Thanks for your patience, and may the odds be ever in your favor."

Love,

The "Hopefuls"