FY 14 Force Management Program (RIF, VSP, TERA)

[Catbox]

Does anyone know if AFPC is adjusting the separation date window for VSP? Originally September was the latest one could separate, but I'm wondering if there is any official or unofficial guidance indicating otherwise.

Here's what you can safely assume: no one anywhere in the entire Air Force actually knows what's going on with the force managment programs.

[Lumbergh]

Here's what you can safely assume: no one anywhere in the entire Air Force actually knows what's going on with the force managment programs.

TRUTH

[lossofclocklossofdata]

So is an adsc 6 year waiver for those that have served 6 years with only 4 left? Or those that served 4 and have 6 left?

I'm thinking the second because that'll still keep the 08 group in the running for VSP unless they graduated upt late.

My exact thoughts. Somewhere at AFPC....."What did we say? 05-08 yr groups? (Counts on fingers) So I'm getting 6 yr ADSCs left, is that what you got?"

[ComingLeft]

Received this email from AFPC today:

Thank you all for participating in the most comprehensive climate survey to date. We had record high participation and will use this information to better serve the force. Aim high!

Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App!

April Fool's

[albertschu]

Damn glad to hear it, brother. I got responses too, but they were non-answer answers. Very frustrating.

Gents and ladies,

This moment of introspection has been interesting, but it's time to get crackin' again. 1 April was rumored to be a deadline....so everybody pimp your CCs and buddies at staff and see what the hell we can dig up before it trickles down the FSS chain.

Can you keep us posted on that? Could be interesting.

Input: a few telephone calls / emails with staffer to explain the situation.

Outcome: non-answer answer in the form of a memo signed by O-6 at LL.

Was it worth it? Absolutely.

While the situation was not fixed nor adequately explained, it did force someone at AFPC to try to justify their buffoonery to LL and exposed the said buffoonery to staffers. If Air Force leadership can't put enough pressure on AFPC to fix their stuff, maybe a little Congressional interest will help. I recommend making the phone call. Enough inquiries could very well make a difference. If not, at least you'll get a cool souvenir.

[TrunkMonkey]

Here is what I know with about 75% reliability (take it for what it is worth), guy who knows a guy who knows a guy told me ... you get the idea.

TERA packages for pilots are being processed and being sent around AFPC for MORE coordination because FAMs gave out assignments after TERA applications were put in...so the long and the short is that my TERA approval is pending whether or not my FAM chooses to release me from the assignment he/she gave to me AFTER I applied for the program. My boss is just a touch tweaked about this news, especially given how painful this process has been thus far and is trying to get a hold of my FAM on the phone to find out what the ground-truth is for my situation. I'll get back to this forum as soon as I hear words...guessing 7 days or so given the speed of this process so far.

[tunes]

I haven't seen much on Palace chase on here but does anyone know why 11M functionals have been directed to non-concur on applications in over manned carrer fields? I have an ADSC of 19 months. I have been hired by a unit and My airframe is overmanned and I was told it was going to be denied becase of my ADSC. Does anybody have any thoughts or experience on what is going on? Other that an artibtrary rule that they won't approve them outside of a year. Xanax is sounding pretty good right now

Functionals seem to always recommend disapproval....your functionals recommendation means absolutely nothing. ALl that matters is what the PC office decides, and lately it seems its been blanket approval for anyone with less than 3 years of UPT ADSC...I've also seen a 3 yr 3 month approved, and 4 yr 5 month approved in the past 3-4 months...haven't really heard of anyone denied PC lately.

[Fiver]

- 6 year ADSC means they are waiving 6 years, so you only have to have served 4 years of UPT commitment to be eligible
- they are extending/doing another round of programs in FY14/15 which will include ADSC waivers...this program will push VSP separation window to 30 Apr 15 and TERA window to 1 May 15. Why? because they have done very little with the first two programs Why? because they have no accountability and can do what they want for the sake of doing "what's best for the air force" and you can't do anything about it.

- I think we will hear something this week or next on some officers getting approved/disapproved for VSP/TERA, but no where near the amount needed to reduce the force by 18K peeps over the next 3 years; hence, more force management programs.
- You have to remember too that 10k applications of 327K total people in the Air Force is 3.1% of the total force. Relatively speaking, not a whole lot of people care about approving these voluntary applications
- The question that we will never get answered is, "why are we turning down thousands of voluntary applications if we have to do involuntary programs in 15?" This ineligible bullshit is nonsensical.
- I bet they had more applications in some overages than needed and less applications than needed for other AFSCs/yeargroups. Which ones, we may never know since they don't even know what matrix to use.

- I don't think they know what to do with pilots due to A-10, KC-10, U-2 and the reshuffling of planes to the reserves, but they will have to let a lot of pilots go, they just don't know exactly where yet. Why? No one can make decisions in the AF without an eSSS signed by 74 other people.
- But there is no doubt, VSP/TERAs will get denied and then people will get RIF'd. Not for the sake of money, but for the sake of incompetence and too many bureaucrats involved in the process.
- They are slow rollin' this beast until FY15 NDAA comes out...they just wanted to, "give you and your families enough time to think about it" but that really means give them more time to figure out how to execute these programs given the ever changing budget

- I think we will get an answer for the missed deadline and delays in processing of something like, "the continued balance of readiness, force structure, and modernization has caused us to make strategic decisions to reevaluate the appropriate force management timeline" blah, blah, blah
- I bet we hear more of nothing on MyPers in the form of an article that continues to tell us nothing of any substance and further distances us because we cannot believe what he says because he continues to over promise and under deliver. Any date they post, any criteria they list, any matrix will be worthless information.
- We will not get solid answers to tough questions...ever.

- because I don't like to b**** without offering a solution... All voluntary applications approved. I have 8k more people to get rid of through involuntary measures and potentially less than 10k more to cross train if necessary (Aug 2013 done). Sept 13 - Mar 2014, RIF boards complete, verify my end strength numbers with congress, 1 Apr 2014 I'm chuckin' deuces to 8k peeps. I got my cash for FY16 and I'm throwin' benjies at F-35 delays, RQ-4s I don't want, pilots are flying again and not working at habitat for humanity, and the reserves are flying any plane built before 1990. 2 Apr 2014, I'm lookin' for my follow-on consulting assignment at SAIC thanks to Deb.

Edited August 5, 2014 by Fiver

[zmoney]

- because I don't like to bitch without offering a solution... All voluntary applications approved. I have 16K more people to get rid of through involuntary measures and potentially less than 2K more to cross train if necessary (Aug 2013 done). Sept 13 - Mar 2014, RIF boards complete, verify my end strength numbers with congress, 1 Apr 2014 I'm chuckin' deuces to 16K peeps. I got my cash for FY16 and I'm throwin' benjies at F-35 delays, RQ-4s I don't want, pilots are flying again and not working at habitat for humanity, and the reserves are flying any plane built before 1990. 2 Apr 2014, I'm lookin' for my follow-on consulting assignment at SAIC thanks to Deb.

Where you at Welsch?

[TarHeelPilot]

Where you at Welsch?

It's "Welsh," and I'm certain many more than 2K applied for voluntary programs (O and E), out of the total force number you quote.

[stract]

Where you at Welsch?

For the love of God, it's really not that hard to spell the fucking CSAF's name right! W E L S H.

[TarHeelPilot]

"Cox said the Air Force has so far received a little more than 10,000 applications for early retirement"

That's TERA alone... from your favorite AF gossip magazine

[Karl Hungus]

Words

One of the better summaries to date.

AF "leadership" has really f-ed themselves on this one. The younger generations are paying very close attention to this debacle, and are planning accordingly. I don't know many folks in the 05-12 year groups who plan on staying past their commitment. That's not a good thing.

[panchbarnes]

Yup.

I have no dog in this fight (yet), but Big Blue has lost all credibility with me with the way they screwed over its people with the force management program.

These support organizations used to *try* to support the warfighters so they can focus on the mission. Nowadays, they don't seem to be even trying anymore. As a matter of fact, it's now the other way around. The warfighters supporting A1/FSS/AFPC, doing their work for them, and trying to execute the mission at the same time. This is just insane for a warfighting organization, and people in charge should be ashamed of themselves for not being held accountable. Instead of transparency, they've doubled-down and remained silent or continue to spin their screw ups. EVEN AFTER THE CSAF SENDS OUT A SERVICE-WIDE E-MAIL REMINDING US OF: INTEGRITY FIRST, SERVICE BEFORE SELF, AND EXCELLENCE IN ALL WE DO.

At a time when airmen are looking for guidance and vector (remember that?) from our "leaders" we get silence instead. At a time when the AF needs a culture change to address serious issues we get spins, unofficial suggestions, and cosmetic fixes instead.

Somebody (anybody!) from HAF/A1/AFPC please step up and own this mess. The taxpayers didn't pay you to go thru these fancy in-residence leadership/management schools and your nice salary (with the shiny ranks) for you to hide out in the comfort of your office. Your airmen are taking notes of your inaction.

Like I said, I have no dog in the FMP fight (yet), but I feel obligated to point out the facts (as I see them).

Sorry for the rambling.

Panch

Edited April 2, 2014 by PanchBarnes

[Fiver]

For the love of God, it's really not that hard to spell the ######ing CSAF's name right! W E L S H.

You're right corrections made; however, out of all the info in the post the only comment is on the spelling of Welsch's name? Welsh is a tough one; it would be easier if it were Nebuchadnezzar. You're destined for 0-6. Pull that TERA app!

Just kidding. I appreciate it, accept for the cussing at me about spelling errors. I am much better on a team than by myself.

Edited April 2, 2014 by Fiver

[FlyFastLiveSlow]

I called the TFSC and they sent an inquiry to the retirements section as to why notification didn't come out by the yesterday deadline. I got a BS answer of we'll hopefully notify MOST people in the next few days. It was a crap answer, but it was at least asked to the retirements office at AFPC. If you'd like to do something, call the TFSC and submit a status check. Hopefully they'll be flooded today.

[HeloDude]

For the love of God, it's really not that hard to spell the fucking CSAF's name right! W E L S H.

Just curious...how many times have you made these fantastic corrections (I'm recalling quite a few)? Does this mistake in particular really bother you that much or are you now BO's spell checker?

[Mountain]

...are you now BO's spell checker?

Actually, it's "BODN". Sorry, couldn't help myself.

[HeloDude]

Actually, it's "BODN". Sorry, couldn't help myself.

Touché!

[BitteEinBit]

It makes sense to me....deny TERA and VSP to those who actually want to get out so that I can get an extra year or two out of them before they get out anyway and then turn around and kick out those who want to stay so I can get my numbers to look good NOW. I'll worry about the pilot shortage when it gets here in a few years. I'll throw some money at it and people will stay because like that old saying, throwing money at a problem 100% of the time works 70%...of the...or...70% of the time...it works....well either way, I'm going to just throw money at it because it works.

Who the hell plans ahead for those kinds of things anyway!? We can always change the criteria to meet our objectives. All I care about is looking good NOW so I can guarantee myself my next promotion and job opportunity. A pilot shortage is only a pilot shortage if the numbers I produce say it is. All I have to do is change the numbers and BAM! No more pilot shortage. Look Boss...slides are green again!

Now , give me my fucking star!

[Mountain]

DoS of 31 Jul 14 just appeared on my CDB, along with a RNLTD of 1 Aug 2014 in the RESTRICTIONS section above it. It appears the cake may not be a lie!

BRB, gotta go run around the parking lot with my junk out.

[jstarsshag]

Core_Values_TriSig_Signed.pdf

[lossofclocklossofdata]

DoS of 31 Jul 14 just appeared on my CDB, along with a RNLTD of 1 Aug 2014 in the RESTRICTIONS section above it. It appears the cake may not be a lie!

BRB, gotta go run around the parking lot with my junk out.

Remind us again. TERA or VSP?

[Altus Barbarosa]

TERA approved gents! This time it's not TSgt Barbarosa!!

15.8yrs no adsc.

[Mountain]

Remind us again. TERA or VSP?

TERA

I'm a selectively continued major, 11R (U-2), '98, no QFRB. I'll be 16 yrs + 1 month in Aug.

Edited April 2, 2014 by Mountain