Magruber Posted July 19, 2014 Posted July 19, 2014 New Vance Wing CC put the kaibash on Friday. I'm dumbfounded that is deemed to be out of regs.
Herk Driver Posted July 19, 2014 Posted July 19, 2014 (edited) Typically the flag is worn by AMC guys. Others either wear WIC patches or their Wing patch, normally. Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! Edited July 19, 2014 by Herk Driver
Magruber Posted July 19, 2014 Author Posted July 19, 2014 Yeah I get that. But to say its out of regs baffles me.
Herk Driver Posted July 19, 2014 Posted July 19, 2014 There are no hard and fast rules on this which is why I was not absolute in what I said. How about, If the local sup or local policy says that you will wear the wing patch on the left shoulder of the FDU then at that base it would be out of regs or at least a violation of local policy. Back when Herks were ACC, this was a constant battle. Nothing that hasn't been done before. Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! 1
chim richalds Posted July 19, 2014 Posted July 19, 2014 why would you want to wear the flag of such an oppressive nation?
M2 Posted July 19, 2014 Posted July 19, 2014 So what nation's flag does he want you to wear?!? I bet this flag wouldn't be prohibited! Try it! 1
Magruber Posted July 19, 2014 Author Posted July 19, 2014 why would you want to wear the flag of such an oppressive nation? My point exactly. It's the principle of the situation.
Breckey Posted July 19, 2014 Posted July 19, 2014 There already was a big debate on this but my search-fu is weak. BLUF if you want to wear a flag patch be assigned to AMC/AFSOC or join the Army. Local regs trump your individuality.
HU&W Posted July 19, 2014 Posted July 19, 2014 AFI 36-2903 para 8.4.7 specifically allows US Flag, wing/group/center emblem, and school patches. Although subordinate instructions or local policies can be "more strict", they shouldn't run directly counter to the parent reg. It would be the equivalent of saying "even though the AFI says to, on this base we're more strict, we don't wear hats with our ABU's."
Herk Driver Posted July 19, 2014 Posted July 19, 2014 (edited) ACC sup (the one I have may be outdated) leaves it up to the installation commander. I realize this is an AETC issue but can't find that sup right now. This has always been an issue. Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! Edited July 19, 2014 by Herk Driver
Magruber Posted July 19, 2014 Author Posted July 19, 2014 All points understood and I'm not naive to the regs. I just can't believe this has become an issue. It's always been an issue where it wasn't truly enforced.
Magruber Posted July 19, 2014 Author Posted July 19, 2014 Yes please go to extremes to make my point seem ridiculous. Standardization is all well and good. But not allowing me to wear it is American blasphemy. You should look at your shoulder and see who you fight for. I don't serve for the 71 FTW but for the USA. That's my point. It's what ALL services have in common. It's what ALL Americans have in common. To say it's not authorized for my uniform is a tremendous oversight. 2 4
Right Seat Driver Posted July 19, 2014 Posted July 19, 2014 ACC sup (the one I have may be outdated) leaves it up to the installation commander. I realize this is an AETC issue but can't find that sup right now. This has always been an issue. Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! Full disclosure, I am a MAF guy. But I have never understood all of the push-back towards dudes who do not wear the American Flag on the left shoulder at UPT bases, or WIC grads, or TPS grads. A person at my previous base asked one of the Patches if he was proud to serve his country because he no longer wore the American Flag. However, Kadena and Mildenhall guys don't wear the American Flag and it never seems to be an issue. 1
Magruber Posted July 19, 2014 Author Posted July 19, 2014 I was an ACC and AFSOC guy. So I've been in both camps. I just take issue with saying our national symbol is inappropriate.
Breckey Posted July 19, 2014 Posted July 19, 2014 The Navy/Marines grunts don't wear the American flag, yet I'm pretty sure they know who they fight for. 1
Lord Ratner Posted July 19, 2014 Posted July 19, 2014 However, Kadena and Mildenhall guys don't wear the American Flag and it never seems to be an issue. Not only that, we wear the Air Force patch of a country that isn't even America! OMGWTFBBQ!1
Magruber Posted July 19, 2014 Author Posted July 19, 2014 You need an embroidered piece of cloth on your arm to remind you who you fight for. Your family and your Sq bros aren't enough to remind you. The uniform itself isn't enough. The jet you fly into combat, emblazoned with "U.S. Air Force" and the star and bars..... also not enough. Copy all. Yes I do. Somewhere in history we forgot what it means. Being the flag bearer was an honor. Now we roll over and act like it ain't no thing. Uniforms are fallible. The flag isn't. But apparently I'm in the minority.
Breckey Posted July 19, 2014 Posted July 19, 2014 Flags were not common on American military uniforms until the 1980s.
Magruber Posted July 19, 2014 Author Posted July 19, 2014 Gays weren't allowed in the military either. 1 1
Fuzz Posted July 19, 2014 Posted July 19, 2014 Seems to swing back and forth between whoever is in command of the base (ACC vs AMC). Except when Col. Mack (now BG) was the WG/CC, the AMC guys wore the american flag, the ACC guys wore the wing patch and morale patches and Friday shirts were the norm even though the AFI said otherwise.
schokie Posted July 19, 2014 Posted July 19, 2014 Gays weren't allowed in the military either. Whatever. You detract from your argument. I just assume that my sheer awesomeness let everyone know I was an American. I've always laughed at flightsuit-wearers from other countries who have to wear their flag just so I know where they're from. Americans are so awesome that people just know. Superpower coming through. Humble but awesome.
hispeed7721 Posted July 20, 2014 Posted July 20, 2014 For me, wearing the flag on my shoulder is something of personal pride. I understand the regs and before coming to AFSOC I was in wings that chose to wear their patch instead of Old Glory. It didn't diminish the pride that I have for it in any way whatsoever, but I can understand different wings wearing different patches. BL, as long as I know how much it means to me personally, I'm ok. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Napoleon_Tanerite Posted July 20, 2014 Posted July 20, 2014 I don't need a flag to remind me that I'm American. Maybe it's because I grew up in ACC, but the flag patch just seems redundant. I will say I'm in the minority being that I'm in a T-1 squadron though. 1
BCan Posted July 20, 2014 Posted July 20, 2014 Heavy pilots wear american flags in order to comply with Postal Service requirements to carry mail...no? 2 1
Napoleon_Tanerite Posted July 20, 2014 Posted July 20, 2014 Heavy pilots wear american flags in order to comply with Postal Service requirements to carry mail...no? No 2 1
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