Vision waiver info

[Guest monkey]

Were the high IOPs recorded on the "puff" tester or did they poke you in the eye with the blue circle thingy?

AETC/SG is kind of touchy about high IOPs especially with disc cupping and/or any other unusual factors. It is easier for them to DQ people rather than really look into the situation since they have an infinite pool of candidates to choose from. I speak from the AD side so it may be a bit different with AFRES. I seem to recall a slightly different waiver approval chain for non-AD so you might be able to cut AETC/SG out of the equation.

I had a similar situation during my F1C but luckily they never confirmed the puff readings with applanation. Because of this, and a variety of other errors, I was able to get an ETP. For some reason AETC/SG doesn't seem to listen to civilian eye docs. I've heard far too many stories of people getting sent off base, finding out things are fine, and getting DQed anyway based on the original AF exam. I don't know why they even suggest further consult since they don't consider the results at all.

The OHT waiver criteria provided is for current aviators. Once you get your foot in the door and they spend a few million bucks training you they are suddenly far more willing to keep you around despite any medical issues.

At first they did the puffer test. When the first eye came up with the very high value of 34 mmHg the person administering the test didn't even bother doing the second eye and immediately had me go see the optometrist upstairs. He then did the blue circle thing (applanation tonometry.) That's when I got 22 mmHg. Such a big disparity for readings taken within minutes of each other would imply to me that one or both of the readings is wrong. I am aware that eye pressure fluctuates just like blood pressure, but 34/22 is not a normal situation of a few digits being off for separate readings. The optometrist thought maybe the puffer test might have caught my eyelid while I was blinking.

So my understanding is that there are no waivers...

Do they allow re-measurements in any case?

[GearMonkey]

So my understanding is that there are no waivers...

Do they allow re-measurements in any case?

Based on my experience (a couple years old at this point) you're in kind of a tough spot. You won't get an FC1 waiver on the Active Duty side but things may be different in the Reserves. Your next step would be an Exception to Policy request. These are sometimes approved when it can be shown that a candidate meets FC2 standards (or FC2 waiver criteria). In addition to the medical arguement you'll have to make a strong case that you walk on water and that it would be in the best interests of the Air Force to roll the dice on you. Active Duty members send the ETP request up their chain of command to the Vice Chief of Staff. I'm not sure the routing for an AFRES ETP request. If the ETP is granted you'll still have to go to Brooks and they'll probably try to derail you somehow. Best case scenario you get an ETP, go to Brooks, get good IOP measurements, and put this all behind you. It's an uphill battle but not impossible yet.

[Guest monkey]

It's an uphill battle but not impossible yet.

Thank you, that's what I needed to know. As long it's possible (even remotely) I'll keep on fighting.

Since I am a civilian, would it be my unit who would make the ETP request and build the case on my behalf? Is there anything I can personally do, as a civilian?

[GearMonkey]

I don't know the specifics but imagine your AFRES unit would have to be involved somehow. Whether or not they have to "hire" you first adds another piece to this puzzle. Check out AFI 48-123 and the AF Waiver Guide (both are online) to learn about ETPs. The example is for an age waiver but the process is exactly the same for a medical ETP. The regs don't provide a whole lot of detail so you sort of have to make it up and educate people as you go. PM me with any ETP questions once you figure out who to submit it to.

[Guest mors]

I am going to be getting a B.S in 2 years and i want to apply to OCS for a pilot slot. This is the only way i can know if i can be a pilot with out enlisting first.

I am worried about the vision part of the FC1 physical. I understand the required refractive values and i plan on getting lasik soon because i hate contacts anymore. my vision is not that bad with out contacts so i think i will be able to make 20/20 or close to uncorrected after lasik although i have no idea because i have not see a doctor about it yet. and even if not my contact prescription is 2.5 and 3.0 so i think i could pass corrected.

what i am worried about is that my left eye turns outward a little bit. just slightly. its not very noticeable although it becomes a little worse if i am very tired however i can make it straighten back up if i want to for a few mins. i believe i read you have to be within 6 diopters? i have no idea what it measures at but will get it check next eye check up i have. I dont think i have any depth perception problems which is common i have read with a eye that turns out. if i exceed 6 diopters and pass the depth perception test is a waiver possible?

How does the physical process work exactly? if i get accepted to OCS i then go to MEPS then OCS and then brooks? brooks is the hardest part to pass correct? when do i sign and enlist? is there a way i can get tested at brooks before i go to OCS or enlist? i read online about a guy who at his cost paid to go to brooks and get tested. what are my options with this?

Any info you have would be great. i am worried about working towards this then being told no and having to do something i dont want to do when there is other things i would rather due outside of military.

Thanks for the help

[Guest goducks]

I am going to be getting a B.S in 2 years and i want to apply to OCS for a pilot slot. This is the only way i can know if i can be a pilot with out enlisting first.

I am worried about the vision part of the FC1 physical. I understand the required refractive values and i plan on getting lasik soon because i hate contacts anymore. my vision is not that bad with out contacts so i think i will be able to make 20/20 or close to uncorrected after lasik although i have no idea because i have not see a doctor about it yet. and even if not my contact prescription is 2.5 and 3.0 so i think i could pass corrected.

what i am worried about is that my left eye turns outward a little bit. just slightly. its not very noticeable although it becomes a little worse if i am very tired however i can make it straighten back up if i want to for a few mins. i believe i read you have to be within 6 diopters? i have no idea what it measures at but will get it check next eye check up i have. I dont think i have any depth perception problems which is common i have read with a eye that turns out. if i exceed 6 diopters and pass the depth perception test is a waiver possible?

How does the physical process work exactly? if i get accepted to OCS i then go to MEPS then OCS and then brooks? brooks is the hardest part to pass correct? when do i sign and enlist? is there a way i can get tested at brooks before i go to OCS or enlist? i read online about a guy who at his cost paid to go to brooks and get tested. what are my options with this?

Any info you have would be great. i am worried about working towards this then being told no and having to do something i dont want to do when there is other things i would rather due outside of military.

Thanks for the help

It is possible to get a waiver for a small amount of eye misalignment (strabismus) if you meet certain criteria on depth perception and stereopsis testing. There is a level of misalignment that is not waiverable in any circumstances, although I don't recall what that number is. It's higher than the 6 prism diopters you reference, which is the regulation, not the waiverable limit.

In reference to your question about going to Brooks "on your own"; it basically doesn't happen. There may be very unusual circumstances where you are evaluated outside of the normal FCI/MFS sequence (most frequently this would be brought back for a second eval), however, you must have a sponsor such as your unit, MAJCOM, etc requesting the visit.

I don't have a lot of insight into how the overall process works. Perhaps others who've been through it can offer some suggestions. I also can't tell you in any detail what your chances for PQ are without knowing more details. You can certainly get a civilian exam and ask them to quantify what you are describing as an intermittant exotropia, including an evaluation of suppression and the level of stereopsis that you have. I could try to give you more feedback based on that info. Having said that, the USAF pays a lot more attention to depth perception and stereopsis than most civilian practitioners and they use tests that aren't commonly found outside of the military medical environment.

GD

Edited June 6, 2010 by goducks

[BADFNZ]

What's the process for renewing an expiring waiver for excessive refractive error? I received the waiver back in 2007 so I guess it expires every 3 years? I am an active duty pilot and recently saw the eye doc for the contact lens program and she happened to mention that my waiver will expire soon. So is this a routine renewal or is it a kick in the nuts like the original waiver?

[Guest goducks]

What's the process for renewing an expiring waiver for excessive refractive error? I received the waiver back in 2007 so I guess it expires every 3 years? I am an active duty pilot and recently saw the eye doc for the contact lens program and she happened to mention that my waiver will expire soon. So is this a routine renewal or is it a kick in the nuts like the original waiver?

If it is for excessive myopia or astigmatism, I wouldn't expect it to be anything more than a routine request made by your flight doc. If it was for excessive hyperopia and you continue to meet the necessary depth perception requirements, it should again be routine. The only issue would be in the case that you had excessive hyperopia and degraded depth perception- then you'd likely be required to go to Brooks.

[Guest mkeen17]

I really regret asking what is probably a pretty commonplace question, but as a cadet-to-be, I'm trying to get my ducks in a row ahead of time:

How commonplace are contact lens waivers for pilots?

The AFROTC website lists the minimum vision requirements as 20/30 - 20/70 near/far uncorrected, corrected to 20/20. A vist to the eye doctor last week had me listed at roughly 20/200 in each eye, but are corrected to 20/20 and are otherwise healthy

My Rx, if pertinent:

OD -3.5 -1.5 001

OS -2.75 -1.5 172

Any chance of a waiver as-is or should I go pick up some PRK pamphlets?

Edited July 26, 2010 by mkeen17

[Guest goducks]

I really regret asking what is probably a pretty commonplace question, but as a cadet-to-be, I'm trying to get my ducks in a row ahead of time:

How commonplace are contact lens waivers for pilots?

The AFROTC website lists the minimum vision requirements as 20/30 - 20/70 near/far uncorrected, corrected to 20/20. A vist to the eye doctor last week had me listed at roughly 20/200 in each eye, but are corrected to 20/20 and are otherwise healthy

My Rx, if pertinent:

OD -3.5 -1.5 001

OS -2.75 -1.5 172

Any chance of a waiver as-is or should I go pick up some PRK pamphlets?

You need refractive surgery if you want to fly for the USAF. You exceed the waiverable limit of -3.00 by a long ways. Based on your numbers, you're -5.00 in the right eye and -4.25 in the left eye.

[Guest mkeen17]

You need refractive surgery if you want to fly for the USAF. You exceed the waiverable limit of -3.00 by a long ways. Based on your numbers, you're -5.00 in the right eye and -4.25 in the left eye.

Ah, I didn't realize the numbers got added together, though I feared as much either way. On a related note, when would you suggest would be the best time to get the procedure done? I'm planning on dual-enrolling in ROTC this fall for the freshman/sophomore classes and heading to field training next summer since there was no ROTC program anywhere near the community college I'm transferring from, and I believe there is a mandatory grace period between any refractive surgery and getting my physical done.

If anything, I suppose I could talk to the cadre at my Det when I go there for orientation in about two hours.

Thanks for the reply GoDucks, especially considering the hour. Your input it very much appreciated :)

Edited July 26, 2010 by mkeen17

[Guest goducks]

Ah, I didn't realize the numbers got added together, though I feared as much either way. On a related note, when would you suggest would be the best time to get the procedure done? I'm planning on dual-enrolling in ROTC this fall for the freshman/sophomore classes and heading to field training next summer since there was no ROTC program anywhere near the community college I'm transferring from, and I believe there is a mandatory grace period between any refractive surgery and getting my physical done.

If anything, I suppose I could talk to the cadre at my Det when I go there for orientation in about two hours.

Thanks for the reply GoDucks, especially considering the hour. Your input it very much appreciated :)

No problem. I live in England- it's 0900 here.

You must wait 1 year (not a day less) between having the surgery done and having your FCI/MFS physical. So don't go past that date whatever you do. Also, I wouldn't have refractive surgery if your eyes are still changing on a regular basis. The surgery will not stop future changes and then you might be back to needing glasses or contact lenses. That wouldn't be a big deal as far as pilot qualification goes (you simply need to meet the -3.00 waiverable limit), but most folks would prefer not to wear correction if you're forking out the money for surgery.

Beyond that, it's just a matter of when it's convenient. If you have LASIK, you should be back up and running the next day (minus stuff that might injure the eyes like contact sports, etc). If you have PRK, prepare for a good week of down time.

GD

[Guest illini08]

I was hoping to get some insight from a flight doctor on my situation. I am a 10OT03 pilot select and I recently went down to Scott for my flight physical. The only problem I had was with the refractive error in my eyes. When the doc tested my eyes they were both 20/50 corrected to 20/15 and 20/12 which is within the limits and he told me I would not need a waiver. When I saw the optometrist he measured my eyes with a device and said my refractive error is just over the limits and I might need a waiver. The limits are -1.5 in each eye and mine were -1.75 and -2.00. When I asked the Sgt who was doing my paperwork about it he checked the regulations and said that it should not be a problem because they are only slightly over but they will let me know if there is a problem. Does anyone know anything about this or if my physical will get approved without a waiver? Thanks.

[Guest turboprop8771]

I've been reading this thread, and have come across some very useful information. I'm currently in the application process for a USAFR pilot slot and, like most of us, am concerned about my vision. My last prescription is as follows:

Sphere Cylinder Axis

Right eye: -.25 -1.50 005

Left Eye: plano -2.25 160

I'm not quite sure what my uncorrected acuity is, but I am corrected to 20/20. My concern is that I am outside both the astigmatism and near vision requirements, and was curious as to how likely it would be to obtain a waiver for such a condition.

[Guest goducks]

I was hoping to get some insight from a flight doctor on my situation. I am a 10OT03 pilot select and I recently went down to Scott for my flight physical. The only problem I had was with the refractive error in my eyes. When the doc tested my eyes they were both 20/50 corrected to 20/15 and 20/12 which is within the limits and he told me I would not need a waiver. When I saw the optometrist he measured my eyes with a device and said my refractive error is just over the limits and I might need a waiver. The limits are -1.5 in each eye and mine were -1.75 and -2.00. When I asked the Sgt who was doing my paperwork about it he checked the regulations and said that it should not be a problem because they are only slightly over but they will let me know if there is a problem. Does anyone know anything about this or if my physical will get approved without a waiver? Thanks.

Based on the numbers you are reporting there won't be any issues. You are right at the standard for refractive error (myopia)- if you are at/under the standard, no problem. If you are over, you're still well within the waiverable range and the waiver for excessive myopia is a mere formality as long as you don't exceed the waiverable limit.

I've been reading this thread, and have come across some very useful information. I'm currently in the application process for a USAFR pilot slot and, like most of us, am concerned about my vision. My last prescription is as follows:

Sphere Cylinder Axis

Right eye: -.25 -1.50 005

Left Eye: plano -2.25 160

I'm not quite sure what my uncorrected acuity is, but I am corrected to 20/20. My concern is that I am outside both the astigmatism and near vision requirements, and was curious as to how likely it would be to obtain a waiver for such a condition.

Waivers for myopia are a formality as long as the total power in your Rx is not over -3.00. You are -1.75 in the right eye and -2.25 in the left.

You also exceed the limit of -1.50 on the cylinder portion in the left eye. It is waiverable up to -3.00. The waiver for excessive astigmatism is based on 1. No evidence of a corneal pathology that could be causing the astigmatism (see keratoconus) and 2. Normal vision when corrected with lenses (see amblyopia or meridional amblyopia). It's highly unlikely you'll have an issue, but you will do some extra vision tests at Brooks.

[Guest illini08]

Thank you very much for the help, that is a big relief. So my prescription is:

-1.75, -.25

-2.00, -.25

Do you think I will need a waiver or will it go right through without one.

[Guest goducks]

Thank you very much for the help, that is a big relief. So my prescription is:

-1.75, -.25

-2.00, -.25

Do you think I will need a waiver or will it go right through without one.

It's too close to know until it's measured under the FCI protocol (cycloplegic conditions, minimum lens power needed to get 20/20).

But, it doesn't matter. As far as your refractive error is concerned, you'll be fine- waiver or no waiver. Understand that a waiver is not a black mark against you. If you qualify for a waiver in the case of excessive myopia, it's merely a formality. I've NEVER seen someone denied a waiver for myopia when they met the criteria.

[Guest illini08]

It's too close to know until it's measured under the FCI protocol (cycloplegic conditions, minimum lens power needed to get 20/20).

But, it doesn't matter. As far as your refractive error is concerned, you'll be fine- waiver or no waiver. Understand that a waiver is not a black mark against you. If you qualify for a waiver in the case of excessive myopia, it's merely a formality. I've NEVER seen someone denied a waiver for myopia when they met the criteria.

That was the refractive error the optometrist at Scott gave me after my eyes were dilated. That is great news that I should be okay with or without a waiver, now I just have to sit and wait and see if I need one or not. Thanks a lot goducks, you have been extremely helpful.

[AC-172]

Lots of good information in this thread, so thanks. However much of it, to me, is like reading a foreign language, and thus I'm still a bit confused on where I would stand in terms of being waiverable or not. I just had my routine eye checkup today, and everything was fine, but I did ask for what my prescription was as well as what my 20/whatever was so that I could post them here.

My prescription reads:

SPH. CYL. Axis

-2.25 +1.00 008

-2.50 +1.50 165

Also I asked to do the typical eye chart and came out as 20/100. I guess my eyes might be a bit better than that number because I took the test after my eyes had been dilated, but I don't think I'm better than 20/70.

But I guess my question is, am I within waiverable limits or is surgery in my future?

Thank you in advance.

[Bayou_Eagle_Driver]

Not trying to be rude here, but the waiver guidelines spell out the limits pretty clearly. You would be doing yourself a favor reading up on them and learning how to read your refraction numbers. See page 692 of the June 2010 Air Force Waiver guide

To save GoDucks the typing,...> -1.50 but < -3.00 is the limit. Astigmatism Limits are >1.50 but < 3.00

You are -2.25 and -2.50 so as long as you are correctable to 20/20 or greater, you should be good to go. As for Astigmatism, you are 1.00 and 1.50, both of which are within limits.

Also, you mentioned Dilation, that is your Cycloplegic Refraction, which is all the Air Force cares about, your "Dry" refraction (without your eyes being dilated) means nothing to them.

[AC-172]

Thank you for the help and advice. Reading up in the Air Force Waiver guide now.

[Hot Dogs!]

Does anyone have a list of the extra tests required at Brooks after LASIK? Or is it just what is listed in the waiver guide?

[Bayou_Eagle_Driver]

Does anyone have a list of the extra tests required at Brooks after LASIK? Or is it just what is listed in the waiver guide?

There are a TON of tests the COULD do for RS patients. However, they don't always do them all. Here's what I received:

Color Vision (Grey computer screen, light magenta letters..)

Color vision pallets (Bubbly numbers like we're all used to)

Color vision pallets (Numbers hidden in squares instead of bubbles)

Depth Perception tests

Regular Vision test (Distance/Near) with the regular Snellen Chart

a DIM version of the snellen chart (Low contrast)

FOV test where you stick your head in a big white bubble and they test your field of vision with little lights that blink and you click when you see them...took forever

Then we did some dark-room tests, one was they put me in a booth and you wear some funky glasses, and you look at more low contrast stripes etc...

The last test was also in a dark room, you look in a machine and there's a bright light shining in your eyes and low contrast circles, you say what side the break in the circle is.

Overall, it was just a ton of contrast-sensitivity tests. Like I said, there's a battery of other tests they COULD have used on me, but I guess those are only if you have certain symptoms or fail a previous test.

[Guest BJN16]

I have 20/100 vision in my left eye and 20/50 in my right eye. Do they measure combined vision or do they use the acuity in your worst eye? I've read the AFI and tried to search on the forums for an answer but have found information. Could anyone who has been through their initial FC1 provide some feedback.

[Odium]

I have 20/100 vision in my left eye and 20/50 in my right eye. Do they measure combined vision or do they use the acuity in your worst eye? I've read the AFI and tried to search on the forums for an answer but have found information. Could anyone who has been through their initial FC1 provide some feedback.

I'm not a flight doc so I'm not a final authority on this, but I have differing vision between my eyes and went through the FC1 process so I'll share what I experienced.

There's a great deal more to the evaluation process than just looking at the 20/x measurement of visual acuity. While you have to fall within certain limits, they have latitude to waiver less than 20/20 vision as long as it's easily correctable to 20/20 with glasses. For people with differing vision, they also evaluate how great the difference in diopters between the eyes is. Depth perception is also thoroughly tested, some people with differing vision have difficulty with the tests with significantly different eyes if their brain is subconsciously relying on the better of the eyes.

Don't want to sound too doom and gloom, if you're correctable to 20/20 in both eyes without any other issues you stand a good chance. I personally had around 20/100 vision in my "bad" eye and was able to get a waiver for it without any major issues.