Vision waiver info

[Fuzz]

I Just recently got off the phone with the APM in Wright-Patterson regarding the 12-month post-refractive surgery vision requirement for any refractive surgery proceeding for an initial FC1 medical. The air force's stance on this requirement is "EXTREMELY" strict on the12 months. She told me the chances of me getting an age waiver is higher than getting the 12-month post CRS requirement waived (wavied as in able to apply for the FC1 before the 12-months is met) for an initial FC1.

Now, that being said doesn't mean you can't try to get a waiver from the MAJCOM/SG but don't count it. For any of you prk/lasik hopefuls want to get that FC1, good luck.

Yeah I was selected to go to the USAFA summer jump program, and I kid you not, I would have showed to the school at 364 days post-op, and they wouldn't send me because I couldn't get the required flight physical until 1 year after the surgery. I told my surgeon and he laughed saying my eyes were completely healed by 3 months.

[Guest]

As the Air Force continues to cut manpower, they're going to be as selective as they want. Making standards harder doesn't matter if you have the ability to be selective.

Sent from my rooted Atrix using Tapatalk 2.

[the g-man]

Hi,

I am a recent ROTC grad with a pilot slot. Went to Wright-Patt back in November left not cleared, but not denied medically because it was at the consensus of the ophthalmology team there that I had some kind of infection causing my prescription to be different every morning when they brought me in.

I was advised to see a civilian ophthalmologist and have them forward records to MFS. Did so in January. Somehow MFS never got them until I was notified that I could not get orders until FCI was done... wtf? Anyways, they got my paperwork in early June and almost immediately advised my ROTC cadre that they wanted me to see a specialist at Fort Bragg (I live in Charlotte, NC). Did so on 15 June. Went there and the Army docs at Bragg knew nothing of why I was there so I tried to explain my situation as best possible and they just gave me a full overview. Doc said that the only real issue with my eyes is excessive astigmatism. He said that I will likely be DQ'ed because in my right eye the Cyl Power is -2.00 and limit is -1.00.

Well, I looked at the AF waiver guides and my interpretation of them is different based on the table saying that >1.50 and <3.00 is waiverable by AETC.

It seems my cadre are not working today... grr.

Anyways, right now my prescription sits at this:

OD Sphere= pl Cyl= -2.00 Axis= 010

OS Sphere= -.50 Cyl= -1.25 Axis = 180

Am I going to get this vision waiver? Or will it be downgraded, and I get a new AFSC, likely WSO/CSO training?

I guess ROTC/AETC/AFPC is in a tight spot because I commissioned 11 May, and my EAD is supposed to be 27 Jun to NAS Whiting, with IFS date of 19 Jul. haha, lets see what happens.

[Guest]

You don't meet the 48-123 standards (para. 6.44.7.) but you do have waiver potential in the latest waiver guide version (5 Jun). I imagine you will likely get your waiver, but it will certainly take at least another 30 days before it is finalized. Hope you can get to Whiting Field. That's a great in-between for Pensacola and Hurlburt/Eglin if you like the beaches at Destin and want to party in P-Cola, and you can hop across the border to Flomaton for fireworks. Milton is a sizeable enough city. I wouldn't live in Pensacola, Navarre / Holly-by-the-Sea, or even Gulf Breeze; the drive is probably just a little too far. I would stick to Milton or Pace.

[the g-man]

Awesome. To Vance it is then!

They have been reassigning people from Whiting to Vance whenever a hiccup occurs.

[Fuzz]

Posting this for a buddy, trying to see if I can get any help from the Docs or others that may have gone through this:

He went to Wright-Pat for his FC1, passed all the tests except for the new color vision test on the computer monitor. He said he didn't understand how the test worked, and I guess, "saw" letters when there weren't any because he didn't know there were blank screens or something. So he is diagnosed as color blind and DQ'd. He wouldn't accept it and made an appointment at Langley to have the test done again. He went to Langley, had the test and this time passed, and appealed the original finding. The AF is saying that it doesn't count, wasn't the same test, and he is still DQ'd.

Does anyone have any experience with this willing to give some advice?

[Kenny Powers]

I have not done my FC1 yet, but I have taken the "new" color vision test twice; once with my current unit and once very recently during my commissioning physical with the unit I got hired with. Both times, the test was identical in format (not sure if they randomly generate letters each go around or if they are the same), but it was on the same little tablet looking computer and everything.

Both times I did mine, every screen had a letter. My new unit had said that a lot of people who were previously passing with the old books and flip cards are not passing with the new version. I personally think the new version is easier. One thing though, you are timed. I think you have 3 seconds to identify the letter and click the corresponding box. Not sure how that correlates to your score though. Also, I am pretty sure the doc said you only need 70% to pass.

Edited June 25, 2012 by Kenny Powers

[Fuzz]

Yeah, it has been almost two years since I had to take the test on the computer (actually last time was at Brooks, but that was like herding cattle, I just went wherever they told me to go and did whatever I was instructed, I tried to forget most of my time there, especially the extra day of tests because I had Lasic). I'm not sure exactly what the deal was with him passing, he said he didn't understand the test (I'm not making excuses for him, one way or the other). Regardless of it he passed it a second time, but the AF is being difficult about accepting the new results as part of his waiver process. Also the dude isn't completely color blind, just "partially" green deficient.

Edit: spelling

Edited June 25, 2012 by Scaredfuzz21

[zoylxide]

I'm 22, going to be a college junior starting Fall 2013. I've worn contacts since high school, with my current prescription being -1.75 left and -1.25 right.

From what I've read online (every site I see disagrees with the previous site), 20/70 is either -1.0 or -1.25 or even -2.0.

My real question is, if I want to be a pilot, should I consider getting LASIK/PRK on my own? Or would it still be possible to get accepted to a pilot slot with my vision as-is? How does that work, if you get a waiver for vision? They perform the LASIK on you and then you still have to wait a year (doing what in that time period?)?

[Royal]

I'm 22, going to be a college junior starting Fall 2013. I've worn contacts since high school, with my current prescription being -1.75 left and -1.25 right.

From what I've read online (every site I see disagrees with the previous site), 20/70 is either -1.0 or -1.25 or even -2.0.

My real question is, if I want to be a pilot, should I consider getting LASIK/PRK on my own? Or would it still be possible to get accepted to a pilot slot with my vision as-is? How does that work, if you get a waiver for vision? They perform the LASIK on you and then you still have to wait a year (doing what in that time period?)?

Did you already scour all the pages of this thread? I think a few dudes on here ran into a similar issue.

[zoylxide]

Did you already scour all the pages of this thread? I think a few dudes on here ran into a similar issue.

I have now, and I'm still not fully clear.

If I opt to NOT get LASIK/PRK on my own, I do believe I am within the -3.00 waiverable limit. What are your options then? I saw about the soft-contact program, but I'd rather not have to wear contacts in the future if possible. If they (the AF) does LASIK/PRK on you, is the wait still one year from surgery date to attend pilot training? OCS isn't a year long, what happens between your surgery and pilot training (I assume the wait isnt a year long between those, or anywhere near that)?

What happens if you make it through OCS, and then get denied for vision for your pilot slot, are you done w/ the USAF if you want? Or are you under commitment at that point and re-classed?

Edited September 17, 2012 by zoylxide

[Sketch]

What happens if you make it through OCS, and then get denied for vision for your pilot slot, are you done w/ the USAF if you want? Or are you under commitment at that point and re-classed?

I'm no expert on vision reqs but once you take the oath and enter active duty you have to serve out your commitment. If you get denied a slot because of vision you still have to serve in another career field, rated or not, until your commitment is up.

[Royal]

What happens if you make it through OCS, and then get denied for vision for your pilot slot, are you done w/ the USAF if you want? Or are you under commitment at that point and re-classed?

So, you're not in ROTC, and you're planning on trying to get a slot to OTS? You'll take a Flying Class I physical at Wright-Pat AFB in Ohio before you go to OTS; there you'll find out whether or not you're medically qualified by AF standards to be a pilot. You won't go through OTS just to find out you're medically disqualified after you get commissioned. Unless, of course, you break your neck during the 3.5 hours of hardcore, hand-to-hand combatives training you receive.

I can't speak to the Lasik issue.

[Kenny Powers]

I have now, and I'm still not fully clear.

If I opt to NOT get LASIK/PRK on my own, I do believe I am within the -3.00 waiverable limit. What are your options then? I saw about the soft-contact program, but I'd rather not have to wear contacts in the future if possible. If they (the AF) does LASIK/PRK on you, is the wait still one year from surgery date to attend pilot training? OCS isn't a year long, what happens between your surgery and pilot training (I assume the wait isnt a year long between those, or anywhere near that)?

What happens if you make it through OCS, and then get denied for vision for your pilot slot, are you done w/ the USAF if you want? Or are you under commitment at that point and re-classed?

If you do want LASIK/PRK, I would just go ahead and get it done. Make sure you meet the pre-op requirements first! Your eyesight is only going to get worse, so now is the ideal time to do it. My LASIK waiver from FC-1 to approval was less than 30 days. If you find a good doc, don't cheap out and make sure you follow the post-op care, there is very little risk involved.

Just to add some info to the thread: Back when I did my FC-1, the optometrist at WPAFB was putting together a study regarding LASIK vs. PRK. Though the study was not complete, he thought people who were highly myopic (>5.00) did better with PRK and that people with less myopia (<5.00) did better with LASIK. Something to discuss with your doc before you get it.

Edited September 18, 2012 by Kenny Powers

[zoylxide]

If you do want LASIK/PRK, I would just go ahead and get it done. Make sure you meet the pre-op requirements first! Your eyesight is only going to get worse, so now is the ideal time to do it. My LASIK waiver from FC-1 to approval was less than 30 days. If you find a good doc, don't cheap out and make sure you follow the post-op care, there is very little risk involved.

Just to add some info to the thread: Back when I did my FC-1, the optometrist at WPAFB was putting together a study regarding LASIK vs. PRK. Though the study was not complete, he thought people who were highly myopic (>5.00) did better with PRK and that people with less myopia (<5.00) did better with LASIK. Something to discuss with your doc before you get it.

I'm just more concerned with spending 2-5k+ when I live at home and only make ~8k a year working part time (while full-time in school). So if it's not entirely necessary to get it before I apply for OCS/OTS, I'd rather not pay for it.

Edited September 18, 2012 by zoylxide

[ThreeHoler]

Most surgeons won't perform LASIK until you're 25, as your eyes are still changing.

[Fuzz]

Most surgeons won't perform LASIK until you're 25, as your eyes are still changing.

Really? that's funny because I have more friends than I can count on two hands (myself included) who got Lasic/PRK at 19-21 years old. Most Surgeons require your vision to be stable for 1-2 years at that age before they will operate.

Edit: typing on iPad

Edited September 18, 2012 by Scaredfuzz21

[spaceman]

Just to add some info to the thread: Back when I did my FC-1, the optometrist at WPAFB was putting together a study regarding LASIK vs. PRK. Though the study was not complete, he thought people who were highly myopic (>5.00) did better with PRK and that people with less myopia (<5.00) did better with LASIK. Something to discuss with your doc before you get it.

That's weird; the doctor who did my LASIK surgery told me the exact opposite.

Really? that's funny because I have more friends than I can count on two hands (myself included) who got Lasic/PRK at 19-21 years old. Most Surgeons require your vision to be stable for 1-2 years at that age before they will operate. Edit: typing on iPad

This. Age doesn't matter but make sure your eyes are stable and done getting worse. If you get LASIK now and your eyes are still changing you are wasting your money because you'll just need glasses/contacts again in a couple years, as it won't suddenly make your eyes stop changing.

Also, if you already need LASIK to pass a flight physical, the AF is not going to hire you for OTS and then give you free LASIK. You have to qualify for your FC1/1A/whatever before they send you anywhere.

If you can squeak by now without it, you might be able to finagle LASIK out of them in the future, but it would be much later like after UPT at least. I'm not 100% sure on that part though.

[Guest]

Figure out everything yourself.

See the Aircrew Waiver, Medical Standards, and MFS/FCI links in my signature

Read AFI 48-123, para. 6.44.7. on page 82 in particular.

For Mil only with a CAC, check the following links too: https://kx.afms.mil/...rea=MFS_USAFSAM | https://kx.afms.mil/...rea=MFS_USAFSAM | https://kx.afms.mil/...rea=MFS_USAFSAM

Edited September 18, 2012 by deaddebate

[Kenny Powers]

That's weird; the doctor who did my LASIK surgery told me the exact opposite.

Weird that a guy who makes his money doing LASIK sold you on doing LASIK? I am sure there are different opinions on it but the doc at WPAFB said the majority of guys doing these procedures are starting to realize similar results. Of course, there are outliers on either end of the spectrum that show otherwise.

I was fairly myopic so when he first mentioned that I thought "Shit, maybe I should have got PRK!" but then he explained what the boundaries were and I realized I accidentally made the right choice.

Edited September 18, 2012 by Kenny Powers

[spaceman]

Weird that a guy who makes his money doing LASIK sold you on doing LASIK? I am sure there are different opinions on it but the doc at WPAFB said the majority of guys doing these procedures are starting to realize similar results. Of course, there are outliers on either end of the spectrum that show otherwise.

I was fairly myopic so when he first mentioned that I thought "Shit, maybe I should have got PRK!" but then he explained what the boundaries were and I realized I accidentally made the right choice.

Well he did both procedures so I don't think that was a factor. For the record my refractive error was something like -4.50 so I was pretty nearsighted. The doc said that for "less nearsighted" people he usually recommended PRK, and that -4.00 was pretty much the middle ground where you could go either way. I'm pretty sure you can have good results either way though. In my case I'm glad I got LASIK because the recovery was very easy and the results were perfect!

[Kenny Powers]

In my case I'm glad I got LASIK because the recovery was very easy and the results were perfect!

Yep, the recovery was the big deciding factor for me (and the lower risk of side effects like hazing).

For anyone considering it, the doc at WPAFB looked at my eyes and then said "you are going to be one of our easy waivers". He pointed out that the main determinant in how well someones LASIK results turn out is the post-op care (assuming you go to a legit surgeon). Told me some horror stories of some eyes he had seen from people who did a "buy one get one free" deal that did NOT include proper post op care. One such story consisted of somebody having an infection that was eating away at their cornea or something like that.

[AC-172]

What are the chances of getting two waivers, one for refractive error and one for near vision, on an FCI?

MEPS had my near vision at 20/40 uncorrected. And if I end up testing out at 20/40 again on the FCI, do I have any hope of getting a waiver for that on top of my refractive error waiver that I already know I need? Or should I just hope and pray that I have a good day and I am able to read the 20/30 line?

Thanks

[HeyWatchThis]

So, you're not in ROTC, and you're planning on trying to get a slot to OTS? You'll take a Flying Class I physical at Wright-Pat AFB in Ohio before you go to OTS; there you'll find out whether or not you're medically qualified by AF standards to be a pilot. You won't go through OTS just to find out you're medically disqualified after you get commissioned. Unless, of course, you break your neck during the 3.5 hours of hardcore, hand-to-hand combatives training you receive.

I can't speak to the Lasik issue.

Unless its changed (and I was at MFS Feb 2012), every single person in my MFS group was from OTS and they had NOT had MFS prior to OTS. They go thru OTS then send you to Wright-Patt. It makes sense (somewhat) from the AF's perspective...if they send you prior to OTS, then you can simply leave (assuming you hadn't sworn in) however if they send you post OTS and you have incurred a commitment, THEY get the choice as to whether or not your cross train or leave.

Edited September 21, 2012 by MattS

[Guest]

What are the chances of getting two waivers, one for refractive error and one for near vision, on an FCI?

MEPS had my near vision at 20/40 uncorrected.

It'd be the same waiver application, possibly with 2 diagnoses, but I would anticipate it would be rolled into one. Look at the links in my sig for the Aircrew Waiver guide; it doesn't break up near vision from the other standards. It's all one category.