How do you feel about your airframe and mission?

[brabus]

Good points, but still consider the difference in Es based on community just as it similarly applies to Os based on community.  I know and work with several Es who have no issue saying "fuck you sir, you're wrong," debrief just as well as a fighter pilot, have the exact same viewpoints/actions regarding stupid rules, etc.  Now will those type of dudes end up being the Es flying RPAs, who knows...but they do exist.

That said, I have seeing nothing but horrible performance from E RPA operators, but it's also the Army and a completely different program.  So, my hopeful assumption is the AF program would set up Es for far better success than the Army currently does.

EDIT: By E RPA operators I mean from the pilot/mission commander perspective, not specifically from the sensor operator perspective (though the Army SOs are still pretty bad).

Edited August 22, 2016 by brabus

[scoobs]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-switch/wp/2015/05/15/the-armys-drone-pilots-dont-get-enough-training-because-theyre-too-busy-mowing-the-lawn/

This may be why?

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk

[Breckey]

7 hours ago, matmacwc said:

 The genius of American airpower rests in the bro's in the squadron debriefing each other to the Nth degree on their screw ups and how to improve.  It also relies on the fact a Captain can tell a LtCol to F off if he is wrong, I've done it and seen it.  Adding E's to the mix complicates this dynamic and may bring USAF airpower to a point where we have a bunch of "yes sir" drones flying planes.  

I've had plenty of enlisted flight engineers and gunners in helicopters tell me that I'm a fucking idiot and get debriefed just as well as some instructors. It takes a little while to get there just like the officers but a crusty EF or EG will not just be a "yes sir" type of aircrew member. We don't crash in compartments and they're my only defense when things get dicey and hadji starts shooting, so I trust and take their inputs as much as a pilot.

[pcola]

I've had plenty of enlisted flight engineers and gunners in helicopters tell me that I'm a ing idiot and get debriefed just as well as some instructors. It takes a little while to get there just like the officers but a crusty EF or EG will not just be a "yes sir" type of aircrew member. We don't crash in compartments and they're my only defense when things get dicey and hadji starts shooting, so I trust and take their inputs as much as a pilot.

This. I'd say the same thing about the vast majority of C-5 FEs I've flown with. More similarities with pilots than with the regulation-blinders, yes sir, shoe-clerk Es. Hopefully they'll source appropriately and lean on these crusty enlisted aviators when building the training program. IMO, they should start with MSgt FEs as initial cadre. Not sure if the current SOs would be equally equipped to mitigate the pitfalls that concern matmac.

[Breckey]

One of the initial selectees was a HH-60 IF from the schoolhouse at Kirtland.

[napir]

6 hours ago, pcola said:

Hopefully they'll source appropriately and lean on these crusty enlisted aviators when building the training program.

FWIW, the initial group is being drawn from experienced enlisted aircrew, nobody else was allowed to apply.

[WayUp]

2 hours ago, napir said:

FWIW, the initial group is being drawn from experienced enlisted aircrew, nobody else was allowed to apply.

There is this, however, the community itself is still too young to even have a solid foundation. The current guys there are still trying to solidify where the RQ-4 fits in the big picture. At Red Flag, we show up with all our cool toys but get put in the corner because no one knows what cool toys we have or they just don't care and want to head out and blow shit up. Add this red hair to the stepchild portion of being the only enlisted pilots and we have a full blown red headed step child being married into the family right now.

[pcola]

On August 21, 2016 at 6:02 PM, iowa said:

you don't fly anything, you are a mission manager.

And to answer a standard follow on question, the -4 doesn't have sensor parity with the U2 yet but when it does it will clearly surpass the U2 in capability 

When do you expect this "sensor parity" to occur?  And please explain why it will "clearly surpass the U2 in capability," especially after you just said you're a "mission manager" who doesn't fly anything.  Who is flying it, and what do they do when the mission requires a little old-fashioned pilotage?  If you think that is a pointless question, then I'd venture to say that you really have very little knowledge of the U2's capability as compared to the Global Chicken's.  

[magnetfreezer]

58 minutes ago, WayUp said:

There is this, however, the community itself is still too young to even have a solid foundation. The current guys there are still trying to solidify where the RQ-4 fits in the big picture. At Red Flag, we show up with all our cool toys but get put in the corner because no one knows what cool toys we have or they just don't care and want to head out and blow shit up. Add this red hair to the stepchild portion of being the only enlisted pilots and we have a full blown red headed step child being married into the family right now.

The RF issue is partly the dichotomy between intel collection and tactical employment - the processes/timelines for one don't always match with those for the other. Reach out to your intel patches for more integration.

[i.o.w.a]

8 minutes ago, pcola said:

When do you expect this "sensor parity" to occur?  And please explain why it will "clearly surpass the U2 in capability," especially after you just said you're a "mission manager" who doesn't fly anything.  Who is flying it, and what do they do when the mission requires a little old-fashioned pilotage?  If you think that is a pointless question, then I'd venture to say that you really have very little knowledge of the U2's capability as compared to the Global Chicken's.  

 

3 minutes ago, magnetfreezer said:

The RF issue is partly the dichotomy between intel collection and tactical employment - the processes/timelines for one don't always match with those for the other. Reach out to your intel patches for more integration.

All great discussions not related to this thread. I will start a new thread and maybe a moderator can do some of their magic and parse out all the GH discussion into the new thread.  (A moment please while I check the search function for an existing thread)

[Azimuth]

10 hours ago, pcola said:

This. I'd say the same thing about the vast majority of C-5 FEs I've flown with. More similarities with pilots than with the regulation-blinders, yes sir, shoe-clerk Es. Hopefully they'll source appropriately and lean on these crusty enlisted aviators when building the training program. IMO, they should start with MSgt FEs as initial cadre. Not sure if the current SOs would be equally equipped to mitigate the pitfalls that concern matmac.

They should already be using FE's...to make sure the pilots run their checklists!

[Sprkt69]

23 hours ago, Breckey said:

I've had plenty of enlisted flight engineers and gunners in helicopters tell me that I'm a ing idiot and get debriefed just as well as some instructors. It takes a little while to get there just like the officers but a crusty EF or EG will not just be a "yes sir" type of aircrew member. We don't crash in compartments and they're my only defense when things get dicey and hadji starts shooting, so I trust and take their inputs as much as a pilot.

And you also know a lot of E crew go all E Mafia on you without the ability to take any criticism like a good aviator should, ala Kirtland. It may not be a bad thing, it's just a different cultural upbringing.

[innovator]

Questions for drivers at Davis Monthan AFB:

The 55th ECG houses the EC-130H. Are there are any other C-130 variants based out of that base?

[trons513]

On 7/22/2016 at 6:28 PM, UDEL09 said:

EC-130H Compass Call

Occasionally we will see RC-135’s but this usually comes with the caveat of a remote to Korea or Wg Exec time.  The remainder of our follow-ons are RPA’s with a spattering of green-door/U-2 exceptions.

Green-door? Can anyone explain what those are?

[magnetfreezer]

32 minutes ago, 172 wannabe said:

Green-door? Can anyone explain what those are?

Doors that absorb light primarily in the center of the visible spectrum.

[WTFAF]

Green-door? Can anyone explain what those are?

https://greendoorlasvegas.com

[stract]

14 hours ago, innovator said:

Questions for drivers at Davis Monthan AFB:

The 55th ECG houses the EC-130H. Are there are any other C-130 variants based out of that base?

Yes, the 563 RQG has HC-130Js at DM.

[Learjetter]

Green-door? Can anyone explain what those are?

If you're selected for green door, you'll learn all you need to. You cannot apply, you get nominated without your knowledge, and if you're not selected to interview, you'll never know. No other info is appropriate for the forum.

If your curiosity still needs quenching, go watch "Air America," read The Ravens, and look up Steve Canyon or Raynor Sarnac.

[ATIS]

Meeting Steve Canyon.....Go read it if you haven't.

You won't be upset you did.

ATIS

[euro2005]

AC-130W

1.  Ops Tempo/Deployment - We just rotate crews in and out year round for a few months at a time. Expect to go once a year, some folks go twice. It's not too long and some folks even say it's too short because once you are fully used to everything and settled in, it's time to start outprocessing to go home.

      2.  Lifestyle/ Family Stability - As for TDYs, it was slow going this summer but that was only because of the addition of the 105. Half the airplanes are fully functional (with the 105) and the rest are either being upgraded or will be soon enough. The entire squadron has to get qualified with it too. Some crew positions go much faster than others. The nav/CSO types take the longest because they have to accomplish a checkride in addition to their training sorties. The TDYs are just now starting to come back though. It's normal for us to be gone all the time on TDYs and in 2017, I expect it'll be back in full force. As for family stability, if you get the W don't expect to move anywhere anytime soon for at least 5-7 years. That's normal around here. I've seen this strengthen marriages and destroy marriages though.  

      3. Community morale - this is Clovis so... You probably won't find me in town on the weekends. You'll probably find me hiking on a mountain a few hours away or at an event of some sort in a big city. Because there's not much to do in Clovis itself, we definitely do have really strong friendships and it forces us to check out some really awesome places. Driving 3-4 hours one way sucks but oh well, we have to work with what we have and many of these places are worth it.

      4. Advancements & Future of the airframe - The W was initially a stop gap and then the J has been taking much longer than anticipated. We all expect to fly the J eventually (if we stick around long enough). Many of our guys have already PCS'd to the J squadron. Until the J is fully operational, I expect the W will be here at least until then. When will that be? I don't know. 2020 maybe? In the mean time, this aircraft is a testbed for all sorts of crazy things. One FTU instructor was telling me that back when it was still an MC-130W, for a little bit they would air drop troops and then provide CAS for those same troops. That honestly blew my mind. The W constantly evolves which I think is pretty cool. It never gets boring.

      5. Preferred PCS locations - Hurlburt to fly the J? I don't think I've ever seen any of our guys go to the U. They only come from the U. Maybe I'm wrong on that but from what I've seen, they all have gone to the J (or the 14th Weapons Squadron also at Hurlburt). If you've been in long enough, expect a staff gig in AFSOC or SOCOM instead. Some of the guys in the staff gigs do come back to Cannon to fly every now and then though.

[Techsan]

Staff Officer, Pentagon

1.  Ops Tempo/Deployment

M-F, 0730-1630.  Deployments aren’t too common…mainly because they are good deal to Staff Officers as they get them out of the building for months at a time.

 2.  Lifestyle/ Family Stability

Stable.  You can expect to be home every night, as well as most weekends.  That is unless you work in the Engine Room or Joint Staff, then you can expect to work 0630-1930 M-F, and sometimes on weekends.  You’ll find yourself making unnecessary dental appointments just to get out of the office

 3. Community morale

 You work behind a desk in a small cubicle, far removed from anything with wings or rotors.

 4. Advancements & Future of the airframe

You’re well on your way to your next rank, especially if you’ve mastered TMT.  The future of the Staff Officer is bright…they’ll always needs someone to write pointless bullet background papers, and recycle power point briefings.

5. Preferred PCS locations

       N/A

        

[ATIS]

1 hour ago, Techsan said:

Staff Officer, Pentagon

1.  Ops Tempo/Deployment

M-F, 0730-1630.  Deployments aren’t too common…mainly because they are good deal to Staff Officers as they get them out of the building for months at a time.

 2.  Lifestyle/ Family Stability

Stable.  You can expect to be home every night, as well as most weekends.  That is unless you work in the Engine Room or Joint Staff, then you can expect to work 0630-1930 M-F, and sometimes on weekends.  You’ll find yourself making unnecessary dental appointments just to get out of the office

 3. Community morale

 You work behind a desk in a small cubicle, far removed from anything with wings or rotors.

 4. Advancements & Future of the airframe

You’re well on your way to your next rank, especially if you’ve mastered TMT.  The future of the Staff Officer is bright…they’ll always needs someone to write pointless bullet background papers, and recycle power point briefings.

5. Preferred PCS locations

       N/A

        

I see so many of you as I walk down to the watch floor for my reserve duty. 

It's like watching people turn into zombies....but just super slowly.

ATIS

[innovator]

1 hour ago, Techsan said:

Staff Officer, Pentagon

1.  Ops Tempo/Deployment

M-F, 0730-1630.  Deployments aren’t too common…mainly because they are good deal to Staff Officers as they get them out of the building for months at a time.

 2.  Lifestyle/ Family Stability

Stable.  You can expect to be home every night, as well as most weekends.  That is unless you work in the Engine Room or Joint Staff, then you can expect to work 0630-1930 M-F, and sometimes on weekends.  You’ll find yourself making unnecessary dental appointments just to get out of the office

 3. Community morale

 You work behind a desk in a small cubicle, far removed from anything with wings or rotors.

 4. Advancements & Future of the airframe

You’re well on your way to your next rank, especially if you’ve mastered TMT.  The future of the Staff Officer is bright…they’ll always needs someone to write pointless bullet background papers, and recycle power point briefings.

5. Preferred PCS locations

       N/A

        

Techsan,

Is the above info common for all staff assignment locations? What are some of the more preferred locations or type of staff billets where dental appointments are not necessary haha ?

How long are typical staff assignments?

Thanks for your feedback!

[Thor]

Anyone have any info on the B-2, F-22, A-10?

[11F]

1.  Ops Tempo/Deployment
      2.  Lifestyle/ Family Stability
      3. Community morale
      4. Advancements & Future of the airframe
      5. Preferred PCS locations 
--------------
 

F-22

1. Expect to deploy either to the desert or to the Pacific for 6 months at a time once every 1.5-2 years (home for 1-1.5 years between deployments). While in garrison, expect 2 x RED FLAG-Nellis/Alaska that take one month away from home each. Also expect 1 x COMBAT ARCHER trip and 1 x COMBAT HAMMER trip in there for 2-3 weeks each. In between all of that, expect 4 or so night surges for 4-6 weeks that will throw home life off, a few one-week CONUS simulator trips, and upgrade surges when none of that other stuff is going on. The community is minimally manned due to poor TFI mix calculations, causing the various shops (training, stab/eval, UDM, etc.) to be one man deep. You're busy.

2. Family stability is all about expectation management (this is true of every military family): if your family expects you to be home for dinner most nights, they have bad expectations and will be frustrated. If they expect you to work 14 hours a day and a couple hours on Saturday or Sunday, they will be pleasantly surprised about 2-3 times a week.

3. Community morale depends on the year group: all of the young guys absolutely LOVE life! It's the most dominant fighter jet in the world and you're getting to fly it every day. Throw on top of that, just about every bro in the community was top notch to get in, so they are awesome selfless individuals who will stay several hours late multiple nights in a row if needed to help a bro out.

The oldest guys are usually the SQ/CC or SQ/DO; every now and then there is a Lt Col ADO who stuck around. They all love to be there because they chose to stay plus all of the stuff mentioned about the young guys applies to these guys (even leadership will stay to help out). I would be willing to bet that some of the best leaders in the USAF are in the F-22 SQ/CC seats. I've never once had even an average one.

The guys who've been in the USAF for 6-10 years are a mixed bag. They've always been the best at everything they've ever done...until they got into the F-22. The ones who go to WIC, typically love life until after their first WO job when they get burnt out and punch to the Guard/Reserve (VERY few stay longer). Those on leadership tracks still love life. The ones who didn't get either are often cynical and looking to get out ASAP.

4. It's the Raptor. It'll continue to get upgraded and be the USAF's top A/A fighter.

5. There isn't a single bad location: Anchorage, AK; Yorktown, VA; Honolulu, HI; Panama City Beach, FL; and Las Vegas, NV.

Expect to go Ops-to-Ops indefinitely unless you go to IDE. That's about the only way you reach escape velocity from the community, but you'll go right back after school/staff. Very very few go on 365s, and none are getting picked up for 180s anymore now that Schwartz' ridiculous "all-in" mentality has been purged (I digress).

I have absolutely loved my time in the Raptor.