New RPA bases, any updates?

[MooseAg03]

Except 2:1 dwell only creates a large surge capacity that I'm sure will be taken advantage of at some point. When there are new GCS's being built, you don't think they'll actually stop using the old ones do you? They will expand the combat lines to 90 like they've been talking about and there will be no dwell.


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[Clark Griswold]

15 minutes ago, MooseAg03 said:

They will expand the combat lines to 90 like they've been talking about and there will be no dwell.

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Good Lord... 90 CAPs?

https://www.airforcetimes.com/story/military/2016/03/07/rpa-flights-increase-70-day-training-and-bases-grow-too-welsh-says/81454190/

After reading that I was reminded of a quote from "Under Siege" - cheesy movie yes but appropriate:

"...we're puppets in the same sick game. We serve the same master, and he's a lunatic and he's ungrateful. But there's nothing we can do about it."

[Clark Griswold]

https://www.airforcetimes.com/articles/air-force-selects-finalists-for-new-rpa-base

From the article:

The service has been looking to expand operations of the MQ-9 Reaper outside of the current base, Creech Air Force Base in Nevada.

The first four finalists are: Eglin AFB, Florida; Tyndall AFB, Florida; Vandenberg AFB, California; and Shaw AFB, South Carolina

If selected, one of those bases would hold a full Reaper wing, with launch, recovery, mission control, maintenance, and operations support elements, with an expected fleet of 24 MQ-9s.

The Air Force is also looking at five bases to host mission control operations, though no RPAs would physically be located on the base.

Those finalists are: Davis-Monthan AFB, Arizona; Moody AFB, Georgia; Mountain Home AFB, Idaho; Offutt AFB, Nebraska; and Shaw AFB, South Carolina.

 

[Herk Driver]

They will expand the combat lines to 90 like they've been talking about and there will be no dwell.


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How many CAPs do they currently fly?


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[Clark Griswold]

How many CAPs do they currently fly?

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60

https://www.af.mil/News/ArticleDisplay/tabid/223/Article/589196/air-force-moves-to-bring-about-rpa-mission-relief.aspx

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[Herk Driver]

60

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That's only the AF number, right? Because the 90 number has been thrown around for a while but not for the AF. That is an enterprise wide number that includes much more than AF only.

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[Clark Griswold]

1 hour ago, Herk Driver said:

That's only the AF number, right? Because the 90 number has been thrown around for a while but not for the AF. That is an enterprise wide number that includes much more than AF only.

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You are correct sir.  

The article I referenced with the 60 was the step down from 65 the SECDEF ordered to get the FIRE light in the T-handle to go out.  

Found another article with the former CSAF quoted on the subject:

That will include a decision by the Pentagon to increase department-wide caps to 90 per day. Defense contractors would fly 10 caps a day using government-owned RPAs and would focus only on intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance missions.

The rest of the flights would be provided by the Army, though Welsh said he did not know the timetable for that service’s increase.

https://www.airforcetimes.com/story/military/2016/03/07/rpa-flights-increase-70-day-training-and-bases-grow-too-welsh-says/81454190/

 So the AF has 60, Contractors 10 leaving USA with picking up the other 20 or are the USN & USMC getting into the Tier II (USAF definition) RPA business also for CAPs in OIR or wherever? 

[Herk Driver]

The Army was on the hook for 20 but not sure whether they have hit that many or not but the rest is fairly accurate from what I remember.


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[MooseAg03]

I knew that number included contract lines, but I didn't read close enough to see the Army was taking so many. Are they finally going to MCE ops?

If they stick to the dwell plan, I think it will make a huge difference in QOL and retention. I just hope they don't pick the wrong bases (Davis-Monthan).


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[Clark Griswold]

1 hour ago, Herk Driver said:

The Army was on the hook for 20 but not sure whether they have hit that many or not but the rest is fairly accurate from what I remember.

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Copy that.

The Navy may get into the mix soon with the TERN concept UAV.

https://www.darpa.mil/news-events/2015-12-28

https://aviationweek.com/blog/darpas-new-tern-predator-frigate

1 hour ago, MooseAg03 said:

I knew that number included contract lines, but I didn't read close enough to see the Army was taking so many. Are they finally going to MCE ops?

If they stick to the dwell plan, I think it will make a huge difference in QOL and retention. I just hope they don't pick the wrong bases (Davis-Monthan).

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Googled it and found the US Army Roadmap 2010-2035 - no mention of MCE operations and trying a few other terms related to that (BLOS, split operations, etc...) turned up nada.

Scanning it, I think they envision this forward deployed mostly, as an organic part of whatever size force it is supporting or really a part of.

https://www.rucker.army.mil/usaace/uas/US Army UAS RoadMap 2010 2035.pdf

[tunes]

would love for a RPA unit to open up at CSprings

[WTFAF]

would love for a RPA unit to open up at CSprings

Are you serious? While I agree the AF should diversify UAV operating locations I can't imagine "loving" their addition anywhere.

[tunes]

23 hours ago, WTFAF said:

 

Are you serious? While I agree the AF should diversify UAV operating locations I can't imagine "loving" their addition anywhere.

 

speaking from a Guard/Reserve standpoint

[Clark Griswold]

Yup - would be an easy unit to support.  Close to an airline hub, high density of military facilities for mutual support and desirable location - all things the AF would not compute.

Consider it strategically, how do I get people to volunteer / not feel too bitter about driving a droid?  

Desirable locations, distribution across time zones, reasonable GA flying program for professional aviator development, base of choice or MDS crossflow for volunteers for 4 year assignments.  This is not that hard AF.

[Jaded]

Isn't there some game that guard/reserve guys play to maximize their pay per UAV shift too?

[tunes]

12 hours ago, Clark Griswold said:

Yup - would be an easy unit to support.  Close to an airline hub, high density of military facilities for mutual support and desirable location - all things the AF would not compute.

Consider it strategically, how do I get people to volunteer / not feel too bitter about driving a droid?  

Desirable locations, distribution across time zones, reasonable GA flying program for professional aviator development, base of choice or MDS crossflow for volunteers for 4 year assignments.  This is not that hard AF.

agreed. I was pretty interested in continuing guard/reserve doing RPAs after getting the airline job. Talked to creech about it and I just can't commit to 6 days a month as a commuter. Living there would be different...hence the would love to do it in CO.

[Nobody]

I would be totally down with cos, but at this point I'd even take Shaw just to get on the east coast.  How can the greatest AF on the planet be so ing irresponsible with what itself thinks is going to be the future.  Let's just drive this community nose down and on fire straight into the ground, but then sprinkle a few dollars on the corpses and claim ignorance why the majority hate it.

[Clark Griswold]

On September 19, 2016 at 10:52 PM, Jaded said:

Isn't there some game that guard/reserve guys play to maximize their pay per UAV shift too?

Just using the rules as they are written for maximum benefit - basically 4 hours of duty equals one pay day so you can legally make 2 days pay for 8 hours duty.

Technicians can also work a day for pay as a GS then do an IDT (Inactive Duty Training) to get one day of pay by the Military system.

Hate the game not the player.

On September 20, 2016 at 11:01 AM, tunes said:

agreed. I was pretty interested in continuing guard/reserve doing RPAs after getting the airline job. Talked to creech about it and I just can't commit to 6 days a month as a commuter. Living there would be different...hence the would love to do it in CO.

Yup - the more podunk the location of the Guard / Reserve unit the harder to attract / retain TRs.

If the AF was really interested in fixing this problem (RPA locations and the enterprise in general) they'd put new Active Association units or convert Reserve units in airline domiciles or in major cities distributed across the time zones to attract TRs with airline or civilian jobs based there for an easier unit to attract / retain TRs.  

Station AD there for the continuity with an appropriate cadre of AGRs and Techs, let the TRs come in to maintain and fly the line as desired or needed.

TRs get Guard / Reserve unit located with their domicile or in an easy to commute to location via CASS privileges.  

Active Duty RPA get better locations that Clovistan or Creechnam and the spread across time zones improves QOL.

Anderson (domicile for United), Hickam, McChord, Beale (close enough to SFO), Nellis, Peterson, Robins (close enough to ATL), Hansom - that's an easy and quick march West to East across that have AD bases. 

Again AF, this is not that hard to figure out.

On September 20, 2016 at 8:35 PM, Nobody said:

I would be totally down with cos, but at this point I'd even take Shaw just to get on the east coast.  How can the greatest AF on the planet be so ing irresponsible with what itself thinks is going to be the future.  Let's just drive this community nose down and on fire straight into the ground, but then sprinkle a few dollars on the corpses and claim ignorance why the majority hate it.

Shoe clerks.

Good locations across time zones - GA companion aircraft program - Good follow on assignments for volunteers to the RPA - Commissioning opportunities for qualified applicants for a modest ADSC / RPA service

AF, please see the comment above..

Edited September 23, 2016 by Clark Griswold
minor

[pawnman]

On 9/20/2016 at 7:35 PM, Nobody said:

I would be totally down with cos, but at this point I'd even take Shaw just to get on the east coast.  How can the greatest AF on the planet be so ing irresponsible with what itself thinks is going to be the future.  Let's just drive this community nose down and on fire straight into the ground, but then sprinkle a few dollars on the corpses and claim ignorance why the majority hate it.

Because we don't get to pick the bases, congress does.  So whatever congressman needs a favor, needs jobs in their district, has the pull with the Armed Services Committee, etc, gets to pick.

[Clark Griswold]

Because we don't get to pick the bases, congress does.  So whatever congressman needs a favor, needs jobs in their district, has the pull with the Armed Services Committee, etc, gets to pick.

Unfortunately true

Just my cynical opinion but leadership uses certain unloved children as bargaining chips

Still sucks and not in the good way


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