The Next President is...

[pawnman]

1 hour ago, Lord Ratner said:

Yikes. There's a whole lot of "I told ya so" that'll come from that clip.

Only for anyone who didn't watch a single clip of him during the campaign.  This is nothing new.  Like, not even a little bit.

[17D_guy]

26 minutes ago, pawnman said:

Only for anyone who didn't watch a single clip of him during the campaign.  This is nothing new.  Like, not even a little bit.

I'm pretty sure I heard this before -

"Don't worry about what he says, he'll build a good team around him and get things done."

[ClearedHot]

16 hours ago, Homestar said:

Elections have consequences. 

Yes they do and I am sure you and the other folks that voted for Biden are proud of his achievements like some of the following.

- 42 Executive Orders, more than any President in history.  More than Trump and Obama combined.  Even though he said Dictator use EOs.

 

 

- Keystone Pipeline - 10,000 lost jobs and gas prices on the rise up, 9% locally (there are of course other factors as well).  I feel so much safer given there are no other pipelines out there...oh wayment.

 

- Paris Climate Accord - No worries John Kerry promised West Virginia Coal miners "Solar Panel manufacturing" jobs even though 73% of that capability resides in China.

 

- Stopped withdraw from AFG.  Hurray, endless deployments for all my friends.

 

- Let it slip that  Khalid Sheikh Mohammed will get vaccine before millions of vulnerable Americans he tried to kill.

UFB!

 

 

[Negatory]

I’m on board with your point about Afghanistan and vaccinations 100%.

The Keystone pipeline and the Paris climate accords are both issues primarily related to global warming. Which, many believe, is an existential threat to the world. In my opinion, they are much better solutions than the republican strategy of not doing anything at all. To me, the republican strat for global warming was similar to the COVID strat: say it will go away on its own and put earplugs in.

There are hundreds, probably of thousands, of graphs like these that point to our future trajectory. What’s the plan?

 

[ClearedHot]

Agree we need a plan, but the plan we are signing up for puts an unfair burden on the U.S. ($20,000 per American family), when we are not the biggest emitters of green house gases AND we are already decreasing our emissions.   I am not a climate change denier...It is real, it is a threat and we need to take action NOW.  The problem is the United States should not have to shoulder an unfair burden.

 

By the way, even though we left the Paris Climate Accord, We have reduced our emissions more than any other industrialized nation...the real threat is China.

 

[Swamp Yankee]

On 1/30/2021 at 5:49 PM, ClearedHot said:

Seriously?  So you are saying Jen Psaki is pure as the driven snow and she doesn't lie.  Come on man!

Psaki outright lied as State Department Spokesperson.

Conway and Spice were horrible, I liked Huckabee, she gave what she got...Post Spicer that press room was radioactive and combative from the first day she walked to the podium.  The point of the post was they are sticking to a script and if it isn't on the script they don't know what to do.  She is the White House Press Secretary, she should do better than fumble through a book for a scripted answer and when she can't find it "circle back."

For the record, during my career "I don't know" was usually an acceptable answer especially during my time at the WIC if it was followed up with, but I know how to find the answer.  It was not an acceptable answer on a checkride if we were talking ops limits, it was not an acceptable answer in a TIC if I asked where the friendlies were, and it was not acceptable the night my wife was driving our family to dinner off base and a young asshat Airman was driving so crazy he ran us off the road and into a field. 

Quick story...For two miles this chump tried to pass us in heavy traffic and nearly clipped the back of our SUV both times.  My wife is not a slow driver and we were doing 60 in a 55, and he was still about a foot off our bumper trying to pass.   He tried twice to pass and almost clipped us each time as he jumped back in line.  When he finally did pass there was oncoming traffic and not enough room.  He was was about dead even with us and my wife had to swerve off the road and into a field to avoid a head on collision, he kept on going.  We got back on the road and wouldn't you know it he got caught at the long traffic light so we caught up to him.  I had consumed a few adult beverages at the club and figured it best not to confront someone offbase so I wrote down his tag and called the Mission Support Group Commander to have the SPs run the tag (dude looked military).  Wouldn't you know it came back to Airman Snuffy from Mx Sq... he was standing in my office at 0700 on Monday with his Sq/CC and Grp/CC.  I asked him what were you thinking..."I don't know?"  Did you think about stopping when you ran my wife, my son and my off the road and into that field...."I don't know..."  That was his answer to everything.  Only time I ever really went off on someone for "I don't know."

 

She’s not impressive in that role, which requires one to think on her feet. 
Two observations:

- Blitzer did a decent job pressing her to provide a clear answer.  CNN leans left, but I’m glad to observe at least one reporter trying to be objective.  I can’t recall Fox doing the same with Trump’s press folks. 
- With regard to the aggressive driver; I hope your family was not harmed. It is fortunate that you had recourse due to the somewhat unique circumstances That’s just a standard day on the road in Boston. It is remarkable we don’t have rampant road rage up here. 

[ClearedHot]

12 minutes ago, Swamp Yankee said:

She’s not impressive in that role, which requires one to think on her feet. 
Two observations:

- Blitzer did a decent job pressing her to provide a clear answer.  CNN leans left, but I’m glad to observe at least one reporter trying to be objective.  I can’t recall Fox doing the same with Trump’s press folks. 
- With regard to the aggressive driver; I hope your family was not harmed. It is fortunate that you had recourse due to the somewhat unique circumstances That’s just a standard day on the road in Boston. It is remarkable we don’t have rampant road rage up here. 

I wish ALL networks would press folks regardless of political party...that was the original intent of the press.

I hear you on Boston, my sister lives up there and everytime I visit it is a shitshow.  My brother-in-law is a deputy police chief in the area and he drives like a maniac...and that is saying something considering how fast I drive.

[Negatory]

1 hour ago, ClearedHot said:

Agree we need a plan, but the plan we are signing up for puts an unfair burden on the U.S. ($20,000 per American family), when we are not the biggest emitters of green house gases AND we are already decreasing our emissions.   I am not a climate change denier...It is real, it is a threat and we need to take action NOW.  The problem is the United States should not have to shoulder an unfair burden.

 

By the way, even though we left the Paris Climate Accord, We have reduced our emissions more than any other industrialized nation...the real threat is China.

 

It’s harder to argue we have some sort of moral high ground when our per capita CO2 expenditure is twice that of China’s. You can’t forget we have 330M and they have 1.4B.

In that framework, what is “fair?”

[jazzdude]

Agree we need a plan, but the plan we are signing up for puts an unfair burden on the U.S. ($20,000 per American family), when we are not the biggest emitters of green house gases AND we are already decreasing our emissions.   I am not a climate change denier...It is real, it is a threat and we need to take action NOW.  The problem is the United States should not have to shoulder an unfair burden.

 
By the way, even though we left the Paris Climate Accord, We have reduced our emissions more than any other industrialized nation...the real threat is China.

 

I generally agree with you on your points (need for action, we've made good progress towards reducing emissions), though with some caveats.

China's the biggest threat, especially if you look at total CO2 produced, and their increasing trend.

While the US has made the most reduction, we were and still are the #2 CO2 producer in the world (2018). So the chart you posted can be misleading, but it does show that we are moving in the right direction.

Total fossil fuel CO2 puts China at #1 , and the US at #2 as of 2018 data.
https://www.investopedia.com/articles/investing/092915/5-countries-produce-most-carbon-dioxide-co2.asp

Per capita we're worse than China, so that does temper some of their CO2 output (with more people you'd expect more total emissions), though they are trending upwards.
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/consumption-co2-per-capita?stackMode=absolute&time=latest&country=~USA&region=World

We didn't formally leave the Paris Accords until Nov 2020, and it looks like we'll rejoin in March 2021, so I don't think leaving really did anything beyond symbolic.

[Negatory]

Agreed that leaving was symbolic, but it was still counterproductive if we don’t have actual solutions or plans to make it “fair.”

The only way to “win” here is using soft power to get everyone on board. You can’t invade China to shut off their manufacturing. And, as the past 4 years have shown, you can’t really impose tariffs nearly as effectively as we would hope.

This is the cost of China becoming a superpower (mainly due to how much shopping I do at Walmart).

[Homestar]

4 hours ago, ClearedHot said:

Yes they do and I am sure you and the other folks that voted for Biden are proud of his achievements like some of the following.

- 42 Executive Orders, more than any President in history.  More than Trump and Obama combined.  Even though he said Dictator use EOs.

 

 

- Keystone Pipeline - 10,000 lost jobs and gas prices on the rise up, 9% locally (there are of course other factors as well).  I feel so much safer given there are no other pipelines out there...oh wayment.

 

- Paris Climate Accord - No worries John Kerry promised West Virginia Coal miners "Solar Panel manufacturing" jobs even though 73% of that capability resides in China.

 

- Stopped withdraw from AFG.  Hurray, endless deployments for all my friends.

 

- Let it slip that  Khalid Sheikh Mohammed will get vaccine before millions of vulnerable Americans he tried to kill.

UFB!

 

 

I voted for Biden because Trump was an immoral option. I couldn’t look my kids in the eye and explain any reasoning for voting for him. I’m a conservative without a home. I’m a proud Never Trumper that actually votes for and encourages actual conservatism. Trump was none of that. Screw that guy. He was horrible for our country in all respects. I seriously don’t care what liberal utopia crap we get in the next two years because it means Trump isn’t in office. Jeez. You guys make it seem that Biden’s EOs are going to ring in the apocalypse. 

[jazzdude]

Agreed that leaving was symbolic, but it was still counterproductive if we don’t have actual solutions or plans to make it “fair.”
The only way to “win” here is using soft power to get everyone on board. You can’t invade China to shut off their manufacturing. And, as the past 4 years have shown, you can’t really impose tariffs nearly as effectively as we would hope.
This is the cost of China becoming a superpower (mainly due to how much shopping I do at Walmart).

Whether we are in the Paris Accords or not, being the example like in CH's chart buys us credibility in the world to get others to do the same.

[ViperMan]

45 minutes ago, Homestar said:

I voted for Biden because Trump was an immoral option. I couldn’t look my kids in the eye and explain any reasoning for voting for him. I’m a conservative without a home. I’m a proud Never Trumper that actually votes for and encourages actual conservatism. Trump was none of that. Screw that guy. He was horrible for our country in all respects. I seriously don’t care what liberal utopia crap we get in the next two years because it means Trump isn’t in office. Jeez. You guys make it seem that Biden’s EOs are going to ring in the apocalypse. 

Neil Gorsuch.

Brett Kavanaugh.

Amy Barrett.

Kicking Iran's dick in.

Not engaging in any new wars - something no President since Regan? Carter? has been able to do.

Attempting to normalize relations with NK.

Overseeing numerous ME peace deals.

No president is morally perfect. Trump and Biden included. I don't think most conservatives are worried about Biden per se, though...most know that Biden is a place-holder; an empty vessel who is merely the wedge the woke machine needed to use in order to regain the executive branch. Look at the rest of people who were in the race - Kamala, Bernie, Warren, Buttigieg, Beto, etc. There are not moderate people. Biden is the lightly salted mashed potatoes who they had to put foward in order to get moderate democrats motivated to think they had a shot and get out to the polls en masse - that wouldn't have happened with a Bernie.

Personally I think Joe Biden is basically a good man - would probably have been an ok president at some point. That said, this guy is just getting started with probably one of the most stressful jobs in the world, and he's already (waaaaay) past his expiration date. Look at what 8 years did to Bush Jr. and Obama - they came out different men. Does anyone honestly expect this is a guy who's about to be a two-term president?

[Homestar]

19 minutes ago, ViperMan said:

Neil Gorsuch.

Brett Kavanaugh.

Amy Barrett.

Kicking Iran's dick in.

Not engaging in any new wars - something no President since Regan? Carter? has been able to do.

Attempting to normalize relations with NK.

Overseeing numerous ME peace deals.

No president is morally perfect. Trump and Biden included. I don't think most conservatives are worried about Biden per se, though...most know that Biden is a place-holder; an empty vessel who is merely the wedge the woke machine needed to use in order to regain the executive branch. Look at the rest of people who were in the race - Kamala, Bernie, Warren, Buttigieg, Beto, etc. There are not moderate people. Biden is the lightly salted mashed potatoes who they had to put foward in order to get moderate democrats motivated to think they had a shot and get out to the polls en masse - that wouldn't have happened with a Bernie.

Personally I think Joe Biden is basically a good man - would probably have been an ok president at some point. That said, this guy is just getting started with probably one of the most stressful jobs in the world, and he's already (waaaaay) past his expiration date. Look at what 8 years did to Bush Jr. and Obama - they came out different men. Does anyone honestly expect this is a guy who's about to be a two-term president?

I can get on board with SCOTUS picks and winding down wars (though I honestly believe he did by straight up neglecting his Commander-in-Chief duties). 
 

But saying nobody is perfect then getting on board with Trump as POTUS is a non starter for me. Nobody is perfect, true. But Trump did actual damage to the American psyche and seriously fractured Republican politics for a generation. This is not something to be proud of just because “he told it like it is”. 
 

Biden an empty vessel placeholder? Fine. Anyone but Trump. I’d prefer an actual conservative, but in the meantime I can put up with the meaningless EOs that don’t affect me in any measurable way day-to-day. In two years maybe the Republicans rediscover what it means to be conservative now that they don’t have to bow and kiss the ring of Trump. 
 

Edit to add: I hope Adam Kinzinger is still reading this forum. He is the future of the Republican Party. If he and Dan Crenshaw could combine forces we could actually return to real conservative leadership. 

Edited February 2, 2021 by Homestar

[ViperMan]

45 minutes ago, Homestar said:

I can get on board with SCOTUS picks and winding down wars (though I honestly believe he did by straight up neglecting his Commander-in-Chief duties). 

But saying nobody is perfect then getting on board with Trump as POTUS is a non starter for me. Nobody is perfect, true. But Trump did actual damage to the American psyche and seriously fractured Republican politics for a generation. This is not something to be proud of just because “he told it like it is”. 

Biden an empty vessel placeholder? Fine. Anyone but Trump. I’d prefer an actual conservative, but in the meantime I can put up with the meaningless EOs that don’t affect me in any measurable way day-to-day. In two years maybe the Republicans rediscover what it means to be conservative now that they don’t have to bow and kiss the ring of Trump. 

Edit to add: I hope Adam Kinzinger is still reading this forum. He is the future of the Republican Party. If he and Dan Crenshaw could combine forces we could actually return to real conservative leadership. 

Fair enough. I would ask you, though, if he did it by neglect, where else should we currently be at war?

I would go a lot further, however. Modern-day politics has been completely F'd starting in '03 because of our ill-conceived venture into Iraq. I'm glad the rest of the world is waking up to how screwed up our politics is across the board. If it was Trump that woke people up, great, but Trump ain't the root cause. My main concern is that there are people who are only seeking to take advantage of the current situation who don't give one F about the actual future of this country. IMO those people are now in charge and that worries me.

Edited February 2, 2021 by ViperMan

[Homestar]

20 minutes ago, ViperMan said:

Modern-day politics has been completely F'd starting in '03 because of our ill-conceived venture into Iraq.

I agree. I voted for Bush in 2000 but not in 2004. 
 

Disagree that the current people in charge don’t care about the country. 

[N730]

Agree we need a plan, but the plan we are signing up for puts an unfair burden on the U.S. ($20,000 per American family), when we are not the biggest emitters of green house gases AND we are already decreasing our emissions.   I am not a climate change denier...It is real, it is a threat and we need to take action NOW.  The problem is the United States should not have to shoulder an unfair burden.

 
By the way, even though we left the Paris Climate Accord, We have reduced our emissions more than any other industrialized nation...the real threat is China.

 

I'd add India to this list too.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Baseops Network mobile app

[SurelySerious]

2 hours ago, Homestar said:

I can get on board with SCOTUS picks and winding down wars (though I honestly believe he did by straight up neglecting his Commander-in-Chief duties). 
 

But saying nobody is perfect then getting on board with Trump as POTUS is a non starter for me. Nobody is perfect, true. But Trump did actual damage to the American psyche and seriously fractured Republican politics for a generation. This is not something to be proud of just because “he told it like it is”. 
 

Biden an empty vessel placeholder? Fine. Anyone but Trump. I’d prefer an actual conservative, but in the meantime I can put up with the meaningless EOs that don’t affect me in any measurable way day-to-day. In two years maybe the Republicans rediscover what it means to be conservative now that they don’t have to bow and kiss the ring of Trump. 
 

Edit to add: I hope Adam Kinzinger is still reading this forum. He is the future of the Republican Party. If he and Dan Crenshaw could combine forces we could actually return to real conservative leadership. 

Have you read about the insane stuff Kinzinger has been putting up with from his home base recently? Like literal extended family, IIRC. I’ll see if I can find. 
 

My congressman also crossed lines to vote for impeachment, and the amount of BS he gets from MAGA people is pretty ridiculous on social media. SM isn’t a broad spectrum of actual voters, but yikes. 
 

Edit: Kinzinger madness posted in Congressman thread. 

Edited February 2, 2021 by SurelySerious

[slackline]

Kinzinger probably stopped posting in here because he lost faith with the amount of Trump Apologists in here.  

Dude's the real deal!

[ClearedHot]

6 hours ago, slackline said:

Kinzinger probably stopped posting in here because he lost faith with the amount of Trump Apologists in here.  

Dude's the real deal!

I've know him for a long time and I applaud him for sticking to his beliefs.  His family sounds like a real work of art.

[Homestar]

9 hours ago, SurelySerious said:

Have you read about the insane stuff Kinzinger has been putting up with from his home base recently? Like literal extended family, IIRC.

Yes, I've read about it. Madness from the MAGA hive mind. Trump has made people insane.

[Lord Ratner]

22 hours ago, Homestar said:

I can get on board with SCOTUS picks and winding down wars (though I honestly believe he did by straight up neglecting his Commander-in-Chief duties). 
 

But saying nobody is perfect then getting on board with Trump as POTUS is a non starter for me. Nobody is perfect, true. But Trump did actual damage to the American psyche and seriously fractured Republican politics for a generation. This is not something to be proud of just because “he told it like it is”. 
 

Biden an empty vessel placeholder? Fine. Anyone but Trump. I’d prefer an actual conservative, but in the meantime I can put up with the meaningless EOs that don’t affect me in any measurable way day-to-day. In two years maybe the Republicans rediscover what it means to be conservative now that they don’t have to bow and kiss the ring of Trump. 
 

Edit to add: I hope Adam Kinzinger is still reading this forum. He is the future of the Republican Party. If he and Dan Crenshaw could combine forces we could actually return to real conservative leadership. 

How?

 

Am I the only person who saw politicians for the duplicitous villains they always have been?

 

The problem I have with your argument, and the Never Trumpers in general, is that it really sounds like "I can look my kids in the eye and support someone as long as they aren't so obvious about their immorality." It would be one thing to disown Trump and only support moral, consistent politicians. But Biden, Harris, Bernie, and the others are anything but. If a conservative voted for a liberal because of Trump, I'm not sure they were really conservative. If they didn't vote at all, that is a completely understandable and consistent position. 

 

This is why nothing is real and everything is a riot. Because the masses, unwashed as we are, are very good at spotting an inconsistency. Everything that was said of Trump was completely and totally true of his supposed betters. He's enriching himself in office? Lol. He's kicking positions to family and friends? That's new... He's a liar? He cheats on his wife? His kids are a mess? He plays too much golf? And before Trump, good, decent, honest people were immolated with bullshit. Romney and Kavanaugh are just two obvious examples. So hating Trump for the odious pig he is, gotcha. But don't moralize if your solution is to support a more-polished turd.

 

Trump was just politics without the makeup. If you (not Homestar specifically) didn't realize that until now, I have a bridge to sell you.

 

We agree on Crenshaw. *If* he can keep his head on straight, and doesn't wait too long to run, he would make an incredible president. We need term limits and age limits. I've never heard anyone say they wished they had an 80 year old involved in their project, yet somehow they are running the country.

[slackline]

42 minutes ago, Lord Ratner said:

I've never heard anyone say they wished they had an 80 year old involved in their project, yet somehow they are running the country.

That’s ageism, and I'm triggered. How dare you!?

 

Ok, I heartily agree with you!

[arg]

On 2/1/2021 at 5:21 PM, Homestar said:

I voted for Biden because Trump was an immoral option. I couldn’t look my kids in the eye and explain any reasoning for voting for him. I’m a conservative without a home. I’m a proud Never Trumper that actually votes for and encourages actual conservatism. Trump was none of that. Screw that guy. He was horrible for our country in all respects. I seriously don’t care what liberal utopia crap we get in the next two years because it means Trump isn’t in office. Jeez. You guys make it seem that Biden’s EOs are going to ring in the apocalypse. 

I voted for policy over personality. No idea how old your kids are but are you are teaching them to vote for the nice guy? Have you explained to your kids how many jobs Biden has killed and how that affects thousands? Have you talked about how long Biden has been in politics and what he's done? I don't know if you have daughters who are into sports but did you tell them Biden says a boy can compete against them and take a shower with them after practice? You said he was "horrible for our country in all respects" . Was the record low unemployment Bullshit? The record small businesses opening bullshit? 

[Homestar]

5 minutes ago, arg said:

I voted for policy over personality. No idea how old your kids are but are you are teaching them to vote for the nice guy? Have you explained to your kids how many jobs Biden has killed and how that affects thousands? Have you talked about how long Biden has been in politics and what he's done? I don't know if you have daughters who are into sports but did you tell them Biden says a boy can compete against them and take a shower with them after practice? You said he was "horrible for our country in all respects" . Was the record low unemployment Bullshit? The record small businesses opening bullshit? 

I'm teaching them that morality matters.  Am I taking crazy pills?  If we're putting Biden on one end of the scales and Trump on the other and you're telling me that they balance out, I'm telling you that you are taking crazy pills.

Trump was not ok.  Biden might not be okay either, but he is in a different universe from Trump.

I laugh when I hear "you must not be a real conservative."  Really?  Because I didn't kiss the ring of Trump?