The Next President is...

[FLEA]

I'm currently enjoying the Reddit storm of progressive pro-labor types going fucking nuts that Joe Biden averted the railway strike. Its like they can't comprehend that a democratic president would do something that is anti-union. 

[ClearedHot]

1 hour ago, nsplayr said:

Because we disagree on the facts of what happened, just like many on the right do with Russian election interference in 2016.

Fact - Big Tech suppressed the laptop story.

Fact - The FBI was meeting with Big Tech Weekly

1 hour ago, nsplayr said:

Tech companies and especially social media companies do hold a lot of power over the collective conversation, not unlike traditional media. There should be standards of acceptable conduct, I totally agree on that. Is what Twitter did a gross violation of standards of acceptable conduct? I'm not nearly as sure as you are.

Of course you are not nearly as sure, because it didn't happen to your side.  Please tell me one negative story about trump or his kids that was suppressed by Big Tech. 

2 hours ago, nsplayr said:

The Hunter laptop story was widely reported and available freely and openly to anyone who cared to type www.nypost.com into their browser windows. The government in no way suppressed The New York Post or banned people from reading their reporting, reposting it, talking about it, or developing their own stories based on their reporting.

Dear god, do you actually believe what you just typed.  First, as you well know the attention span of the average American is at an all time low.  Most Americans now get their news from social media.   Additionally, we are completely politically bifurcated, it is the independents who decided most elections and the independents didn't know to go to the NY Post.  Not only did they stop users from posting the story, they stopped it from being DM'd or shared on both Twitter and Facebook.  Seriously brother, you are a smart dude, you have to understand how this suppressed the story.  A story that was TRUE!

2 hours ago, nsplayr said:

Their "polling methodology" of saying that oh if only people had known about this story (faints back onto a strategically placed couch), Trump would have gotten 300+ EVs is incredibly laughable. We don't need to speculate about a past event, it happened! We know the results for real, not just for make-believe!

Here is the money shot, you can't even comprehend that something nefarious might have happened.  Sorry brother but I want to know the truth. Put aside your hate for the orange man and think about the long-term impacts on democracy and our way of governance. 

 

2 hours ago, nsplayr said:

The GOP talked quite a bit about Hunter and his laptop at the end of the campaign and Joe Biden still won the 2020 Presidential election. It wasn't the October Surprise some were hoping for and I'm sorry that didn't work out for y'all the way Hillary's emails did - better luck next time.

So flippant about the implications, anything for victory?  As long as the Big Guy gets his 10% and you get rid of the orange man all is well...really sad, REALLY sad.

[ItnStln]

4 hours ago, ViperMan said:

Watched this a bunch, and I've yet to hear him call for a riot, coup, or insurrection. Now, it's some Dem's turn to post the part where he does. I'll wait.

I'm waiting too

Edited December 5, 2022 by ItnStln

[Mark1]

On 12/3/2022 at 11:55 AM, ClearedHot said:

As the Twitter files finally see the light of day it is more and more obvious that Big Tech, the DNC and the FBI changed the outcome of the election...and they continue to shape the social media narrative.

If you want to criticize the FBI, go ahead, but you've got no case complaining about Twitter/'BigTech' or the DNC.

You're upset that the DNC was trying to manipulate things in their favor?  That's literally their reason for existence.  Same as the RNC.  They're private organizations and can do whatever they like within bounds of the law.  Is it scummy?  Sure.  Is being a scumbag illegal?  Unfortunately not.

As for Twitter, we all know conservative Citizens United has established that corporations have the same rights as a person when it comes to political support.  They're free to write a billion dollar check to a SuperPAC of their choice for the expressed intent of electing their preferred candidate.  Running a business in a way that subtly supports a particular candidate or party is much less direct than monetarily funding a campaign, and it's just as legal.  So let's not throw terms like 'freedom of speech' around where they don't belong.

You know damn well MSNBC/Fox News/etc run their organizations with a policy of the same kind of "information suppression" so why are you singling out 'BigTech' as a boogeyman?

Do laws need to change to account for the information age?  Maybe.  Is Citizens United kicking themselves for setting a precedent that currently favors their political opponents (through support of pinko commie lib media), probably.  But there is no scandal with the DNC or 'BigTech'.

The only thing that's clear is that last week Trump, for any slow learners that hadn't figured it out a decade ago, literally and explicitly declared himself an enemy of the Constitution.  And since that's a bit of a conflict with the commissioning oath nobody on this forum will ever sing his praises again.  Right....guys?

[ClearedHot]

4 hours ago, Mark1 said:

If you want to criticize the FBI, go ahead, but you've got no case complaining about Twitter/'BigTech' or the DNC.

Have you ever heard of 230?  Of course there is a case when they hide behind 230. 

As for the FBI, it should be far more than criticism, the depths of rot are actually frightening.  Just curious, have you looked at anything Elon has released?  By name they have the FBI agent that met with Big Tech weekly SPECIFICALLY said there would be an October surprise and it would have something to do with Hunter Biden.  They knew about the laptop, they knew it was real yet they put their fingers on the scales that at least impacted the election.  I don't care which side of the aisle you are on, that should make your blood boil as an American.

[tac airlifter]

46 minutes ago, ClearedHot said:

They knew about the laptop, they knew it was real yet they put their fingers on the scales that at least impacted the election.  I don't care which side of the aisle you are on, that should make your blood boil as an American.

100% right.  The FBI had in their possession proof of multiple felonies. Instead of investigating or prosecuting, they hid those crimes and even deceived tech companies into thinking it was Russian disinformation so they would silence investigative journalists.  This is deeply partisan criminal behavior, and clearly not an isolated incident.
 

We have the largest and most advanced law-enforcement agency in the history of the world orchestrating third party First Amendment suppression, at massive scale, to manipulate citizens and change election outcomes.  Is there a more serious scandal in American history?  

[nsplayr]

1 hour ago, tac airlifter said:

Is there a more serious scandal in American history?  

🤣 yes definitely. 

[ViperMan]

Girls, girls...it wasn't just the DNC that acted to suppress the laptop story...more than 50 MAJOR intelligence officials came out in unison - WITHOUT EVIDENCE (or maybe with???) - and stated that it was a Russian hoax. That was false. Those same officials are eerily quiet right now. Accountability much anyone?

The number of officials who have gotten it wrong and felt zero (0) need to go back and correct the record or publicly re-evaluate their thinking over the past number of years is sickening, and it portends very, very bad things for the future of our country because not only do the PTB not care about having gotten it wrong, this shows they no longer care what us proles think, and it demonstrably proves that they are not politically neutral. Politically neutral entities have no reason to not go back and correct the record. Amirite?

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/10/19/hunter-biden-story-russian-disinfo-430276

Generally speaking, heads of TLAs don't all speak out together about things that "aren't a big deal." It was and IS a big deal.

I invite you to conduct a brief thought-experiment. Imagine for one minute that the propaganda you're steeped in is invisible to you. What does the world look like?

14 hours ago, nsplayr said:

The government in no way suppressed The New York Post or banned people from reading their reporting, reposting it, talking about it, or developing their own stories based on their reporting. Look at China especially or Iran or Russia for examples of true state repression of information, it's many orders of magnitude different than what you see here or in other Western capitalist democratic societies

Are you sure about that 5 minutes!!??

Stated differently: The TRUTH “has all the classic earmarks of a Russian information operation.” Makes you think.

Edited December 5, 2022 by ViperMan
Clarity

[ViperMan]

14 hours ago, Prozac said:

Still not buying the whole “media is stacked against us” argument. The problem with today’s conservatives is that they’ve decided the only way to win is to make sure their voters are perennially pissed off enough to show up at the polls. They prefer to fight boogeymen vs come up with a coherent platform.

Your post reads like an invitation to becoming better-informed. If that's an authentic feeling, you might consider checking out this podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/all-things-re-considered-with-peter-boghossian/id1650150225

It's from a (previously) liberal professor who has witnessed the change in tone and tenor in the conversation that has taken place inside American universities (and bled over) over the last 10 years. He was one (of many) who have been subjected to the increasingly illiberal attitudes and actions that are finding aid and comfort in our society. At times it has some hokey elements, but overall it is sharp and on point.

Boghossian and his co-host correctly identify the broader trend in some of our cultural institutions (i.e. NPR) that are working to enable such illiberal attitudes, that being: lies are now espoused and propagated as truth, and these lies are in turn used to enable illegitimate power. He and his co-host pick through numerous stories and how they were reported on NPR. He then contrasts their reporting with what actually happened and lays bare the striking contrast between those two things. A podcast with this type of meta-reporting is something which was sorely overdue, and deserves much accolade.

Case in point: the Kyle Rittenhouse saga. NPR worked overtime casting that story in a false light. They systematically dive into the details, how easy it was to get it right, and how NPR got it so exceptionally wrong: to listen to NPR is to become misinformed. Their reporting is conducted in a soothing, breathy tone, and in delectable, oh so perfectly-enunciated English, but it is largely a disinformation network. Your complaint about Republican over-focus on "dog whistle" issues is fair, but it's also wholly incomplete. There are real constitutional issues that were on trial in the court of public opinion, which are not diminished by the other "issues" you raised. NPR played (and plays) a major part in the mosaic of propaganda that makes up our information space.

For my part in the mid 2010s, I underwent the same transformation as espoused in many of the show's featured vignettes with regard to NPR. I listened to it everyday on the way to work - yes, I am an ex-NPR acolyte - but somewhere in there it just became insufferable. I couldn't point at any one thing, but my belief is that their transformation coincided directly with the 2016 presidential election.

Wrapping up: it's all well and good if you don't believe the "media is stacked against us" argument, but there's a source for you that lays it out in black and white. To all my conservative friends: it's a good podcast in that it goes far deeper than just shouting at the TV and yelling "get off my lawn." In short, it's actual reporting.

[Prozac]

1 hour ago, ViperMan said:

Your post reads like an invitation to becoming better-informed. If that's an authentic feeling, you might consider checking out this podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/all-things-re-considered-with-peter-boghossian/id1650150225

It's from a (previously) liberal professor who has witnessed the change in tone and tenor in the conversation that has taken place inside American universities (and bled over) over the last 10 years. He was one (of many) who have been subjected to the increasingly illiberal attitudes and actions that are finding aid and comfort in our society. At times it has some hokey elements, but overall it is sharp and on point.

Boghossian and his co-host correctly identify the broader trend in some of our cultural institutions (i.e. NPR) that are working to enable such illiberal attitudes, that being: lies are now espoused and propagated as truth, and these lies are in turn used to enable illegitimate power. He and his co-host pick through numerous stories and how they were reported on NPR. He then contrasts their reporting with what actually happened and lays bare the striking contrast between those two things. A podcast with this type of meta-reporting is something which was sorely overdue, and deserves much accolade.

Case in point: the Kyle Rittenhouse saga. NPR worked overtime casting that story in a false light. They systematically dive into the details, how easy it was to get it right, and how NPR got it so exceptionally wrong: to listen to NPR is to become misinformed. Their reporting is conducted in a soothing, breathy tone, and in delectable, oh so perfectly-enunciated English, but it is largely a disinformation network. Your complaint about Republican over-focus on "dog whistle" issues is fair, but it's also wholly incomplete. There are real constitutional issues that were on trial in the court of public opinion, which are not diminished by the other "issues" you raised. NPR played (and plays) a major part in the mosaic of propaganda that makes up our information space.

For my part in the mid 2010s, I underwent the same transformation as espoused in many of the show's featured vignettes with regard to NPR. I listened to it everyday on the way to work - yes, I am an ex-NPR acolyte - but somewhere in there it just became insufferable. I couldn't point at any one thing, but my belief is that their transformation coincided directly with the 2016 presidential election.

Wrapping up: it's all well and good if you don't believe the "media is stacked against us" argument, but there's a source for you that lays it out in black and white. To all my conservative friends: it's a good podcast in that it goes far deeper than just shouting at the TV and yelling "get off my lawn." In short, it's actual reporting.

Thanks for a reasoned & polite response. I’ll give that podcast an open minded listen. FWIW, I was also an NPR listener for a long time (surprise 😎), and I too realized at some point that it’s bias went past “leaning left” to something more approximating “promoting the left”. I don’t listen much anymore (save for old episodes of “Car Talk” - those guys were great). Unfortunately, the America we now inhabit seems to have fully embraced partisan media. I’m not happy about that either & I think the left leaning media of the 90s and earlier bears a lot of the blame for refusing to address its own blind spots and creating the conditions for blatantly right wing media sources to thrive. Alas, this is one of those cases where the train has left the station & writhing against the current status quo fits more into the “Lord, grant me the strength to accept the things I cannot change” category than it’s worth getting riled up about. Where I do take issue is when people complain about the bias of a source they don’t agree with while defending their own favorite outlet as sacrosanct. Yeah, CNN sucks. That doesn’t automatically mean that Newsmax is telling the truth. All of that to say, the only thing most of us here can control is who we vote for. But we have more agency than we think. We can get involved at a grassroots level and support good candidates from the get go. It might take patience, but it’s probably gonna be far more effective than continually bitching about how the networks that DJT constantly threatened and shat on didn’t give him fair coverage in the last election. 

[TreeA10]

Doesn't look like either side has a whole lot of trust in the media but definite Republicans less than Democrats. 

https://issuesinsights.com/2022/12/05/media-tailspin-continues-as-trust-hits-record-lows-ii-tipp-poll/

 

[Biff_T]

3 hours ago, TreeA10 said:

Doesn't look like either side has a whole lot of trust in the media but definite Republicans less than Democrats. 

https://issuesinsights.com/2022/12/05/media-tailspin-continues-as-trust-hits-record-lows-ii-tipp-poll/

 

The only way you fix trust is more government intervention.   Lol

Break, Break

The new cool thing to do is bash Twitter, quit said media platform and then rejoin it when you figure out that no one cares that you quit.  I guess we'll have to censor it.  

Good job.  I'm glad our government is on top of more censorship.  Meanwhile, I just watched another homeless man shit where we're supposed to walk.    Good job Mr. President! 

Support free speech!  Unless I don't agree, then it's too dangerous.  

[Lawman]

The only way you fix trust is more government intervention.   Lol
Break, Break
The new cool thing to do is bash Twitter, quit said media platform and then rejoin it when you figure out that no one cares that you quit.  I guess we'll have to censor it.  
Good job.  I'm glad our government is on top of more censorship.  Meanwhile, I just watched another homeless man shit where we're supposed to walk.    Good job Mr. President! 
Support free speech!  Unless I don't agree, then it's too dangerous.  

“Twitter using its power to silence misinformation is ok…. They are a private company entitled to treat the discourse on their platform to what they decide is truthful and fair…”

*person with non liberal slant purchases twitter and even hints at changing the status quo*



Facism!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[SurelySerious]

Regarding Twitter’s duty to protect free speech by Rep Khanna, D-CA
https://www.wsj.com/articles/twitters-duty-to-protect-free-speech-elon-musk-social-media-democracy-new-york-post-ideas-freedom-11670281265

[GrndPndr]

Well, it's time for a new round of Uncle Joe in public...

You know what he's saying, right? - If you have to ask, then you don't know.

[nsplayr]

Signed the legislation that brought all that critical chip manufacturing to the USA though…😎

The CHIPS and Science act is really a good law and I’m glad it got done. Thanks to the 14 Republican Senators who came on in for the big win as well as all 50 Dems obv.

[arg]

3 hours ago, nsplayr said:

Signed the legislation that brought all that critical chip manufacturing to the USA though…😎

The CHIPS and Science act is really a good law and I’m glad it got done. Thanks to the 14 Republican Senators who came on in for the big win as well as all 50 Dems obv.

Ain't got time for the border though.

[ViperMan]

5 hours ago, nsplayr said:

Signed the legislation that brought all that critical chip manufacturing to the USA though…😎

The CHIPS and Science act is really a good law and I’m glad it got done. Thanks to the 14 Republican Senators who came on in for the big win as well as all 50 Dems obv.

Damn right it's good law...GREAT law. $$$ Law.

June: https://www.marketwatch.com/story/nancy-pelosis-husband-buys-millions-worth-of-nvidia-stock-ahead-of-chip-manufacturing-bill-vote-11658179117

August 9th: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CHIPS_and_Science_Act

September 1st: https://www.foxbusiness.com/politics/paul-pelosi-dodged-extra-20-loss-selling-nvidia-stock-july-august-us-restrictions

[Day Man]

38 minutes ago, ViperMan said:

Damn right it's good law...GREAT law. $$$ Law.

June: https://www.marketwatch.com/story/nancy-pelosis-husband-buys-millions-worth-of-nvidia-stock-ahead-of-chip-manufacturing-bill-vote-11658179117

Let's not pretend that both sides of the aisle don't do this.

Besides, Nvidia is up 1.5% since...hardly a scandal (there). Additionally, depending on what calls he exercised, it's very possible he is in the red on that one.

[nsplayr]

I am super in favor of banning Congressional members from trading individual stocks. I’d be happy to see the GOP House pass something to that effect next Congress and I’d encourage Democrats to continue supporting that idea. I won’t hold my breath though! 😅

CHIPS is still really good and I look forward to the US being the world leader in microchip manufacturing in the future. 

[Lawman]

I am super in favor of banning Congressional members from trading individual stocks. I’d be happy to see the GOP House pass something to that effect next Congress and I’d encourage Democrats to continue supporting that idea. I won’t hold my breath though!
CHIPS is still really good and I look forward to the US being the world leader in microchip manufacturing in the future. 

It was passed…. It was also overturned in a bipartisan manner both of which occurred during the Obama admin.




Yeah we’ve been here before bro. So you can stop acting like the GOP is some sort of problem to this.

[Prozac]

1 hour ago, Lawman said:

It was passed…. It was also overturned in a bipartisan manner both of which occurred during the Obama admin.




Yeah we’ve been here before bro. So you can stop acting like the GOP is some sort of problem to this.

Not sure what you’re getting at? Both parties obviously complicit. Is the GOP “some sort of problem to this”?  Yeah. So are the Dems. No surprise that both are acting in their own perceived best interest. 

[pawnman]

15 hours ago, arg said:

Ain't got time for the border though.

And if it had been a border control act, you'd be in here bitching about the money that's going to China. 

Take the win, man. 

[brabus]

In today’s news, Biden trades a prolific arms dealer who conspired to kill Americans for POS Brittney Griner, but leaves another American who’s been in Russian prison for 4 years. What a jackass. 

[arg]

1 hour ago, pawnman said:

And if it had been a border control act, you'd be in here bitching about the money that's going to China. 

Take the win, man. 

I bitched about the money going to China already, but I bitched more about the money coming back and who it’s going to.