The Next President is...

[nsplayr]

2 hours ago, ClearedHot said:

You missed a few:

🤷‍♂️ not really. The ask was for reasons why I support the Biden admin, not what my critiques were. Hell, I even provided a few of those free of charge!

Look, there are tons of conservative opinions around here to choose from in several different flavors...if folks want a thread to confirm their beliefs about how Biden sucks, they've largely come to the right place!

I'm happy to provide a liberal critique of the Biden admin if folks want to hear that, but you have to understand it's going to be milder because A) I disagree with the premise of many conservative critiques and, B) I think the pluses are far outweighing the minusus, which is why I would vote for Biden again in 2024 if he runs or for another mainstream Dem if they run on a similar policy platform.

2 hours ago, ClearedHot said:

Anything to retain power...

There's absolutely no "anything to retain power;" that was the previous guy. I would not, for instance, storm the Capitol building to try to stop the certification of the Presidential vote, and I would strongly condemn any Dem or liberal or whomever who called for anything even approaching that.

If Biden loses in 2024 or decides not to run, so be it. Let's make the best of what's next, whether it's a successor Dem admin or a new GOP one.

2 hours ago, ClearedHot said:

Buttigieg...for reals...

Yep, I like him a lot! I was ready to vote for him in the TN primary last time around and even went to his rally downtown, but he dropped out literally two days before Super Tuesday and endorsed Biden, so I voted for Biden. It was actually incredible and surprising coordinated consolidation around Biden to block Bernie, and overall that made sense to me and earned my primary vote. Klobuchar was my second choice, but she was in the same exact boat as Mayor Pete.

Edited March 31, 2023 by nsplayr

[Prozac]

2 hours ago, ClearedHot said:

Even the Dems are saying this is nonsense, dressing up a misdemeanor (with expired statute of limitations), in yet another witch hunt.  They are creating a martyr. 

Sounds like a very good reason to listen to his lawyers who are undoubtedly telling him to avoid public comment. He just can’t help himself. He may well become a martyr but that will be just as problematic for Republicans as it will for Democrats. 

[Clark Griswold]

We had a good run


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Lord Ratner]

24 minutes ago, Prozac said:

He may well become a martyr but that will be just as problematic for Republicans as it will for Democrats. 

Not for the ones that love him.

 

Thoroughly disappointing for those of us who feel he has gone way too far in his nonsense political maneuvering since losing to undo his rather (and surprisingly) effective policy moves. 

 

But I'm not so sure he wins the primary. Watching the attacks against DeSantis and how awkward it made the audience, he might be running out of whatever weird mojo put him in the oval office.

[dream big]

3 hours ago, Lord Ratner said:

Not for the ones that love him.

 

Thoroughly disappointing for those of us who feel he has gone way too far in his nonsense political maneuvering since losing to undo his rather (and surprisingly) effective policy moves. 

 

But I'm not so sure he wins the primary. Watching the attacks against DeSantis and how awkward it made the audience, he might be running out of whatever weird mojo put him in the oval office.

He’s pretty far ahead in the polls but that could change. It’s hard not to love Nikki Haley. Her intelligence, class, and elegance…yet her ability to throw a punch. Also how cool would it be to rob the woke left of their celebration of the “first female president.” 

[SurelySerious]

He’s pretty far ahead in the polls but that could change. It’s hard not to love Nikki Haley. Her intelligence, class, and elegance…yet her ability to throw a punch. Also how cool would it be to rob the woke left of their celebration of the “first female president.” 

She wouldn’t be a real female president; just a puppet of the patriarchy, clearly.

[WTFAF]

This is all said in jest. The IRA had little to do with inflation and was named by San. Joe Manchin. In exchange for his vote, I would have let him name or whatever he wanted! It is a clean energy and healthcare costs law, and a good one at that IMHO.

Looks like Manchin sees otherwise and probably would have named it something else in hindsight.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/biden-inflation-reduction-act-betrayal-joe-manchin-debt-ceiling-budget-fossil-fuels-green-energy-dc37738e

In case it's behind a paywall, link goes to an opinion piece by Manchin where he says the IRA is "policy and political malpractice." As well as "the administration seems more determined than ever to pervert that law and abuse existing authorities to increase spending."

Some Ds can call a spade a spade.

[FourFans]

1 hour ago, WTFAF said:

Looks like Manchin sees otherwise and probably would have named it something else in hindsight.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/biden-inflation-reduction-act-betrayal-joe-manchin-debt-ceiling-budget-fossil-fuels-green-energy-dc37738e

In case it's behind a paywall, link goes to an opinion piece by Manchin where he says the IRA is "policy and political malpractice." As well as "the administration seems more determined than ever to pervert that law and abuse existing authorities to increase spending."

Some Ds can call a spade a spade.

 

Wait, you mean calling legislation "The Inflation Reduction Act" when it does nothing at all to reduce inflation because it increases the production of money and spending on A LOT of things (like Solar which is useful in, some, places) but decidedly insists on using more money...which has to come from somewhere...

BY DEFINITION, INFLATION: "Monetary inflation is a sustained increase in the money supply of a country"

I ask any liberal poster here: would you run your personal budget the way the liberal agenda supporters want to run our countries?

Edited March 31, 2023 by FourFans

[ClearedHot]

10 hours ago, nsplayr said:

🤷‍♂️ not really.

B) I think the pluses are far outweighing the minusus, which is why I would vote for Biden again in 2024

13 dead Americans at the Abbey Gate...  At least you are in line with SECDEF who has 'No Regrets"

 

[WTFAF]

Wait, you mean calling legislation "The Inflation Reduction Act" when it does nothing at all to reduce inflation because it increases the production of money and spending on A LOT of things...

Unfortunately, it's a very effective strategy when you have an uniformed and ignorant electorate. And a society becoming ever more polarized after digesting headlines, soundbites, and echo chambers of "unbiased" news and information.

The IRA is a huge steaming pile of garbage that even the most ardent Ds should struggle to defend.

[Lord Ratner]

48 minutes ago, WTFAF said:

 

 

Unfortunately, it's a very effective strategy when you have an uniformed and ignorant electorate. And a society becoming ever more polarized after digesting headlines, soundbites, and echo chambers of "unbiased" news and information.

The IRA is a huge steaming pile of garbage that even the most ardent Ds should struggle to defend.

 

Except for the part that incentives nuclear power. That's the one silver lining

[Lord Ratner]

https://www.wsj.com/articles/u-s-considers-asking-black-americans-on-census-if-they-are-slave-descendants-f9b5eb09?mod=hp_lead_pos5

 

I'm not sure there is a "mainstream" Democratic party right now. I think there are (D) voters who believe their party is mainstream, but this is coming from the Biden admin. If Biden isn't a "moderate" Democrat, who is?

 

Reparations for the distant relatives of slaves are about as far-left as you can get.

Edited March 31, 2023 by Lord Ratner

[slc]

14 minutes ago, Lord Ratner said:

Except for the part that incentives nuclear power. That's the one silver lining

Oh and all the EV/solar/energy efficient booolshit cause, well, up here in the Great White North that's real beneficial....lol

[nsplayr]

12 minutes ago, Lord Ratner said:

I'm not sure there is a "mainstream" Democratic party right now. I think there are (D) voters who believe their party is mainstream, but this is coming from the Biden admin. If Biden isn't a "moderate" Democrat, who is?

Whether you believe it or not, people like Joe Biden are the mainstream of the party and have been for a while. More liberal in many ways than in the past, even Clinton 90s past, but parties change and evolve all the time. More conservative in other ways than, say, FDR or LBJ.

The GOP has certainly changed quite a bit in my lifetime, especially in the last ~10 years from Romney/Ryan 2012 to MAGA & Trump today. There’s a very broad swath of ideology between those two camps just within the Republican Party!

There is a large part of the Dem party to the left of Biden, like Bernie et al, and there are some to the right like Manchin, Eric Adams, etc. It also varies by issue and region and there’s not a smooth alignment of ideology or policy along any one axis as I’m sure you know.

You don’t have to like it or agree with current admin policies, but calling Biden a radical is not a winning strategy and not believable to the American public. In fact, it’s such a bad strategy that I really hope all my Republicans friends go for it full bore!

[Lord Ratner]

14 minutes ago, nsplayr said:

Whether you believe it or not, people like Joe Biden are the mainstream of the party and have been for a while. More liberal in many ways than in the past, even Clinton 90s past, but parties change and evolve all the time. More conservative in other ways than, say, FDR or LBJ.

The GOP has certainly changed quite a bit in my lifetime, especially in the last ~10 years from Romney/Ryan 2012 to MAGA & Trump today. There’s a very broad swath of ideology between those two camps just within the Republican Party!

There is a large part of the Dem party to the left of Biden, like Bernie et al, and there are some to the right like Manchin, Eric Adams, etc. It also varies by issue and region and there’s not a smooth alignment of ideology or policy along any one axis as I’m sure you know.

You don’t have to like it or agree with current admin policies, but calling Biden a radical is not a winning strategy and not believable to the American public. In fact, it’s such a bad strategy that I really hope all my Republicans friends go for it full bore!

This is where your ignorance shows. Just because *you* don't know the academic basis for the policies being pushed, you assume they must be reasonable, because you feel like a reasonable person.

 

But reading the works of the people who have been publicly embraced by the mainstream left, such as Biden, give a very different picture. Robin Diangelo. Ibram Kendi. Kimberle Crenshaw. This stuff is bat shit crazy, and will necessitate a civil war if it was actually enacted. Remember when reparations was just a conservative fever dream? 

 

You say the conversations have changed, but they haven't that much. What exactly are they against now that they weren't 30 years ago? Chemical castration for children? Illegal immigration? Reparations? Gun rights? The only difference is that 30 years ago no one was in favor of cutting the tits off a confused teenager. 

 

If the Republicans were inviting David Duke, or the proud boys, or any other right wing lunatic to the White House and espousing their theories to the masses, you would have a point. But they aren't. The difference has always been that the left embraces their lunatics.

 

Saying that Joe Biden is a moderate is meaningless if the people he empowers to enact and develop his policy are radicals. And they are.

 

I have no love for the Republicans in Washington. Just a bunch of assholes there to enrich their families. But they aren't trying to flip over the underpinnings of American society while they do it, so it's immoral, but not dangerous.

 

The people steering the ideological soul of the left today fundamentally disagree with the American system, and their preferred replacement is a time-tested failure. Klobuchar is great, as is Gabbard. Even Ro Khanna (sp?) has reasonable things to say. But they aren't leading the party. 

 

[Biff_T]

1 hour ago, Lord Ratner said:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/u-s-considers-asking-black-americans-on-census-if-they-are-slave-descendants-f9b5eb09?mod=hp_lead_pos5

 

I'm not sure there is a "mainstream" Democratic party right now. I think there are (D) voters who believe their party is mainstream, but this is coming from the Biden admin. If Biden isn't a "moderate" Democrat, who is?

 

Reparations for the distant relatives of slaves are about as far-left as you can get.

If they give out reparations, where will all of those billions of dollars come from?   My guess is from nowhere.  Imagine the inflation that might occur if you give out billions of dollars to citizens for nothing.   

Slavery sucks.  But so does depleting your country's budget for something that nobody alive experienced.  Just like I didn't experience the Irish potato famine in the 1800s.  It sucked for my family to leave their homeland because they were starving.  Once again, do I get any reparations from England?   What about the vikings who invaded Ireland and had their way with those beautiful Irish women.  Can I sue them?  It was about  1000 years ago but I'm still mad.  I hate having 5% Norwegian blood diluting my Irish Ancestry.  

There will be no logical plan.  Just more idiots giving out money that we don't have.  

This will be the nail in the coffin for race relations in the U.S.  

[nsplayr]

1 hour ago, Lord Ratner said:

This is where your ignorance shows.

I'm not ignorant about Democratic Party politics or policy, I'm not sure why you would believe that.

1 hour ago, Lord Ratner said:

But reading the works of the people who have been publicly embraced by the mainstream left, such as Biden, give a very different picture. Robin Diangelo. Ibram Kendi. Kimberle Crenshaw. This stuff is bat shit crazy, and will necessitate a civil war if it was actually enacted. Remember when reparations was just a conservative fever dream? 

There is some batshit crazy stuff on the left, yep, congrats on identifying that! I will again point out that the only people talking about (wishcasting?) a civil war are those on the right. WTF is with y'all and all this civil war talk, seriously? I'd like our country to continue on for many more prosperous, harmonious years as a multi-party, multi-racial capitalist democracy that's the leader of the free world - feel free to join me in that.

DiAngelo sucks and I strongly dislike her entire worldview. Kendi is a somewhat radical academic, but hey, it's a free country. Have you read any of his work? I can see from his point of view why he believes what he believes, even if I don't necessarily agree. Same with Crenshaw, although I'm even less familiar with her or her work. I don't find any of the above have a particularly strong influence over Joe Biden or even a connection in almost any way to his administration.

I promise you that conservatives think about and worry about things like CRT 1,000x more than your average normie Democratic voter does. I don't particularly think about or care about that stuff at all. Economic growth, national defense, clean energy transition, healthcare costs & effectiveness...those are the big drivers for my vote.

1 hour ago, Lord Ratner said:

If the Republicans were inviting David Duke, or the proud boys, or any other right wing lunatic to the White House and espousing their theories to the masses, you would have a point. But they aren't.

How sure of this statement are you? And I'm not even including people like Steve Bannon or Sebastian Gorka, who have both said some absolutely batshit crazy stuff and affiliate frequently with the most far-right radicals out there. They both were appointed to very high-level White House positions in the Trump admin.

Look, I'm willing to agree in general that Trump isn't necessarily responsible for or in agreement with everyone crazy right-wing person, but I think it's fair to say the same for Biden and every person on the left you hate. Is that not fair?

1 hour ago, Lord Ratner said:

Klobuchar is great...Even Ro Khanna (sp?) has reasonable things to say. But they aren't leading the party. 

Amy Klobuchar is a close ally of Biden and his administration, and somewhat famously dropped out of the 2020 Presidential primary and endorsed Biden as a way to consolidate mainstream Dem support behind him and to block Bernie from winning. If you like her and her policies, there's really no reason why you should think Biden and his admin are the devil. She spoke at his inauguration!

Ro Khanna is very progressive, more than me by far, and was a big Bernie endorser in 2020...I'm surprised you like him and then also think Biden is super radical left or whatever. BL: you seem to have some very interesting political views!

Edited March 31, 2023 by nsplayr

[BashiChuni]

3 hours ago, nsplayr said:

 calling Biden a radical is not a winning strategy and not believable to the American public. In fact, it’s such a bad strategy that I really hope all my Republicans friends go for it full bore!

kind of like Biden using "extremist MAGA republicans"

funny how that works

[nsplayr]

35 minutes ago, BashiChuni said:

kind of like Biden using "extremist MAGA republicans"

funny how that works

Yet many “extremists MAGA republicans” lost winnable senate and House races in the midterms. Seems like it was more believable in that direction this time around!

The same line that doesn’t have any impact on Susan Collins works pretty well against Hershel Walker for instance.

Calling Biden an extremist won’t work and it’s not the best line of attack Republicans could use against him. But by all means…please try if you’re ok with losing again.

[uhhello]

3 hours ago, Biff_T said:

If they give out reparations, where will all of those billions of dollars come from?   My guess is from nowhere.  Imagine the inflation that might occur if you give out billions of dollars to citizens for nothing.   

Slavery sucks.  But so does depleting your country's budget for something that nobody alive experienced.  Just like I didn't experience the Irish potato famine in the 1800s.  It sucked for my family to leave their homeland because they were starving.  Once again, do I get any reparations from England?   What about the vikings who invaded Ireland and had their way with those beautiful Irish women.  Can I sue them?  It was about  1000 years ago but I'm still mad.  I hate having 5% Norwegian blood diluting my Irish Ancestry.  

There will be no logical plan.  Just more idiots giving out money that we don't have.  

This will be the nail in the coffin for race relations in the U.S.  

It's already falling apart.  They are going to tear their cities apart throughout this process.  The leaders and task forces got everyone whipped up into a frenzy thinking they are getting millions and now they are saying it's going to go to city programs targeting their communities.  

[Biff_T]

I'd be ok with reparations if they only taxed the people who are ok with paying for it themselves.   They can even ask, Politicians,  Hollywood and professional athletes to contribute.  I have zero guilt paying nothing out of my pocket for this.   

Life sucks for some people more than others.  

[HeloDude]

2 hours ago, nsplayr said:

Yet many “extremists MAGA republicans” lost winnable senate and House races in the midterms. Seems like it was more believable in that direction this time around!

The same line that doesn’t have any impact on Susan Collins works pretty well against Hershel Walker for instance.

Calling Biden an extremist won’t work and it’s not the best line of attack Republicans could use against him. But by all means…please try if you’re ok with losing again.

Are there any Democrats in the House or Senate who you would label an “extremist”, and if so, who are they?

[filthy_liar]

nsplayer I think Rat made a pertinent point in his post, probably not his main point, but a good one - Republicans aren't championing the Proud Boys and whatever other loons claim to be "conservatives/right/republicans.  Democrats are championing Antifa rioting, white priveledge, "white men need to be dealt with," Black Lives Matter, the people who can't understand the biology of gender, etc.  Democrats are championing that crazy ass shit.  That's the difference.  And its driving a wedge.  If you came at me with an argument about abortion, gun control, or climate change, I'd engage.  But for whatever reason in the past 5 years the Democrats have wholesale endorsed the craziest shit that their people at the wildest margins could dream up.

To be completely fair, Republicans have fucked up politically so bad since the age I could vote, its embarrasing.  That aside, they aren't championing the marginal "wing" positions.  The Democrats definitely are.

[ClearedHot]

After months of dragging their feet the Treasury Department FINALLY gave the House Oversight Committee access to suspicious activity reports generated by the department on transaction within the Biden family.  It has come to light that SIX additional Biden family members were paid many millions of dollars by Chinese and Russian firms.

 

[tac airlifter]

10 hours ago, ClearedHot said:

After months of dragging their feet the Treasury Department FINALLY gave the House Oversight Committee access to suspicious activity reports generated by the department on transaction within the Biden family.  It has come to light that SIX additional Biden family members were paid many millions of dollars by Chinese and Russian firms.

 

Of note, President Biden literally shares a bank account with his crackhead son.  The corruption of the Biden crime family is better documented than any of the accusations thrown at Trump.  It is plain as day to anyone with eyes exactly why he is soft on China.