The Next President is...

[FLEA]

47 minutes ago, Prozac said:

You miss the point. He doesn’t represent you or your values. He only plays at it because that’s what you and so many others wanted to hear.
 

Like it or not, “the establishment” is a framework of necessary evils we get to work within. I don’t care much for it either, but the “establishment” in the United States currently beats all the other options out there. Even a president isn’t going to burn it all down in one or two terms and the idea that one might is the ultimate fools errand. Like it or not, burning the “establishment” down puts our country in a much shittier position than it’s currently in. 

Er.... Noone on Capital hill represents anyone here's values. Lol, they represent themselves. If you think otherwise you are as naive as anyone else. The "establishment" isn't designed for people like you Prozac. It is designed to reciprocate a mechanism of power to benefit certain individuals above all others. 

Edited December 18, 2022 by FLEA

[dream big]

18 hours ago, O Face said:

I agree but, more than likely, Trump will not win the GOP primary over DeSantis and will then run as a 3rd party candidate and will bring enough votes with him to ensure a Biden (or whoever) victory. Trump certainly isn’t capable of just quietly walking away. 

I don’t think Republicans will just let Trump run as a 3rd Party. They will make whatever deal they would have to. That would be a real shitty situation. Another reason we should have rank/preferential voting instead of winner takes all. 

[uhhello]

11 hours ago, arg said:

Quoting myself for uhhello. Not sure how you can laugh at that. You like the establishment? If you do then please defend it. There are some old timers on this board that have seen the establishment/deep state first hand while working at the five sided building.

I laughed because I'm wondering what "establishment" he got rid of?  It seems like he just brought his own version of people doing the same things under his admin.  I was all for him and the potential shakeup/change he was going to bring.  

[arg]

3 hours ago, uhhello said:

I laughed because I'm wondering what "establishment" he got rid of?  It seems like he just brought his own version of people doing the same things under his admin.  I was all for him and the potential shakeup/change he was going to bring.  

I don't know of any right off hand. Seemed like he was trying. He did shake things up though.

[Smokin]

One look at our current military leadership, both on the AD and the guard, show that any attempt to "drain the swamp" was either never attempted or was a complete failure.

[Sim]

Step one to drain the swamp - let them identify themselves. 

Unless you watch legacy media only - last 6 years should have shown plenty of swamp to drain. 

 

[SurelySerious]

5 hours ago, uhhello said:

I laughed because I'm wondering what "establishment" he got rid of?  It seems like he just brought his own version of people doing the same things under his admin.  I was all for him and the potential shakeup/change he was going to bring.  

He was trying to make the change from swamp to outright nepotism. 

[Blue]

On 12/17/2022 at 8:20 PM, arg said:

And that's why I voted for him twice. The establishment needs to get gone.

 

On 12/18/2022 at 12:00 AM, Prozac said:

Like it or not, “the establishment” is a framework of necessary evils we get to work within. I don’t care much for it either, but the “establishment” in the United States currently beats all the other options out there.

I think for most on this board, "the establishment" has been a relatively decent deal.  Decent pay, benefits, retirement, etc.

There is an entire subsection of this country that has been more or less run over by the "establishment" over the past 30 years.  Humans, on the whole, are good at sensing what's fair and what's not.  And people have seen decades now of unfair behavior; of all the money and wealth flowing up, and nothing but poverty and pain coming down.  Trump was able to tap into that demographic.  Believe it or not, Bernie did something similar, albeit from a different angle (money and social programs for all!!!!).  The DNC was able to shut down Bernie, but the RNC didn't (or couldn't) stop Trump.  Combine all that with the competition being the most establishment candidate out there in Hillary Clinton, and that's how you ended up with Trump in the Oval Office.

16 hours ago, arg said:

I don't know of any right off hand. Seemed like he was trying. He did shake things up though.

Trump wanted to portray himself as slaying all the swamp demons.  I have no doubt that, behind closed doors, he was beholden to the age-old Golden Rule as every other politician (as in, those who have the gold, make the rules).  This blogger does a decent job of pointing out some of the promises that evaporated as soon as he was elected.  Particularly how Trump's campaign website had three distinct bullet points about promises to eliminate medical monopolies, that were subsequently deleted within 15 minutes of the election being called for him in 2016.

Realistically though, he was in many ways over-powered by the swamp.  He reportedly explored firing Dr. Fauci as our Covid response floundered, only to find that even as President, he didn't have the power to unilaterally remove him.

In his final days in office, he put forth an order to create a new job category for civil service (Schedule F) which would include all govt employees who were in "policy related" positions.  Employees in these position would be able to be removed at the whim of the President.  Critics decried it as something to be abused by the Executive Branch, and described a scenario of the the federal bureaucracy being packed with the President's patronage hires after every election, which granted, the power was there.  More importantly though, Schedule F would give the executive branch some level of a check on the obscene level of power held by unelected bureaucrats.  Your average swamp creature leans left, and we're at this strange point in our history where we have this bizarre, hugely powerful, yet unelected administrative state.  

Schedule F got slow-rolled, and then quickly cancelled when Biden took office.  It continues to be brought up in the press as something that would be "The End of Days" for American Civil Service, threatening national security, Mom's apple pie, and all kinds of other things.  I hope it gains traction again at some point in the future.

Edited December 19, 2022 by Blue

[ClearedHot]

The serial liar that is Joe Biden is now being called out by the Australian press and this lie is a whopper.  In a heart strings pulling story he claims to have personally awarded his uncle the Purple Heart while he was the Vice President.  Only one problem, it never happened, his uncle died NINE years before Biden was elected VP.  Standing by for "whataboutism", it's "Trump's fault" and other excuses from the left.  Of all things to lie about, what a douche canoe.

 

 

[brabus]

I have to wonder how much of things like this are weighted towards he’s a lying POS and weighted towards his mental deterioration/constant level of confusion. Obviously neither is a good thing for a president. 

[tac airlifter]

32 minutes ago, brabus said:

I have to wonder how much of things like this are weighted towards he’s a lying POS and weighted towards his mental deterioration/constant level of confusion. Obviously neither is a good thing for a president. 

[Biff_T]

3 hours ago, ClearedHot said:

The serial liar that is Joe Biden is now being called out by the Australian press and this lie is a whopper.  In a heart strings pulling story he claims to have personally awarded his uncle the Purple Heart while he was the Vice President.  Only one problem, it never happened, his uncle died NINE years before Biden was elected VP.  Standing by for "whataboutism", it's "Trump's fault" and other excuses from the left.  Of all things to lie about, what a douche canoe.

 

 

[dream big]

16 hours ago, ClearedHot said:

The serial liar that is Joe Biden is now being called out by the Australian press and this lie is a whopper.  In a heart strings pulling story he claims to have personally awarded his uncle the Purple Heart while he was the Vice President.  Only one problem, it never happened, his uncle died NINE years before Biden was elected VP.  Standing by for "whataboutism", it's "Trump's fault" and other excuses from the left.  Of all things to lie about, what a douche canoe.

 

 

He is senile and has been showing signs of dementia. Making up false memories is one of the symptoms of dementia. While he always was, and will always be a douche, shame on his handlers for stringing and dragging him along. This is elder abuse plain and simple. He should have resigned years ago. 

Edited December 20, 2022 by dream big

[lloyd christmas]

There are numerous documented examples of him outright lying or making up stories going back decades.  I’m not surprised by this latest story.  

[TreeA10]

But the spoke-persons for the democrat party, i.e. the media, will never call Brandon on his outright lies. Trump's bullshit statements were breathlessly reported and repeated 24/7 along with comments regarding suitability for the office. But Mr. Top in his law class, 3 degrees, plagerized speeches, stormed the beaches of Normandy, and inventor of the semi-colon gets a free pass. 

[filthy_liar]

Can we stand back and look at this.  I'm not sitting here happy that Biden is president.  I'm also not sitting here happy that Trump was the president before Biden.  WTF is going on?  The best the conservatives could do the last election before Biden was to put the most ridiculous clown into office.  Drain the swamp.  Liked his policies that actually made it through, hated everything else about Trump.  Did he drain the swamp?  No he did not.  Put a bunch of his relatives into office - yes.  Did he fix healthcare?  No.  Immigration?  No. Lowered my taxes - yes.  So there's that.  And didn't get us into anymore "wars."  But he is a toxic unpredictable mess that is only interested in cajoling other humans to make money.  Really RNC?  That's what you had to offer?  You gave us someone who was predictably a one term president.  Thanks.

Then to react to that atrocity that was Trump we put someone up there that is a grandpa that you need to be several dates in before you intro him to your girlfriend, because....he has tendencies.  And he's very likely senile.  I don't agree with his policies, but I'm not going to knock the party for that.  He's a ed up mess who can't articulate effectively.  Not a personal attack, but he's ed up.  As was Trump.

WTF is going on here?  We have had on display for at least the last 2 election cycles some of the worst Americans that I could nominate to run the country.  There is something going on.  Why can we not get a sane, stable, predictable human being through the primaries on both sides anymore?  I think most people on this forum could.  But as a nation we don't.  Everyone I talk to that is non military thinks about the same.  They might be a democrat, they might be a conservative.  But to a man and woman they all agree that Trump and Biden were not good choices.  So why are they ending up on the general election ticket?

This is why election fraud is getting the attraction that it is enjoying.  I don't believe there is fraud enough to overturn an election.  I could be dead wrong, but I haven't seen the evidence.  So if its not election fraud, what is it?  Who is being represented in the elections?  Its not me.  At the local level, the person that is sitting in the seat makes sense to me.  Here are their credentials, here is their background, here is why they are sitting there.  Even if its a democrat, I can explain to anyone that asks how they got there.  I can't explain this at the national level.  I hang out with a truckload of conservatives.  Every one of us says Trump should never made it into office.  Always did.  How did he take our party?  And why is the RNC allowing it to continue? There is a huge WTF going on.

Edited December 21, 2022 by filthy_liar

[lloyd christmas]

2 hours ago, filthy_liar said:

I don't believe there is fraud enough to overturn an election.  I could be dead wrong, but I haven't seen the evidence.  So if its not election fraud, what is it?  

The definition of election fraud has changed.  Pay close attention to what Elon Musk is exposing.  

The truth always come out.  

[guineapigfury]

4 hours ago, filthy_liar said:

Can we stand back and look at this.  I'm not sitting here happy that Biden is president.  I'm also not sitting here happy that Trump was the president before Biden.  WTF is going on?  The best the conservatives could do the last election before Biden was to put the most ridiculous clown into office.  Drain the swamp.  Liked his policies that actually made it through, hated everything else about Trump.  Did he drain the swamp?  No he did not.  Put a bunch of his relatives into office - yes.  Did he fix healthcare?  No.  Immigration?  No. Lowered my taxes - yes.  So there's that.  And didn't get us into anymore "wars."  But he is a toxic unpredictable mess that is only interested in cajoling other humans to make money.  Really RNC?  That's what you had to offer?  You gave us someone who was predictably a one term president.  Thanks.

...

The reality is the RNC and Republican establishment does not have the pull to pick a candidate.  It was screamingly obvious they wanted someone, anyone else but Trump in 2016.  He consistently got around 35-45% in the competitive primaries.  If the "establishment" had the power to force candidates out of primaries, they would have done so, allowing one of the more traditional candidates to consolidate the remaining 55-65% of the primary vote.  Instead, multiple candidates stayed in the race and split the vote allowing Trump to win.  Additionally, the previous GOP President left office with horrific approval ratings and does not have any pull with the party, unlike Obama for the Democrats.  If W had called Rubio and Kasich and 2016 to tell them to get out of the race so Cruz could consolidate support (like Obama did to Mayor Pete and Klobuchar after Biden won SC in 2020), I suspect they would have laughed at him.

Edited December 21, 2022 by guineapigfury

[dream big]

6 hours ago, filthy_liar said:

Can we stand back and look at this.  I'm not sitting here happy that Biden is president.  I'm also not sitting here happy that Trump was the president before Biden.  WTF is going on?  The best the conservatives could do the last election before Biden was to put the most ridiculous clown into office.  Drain the swamp.  Liked his policies that actually made it through, hated everything else about Trump.  Did he drain the swamp?  No he did not.  Put a bunch of his relatives into office - yes.  Did he fix healthcare?  No.  Immigration?  No. Lowered my taxes - yes.  So there's that.  And didn't get us into anymore "wars."  But he is a toxic unpredictable mess that is only interested in cajoling other humans to make money.  Really RNC?  That's what you had to offer?  You gave us someone who was predictably a one term president.  Thanks.

Then to react to that atrocity that was Trump we put someone up there that is a grandpa that you need to be several dates in before you intro him to your girlfriend, because....he has tendencies.  And he's very likely senile.  I don't agree with his policies, but I'm not going to knock the party for that.  He's a ed up mess who can't articulate effectively.  Not a personal attack, but he's ed up.  As was Trump.

WTF is going on here?  We have had on display for at least the last 2 election cycles some of the worst Americans that I could nominate to run the country.  There is something going on.  Why can we not get a sane, stable, predictable human being through the primaries on both sides anymore?  I think most people on this forum could.  But as a nation we don't.  Everyone I talk to that is non military thinks about the same.  They might be a democrat, they might be a conservative.  But to a man and woman they all agree that Trump and Biden were not good choices.  So why are they ending up on the general election ticket?

This is why election fraud is getting the attraction that it is enjoying.  I don't believe there is fraud enough to overturn an election.  I could be dead wrong, but I haven't seen the evidence.  So if its not election fraud, what is it?  Who is being represented in the elections?  Its not me.  At the local level, the person that is sitting in the seat makes sense to me.  Here are their credentials, here is their background, here is why they are sitting there.  Even if its a democrat, I can explain to anyone that asks how they got there.  I can't explain this at the national level.  I hang out with a truckload of conservatives.  Every one of us says Trump should never made it into office.  Always did.  How did he take our party?  And why is the RNC allowing it to continue? There is a huge WTF going on.

Thank you for making the case of having a limited government, and a constitution that limits the power of elected officials..almost like our founding fathers intended. 
 

The RNC didn’t chose Trump, Trump chose the RNC. Trump was a reaction to years of condescending and elitist behavior from Obama and his like who only cared about costal metropolises and Chicago. Most Americans want a government that leaves them the hell alone and protects/values American ideals. Trump spoke to that crowd. But yes, time for him to go, way too toxic. A DeSantis or Haley ticket would revive the Republicans. 

[arg]

10 hours ago, guineapigfury said:

  If the "establishment" had the power to force candidates out of primaries, they would have done so, allowing one of the more traditional candidates..... 

I'm not sure, but I think they do. Let me check with Bernie real quick.

[brabus]

1 hour ago, arg said:

I'm not sure, but I think they do. Let me check with Bernie real quick.

Or tulsi for that matter. Though I think he was specifically referring to the GOP establishment, who did showcase an inability to stop trump in the 2016 primaries. 

[Lawman]

Or tulsi for that matter. Though I think he was specifically referring to the GOP establishment, who did showcase an inability to stop trump in the 2016 primaries. 

Trump was receiving a good deal of attention as part of a coordinated plan by Clinton surrogates to weaken and deplete the Jeb Bush war chest.

Trump’s campaign was largely on life support when it got a sudden infusion right before the primaries. There’s a series of political reports from her staffers talking about the original design of the campaign to face Bush and later Rubio. Then they just could not adapt to face the thing they helped to create in a populist Trump campaign.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[arg]

2 hours ago, brabus said:

Or tulsi for that matter. Though I think he was specifically referring to the GOP establishment, who did showcase an inability to stop trump in the 2016 primaries. 

They're the same.

[brabus]

2 hours ago, arg said:

They're the same.

No, the dem establishment is significantly outcompeting the GOP establishment. All self-centered POS, sure, but the GOP is epically failing at the game relative to the dems.

[arg]

2 hours ago, brabus said:

No, the dem establishment is significantly outcompeting the GOP establishment. All self-centered POS, sure, but the GOP is epically failing at the game relative to the dems.

I agree with you there. I'm pointing out both are members of the deep state/swamp/establishment. Is this anything new? No. I believe we can thank the interwebs for more news/info coming out to the general public nowadays.