Goldfein advocating FAA 1500 hour rule change???

[189Herk]

Does anyone else feel stabbed in the back by this?  

Instead of fixing the problems that make people want to get out, he wants to make it harder for his pilots to get hired by the airlines?

What a low blow...or am I reading this wrong?

[BashiChuni]

that's how i take it too..."hey we can't fix our root problems so let's flood the hiring pool with civilian pilots so our guys have less opportunity to jump ship"

 

[Gazmo]

This is not going to slow anything down. Most of us have 1,500+ PIC and then some. I know a bunch of SQ mates practically beating major airlines off with a stick, getting multiple interview opportunities with multiple legacy airlines.

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[BADFNZ]

52 minutes ago, Gazmo said:

This is not going to slow anything down. Most of us have 1,500+ PIC and then some. I know a bunch of SQ mates practically beating major airlines off with a stick, getting multiple interview opportunities with multiple legacy airlines.

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I think you're missing the point.

The current requirement is 1500 hours TT for any airline including regionals.  If you lower that requirement, you're basically opening up the hiring pool to more off the street types that didn't have the luxury of logging monthly pond crossings or 8 hour orbits over Afghanistan.

Edited February 8, 2017 by BADFNZ

[flyusaf83]

5 minutes ago, BADFNZ said:

I think you're missing the point.

The current requirement is 1500 hours TT for any airline including regionals.  If you lower that requirement, you're basically opening up the hiring pool to more off the street types that didn't have the luxury of logging monthly pond crossings or 8 hour orbits over Afghanistan.

Still would have minimal effect on AF pilots IMO.  It would be easier for civilians to get hired on by regionals, but legacy carriers are hiring at well above the 1,500 hour requirement anyway (closer to 2,000 - 2,500).  Most military guys aren't flying for regionals after getting out, so they aren't directly competing with low-time civilians.

You could argue that this will make it easier for civilians to build time at regionals since they'll be able to get hired at a regional faster. However, they will still need to be there for a long time to start logging PIC time.

[Guest]

I think leadership is attempting to ride out the hiring boom or hope for some congressional relief akin to OP above. I think when leadership look at all the administrative red tape and political capital needed to undo no value additional duties, 365s and AFIs some tied to higher civil/DoD regulations, a congress who believes there is not a problem or don't really care (insert measly bonus increase to select flyers), weighted against that picture why should they (AF leadership) fall on their sword for a fight already lost (we just cut 25K)

No one is going to listen to them until we are in a terrible spot (all the talk about lack of readiness will fall on deaf ears)  or need to fight a war where we come up crazy short (and powers that be don't think we are there yet).

 

keep your apps updated, get your prep early and often, keep in contact with your bros, get your recs, then interview, get a line number and pay it back because if you are within a few to six years of your ADSC now is the time to bounce. Barring some black swan get ready to be treated like a rockstar and be ear deep in more options, higher QOL and ¥$€£

Ref: United retirement peaks at 740 in 2028 does not take into account early and medical retirements, the other big ladies are equally shouting your name out!

 

Edited February 8, 2017 by Guest

[xaarman]

I firmly believe leadership doesn't believe the ops tempo, 365s, additional duties or anything else is a problem, we just need more people. If we had enough people to do <1 deployment a year, maybe one additional duty and not everyone got 179/365s regularly, there would be no problem. 

That being said, trying to lower the barriers for entrance in the civilian world so you stop bleeding people... what a backwards way of thinking. 

 

 

Edited February 8, 2017 by xaarman

[HerkFE]

Why TF would the FAA give two shits about this?  

FAA:  Why should we do this?

Goldfein:  All of my people are leaving for a better QOL.

FAA:  Your concern is noted. 

[SocialD]

19 minutes ago, HerkFE said:

Why TF would the FAA give two shits about this?  

FAA:  Why should we do this?

Goldfein:  All of my people are leaving for a better QOL.

FAA:  Your concern is noted.   Why don't you get your shit in order before you come begging us to unfuck your house...

FIFY.

If they think it's bad now, I'm sure they're really scared about what it will look like in a few years.  In 2020 Delta starts retiring 500+/year, and doesn't drop below that number until after 2030.  Five of those years are 700+.  Thats 51% of the current seniority list in 10 years...not accounting for early outs.  I'm sure UAL/AALs numbers will follow closely.  

[Vetter]

Here are American's retirements for the next 20 years.  Nothing to see here...move along.  

2017 409  
2018 545  
2019 656  
2020 782  
2021 853  
2022 874  
2023 960  
2024 932  
2025 956  
2026 903  
2027 771  
2028 668  
2029 634  
2030 549  
2031 568  
2032 493  
2033 465  
2034 390  
2035 324  
2036 248  
2037 195  
 

[snoopyeast]

I laugh quite a bit every time I hear AF "pilot shortage".  There is no shortage of pilots wanting to fly planes in the AF.  There's a shortage of the AF placing those pilots in jobs that allow them to be pilots, and to teach other pilots.  There's plenty of bag wearers sitting at group level positions, in staff jobs, at IDE, etc staring at a computer screen.  I've flown less than 200 hours a year the last 3 years as an experienced MWS instructor because the AF values keeping the self fellating bureaucratic process running more that it values flight experience.  Senior Capts and junior majors are begging to be 'allowed' to get back to teaching the young pilots, only to be told that they're more valued behind a desk.  No thanks, see ya, welcome aboard Delta 4962, non stop to Chicago.

Edited February 8, 2017 by snoopyeast

[Prozac]

Agree with snoopy.  When I was competing for a pilot slot I thought there could be no more rewarding job in the world than being an Air Force pilot.  I was not alone in this opinion.  12 years later I was exhausted, fed up, and burned out.  If Big Blue can't figure out how to make this job rewarding enough to keep people around, I have little sympathy. 

[HossHarris]

The Air Force could make a blow job terrible. 

 

[Hopefulflyer389]

1 hour ago, HossHarris said:

The Air Force could make a blow job terrible. 

 

Worth framing..

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 8, 2017 by Hopefulflyer389

[zmoney]

Reading the article, I got the sense that the CSAF wants to reduce my ability to find civilian airline employment. 

[Gazmo]

Every single dude in my ANG unit who has applied to a major airline in the past 2 years has been hired. I'm talking 12+ people. United, Delta, JB, FedEx, SWA... you name them, they've been hired. This is with American pretty much not even hiring many OTS yet (they're starting to ramp up now). Just had two dudes get vid interview invites from AA a few weeks ago. Even if they lower the ATP to 750, the majors would much rather hire at the 3,000+ hour level. The average hours for someone getting hired at a major is somewhere near 4,000.

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[ARAMP1]

6 hours ago, snoopyeast said:

I laugh quite a bit every time I hear AF "pilot shortage".  There is no shortage of pilots wanting to fly planes in the AF.  There's a shortage of the AF placing those pilots in jobs that allow them to be pilots, and to teach other pilots.  

 

So true.  Plus the gross mis-management of personnel.  I doubt AFPC could find their own ass with both hands.  Hell, I was offered the VSP to leave and the bonus to stay in within 8 months of each other.  

[BashiChuni]

30 minutes ago, ARAMP1 said:

 Hell, I was offered the VSP to leave and the bonus to stay in within 8 months of each other.  

now that is hilarious

[Homestar]

7 hours ago, snoopyeast said:

I laugh quite a bit every time I hear AF "pilot shortage".  There is no shortage of pilots wanting to fly planes in the AF.  There's a shortage of the AF placing those pilots in jobs that allow them to be pilots, and to teach other pilots.  There's plenty of bag wearers sitting at group level positions, in staff jobs, at IDE, etc staring at a computer screen.  I've flown less than 200 hours a year the last 3 years as an experienced MWS instructor because the AF values keeping the self fellating bureaucratic process running more that it values flight experience.  Senior Capts and junior majors are begging to be 'allowed' to get back to teaching the young pilots, only to be told that they're more valued behind a desk.  No thanks, see ya, welcome aboard Delta 4962, non stop to Chicago.

All true.  But changing the entire enterprise simply isn't feasible anymore, if it ever was.  Regardless, I doubt the AF would change to a "pilots fly" model even if they could.  It's where the generals come from, for better or worse.

[Snooter]

6 hours ago, HossHarris said:

The Air Force could make a blow job terrible. 

 

I'm pretty sure there's an AFMAN for that...

[ThreeHoler]

Rumint says Fingers has pissed off ALPA.


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[pawnman]

11 hours ago, HossHarris said:

The Air Force could make a blow job terrible. 

 

Relevant Terminal Lance.

[ViperStud]

I'm kinda looking forward to seeing video of Goldfein suggesting this to congress. They laughed at the requested bonus hike and told the AF to get its shit out of the street. Now he wants to change a rule born from the Colgan mishap in a sad attempt to make it harder for mil pilots to have options?

 

Meet the new boss, same as the old boss. 

[08Dawg]

I get the sense all this would really do is knock the mins to be a regional FO back down to the 250-500 range and make it easier for all the poor kids coming out of ATP with $100K+ in debt to get a job.  And since nobody I know has done anything but go straight to the right seat at Delta, American or United....nothing to see here, move along. 

[HAWDINGL]

Does anyone else feel stabbed in the back by this?  
Instead of fixing the problems that make people want to get out, he wants to make it harder for his pilots to get hired by the airlines?
What a low blow...or am I reading this wrong?

I tried googling this and couldn't find anything. Anyone have a source on this?


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