Goldfein advocating FAA 1500 hour rule change???

[Sprkt69]

  On 3/1/2017 at 3:30 AM, Guardian said:

Tami-21. Solved all of the generals problems. Maybe we should have a Tami-22. What do you think that would look like?


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Is that where they force everyone with a DD-214 back to active serve?

[tac airlifter]

  On 3/1/2017 at 3:30 AM, Guardian said:

Tami-21. Solved all of the generals problems. Maybe we should have a Tami-22. What do you think that would look like?


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Man, in retrospect the juice was really not worth the squeeze on that one.  I wonder if the idiot who thought of TAMI21 understands how much long term chaos was wrought for such short term gain.  

[pawnman]

  On 3/1/2017 at 3:30 AM, Guardian said:

Tami-21. Solved all of the generals problems. Maybe we should have a Tami-22. What do you think that would look like?


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Sending a bunch of people to fly fighters against their will?

[RTB]

  On 3/1/2017 at 10:55 AM, tac airlifter said:

Man, in retrospect the juice was really not worth the squeeze on that one.  I wonder if the idiot who thought of TAMI21 understands how much long term chaos was wrought for such short term gain.  

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Understands??  Hell no!  He's a GENIUS in his own eyes!  He's still riding the wave of his BPZ as a result of the fact that he "Saved the AF $4.3 Billion Dollars..."

[Swizzle]

  On 2/28/2017 at 7:23 PM, Azimuth said:

https://www.military.com/daily-news/2017/02/28/impending-pilot-shortage-a-developing-national-crisis.html

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All talk and little action occuring, albiet risky, inappropriate action to ease the shortage I've heard of (ex. wash forward UPT studs, undue prof-advance pressure, and push studs through crap training expeditiously)

Do, now, personnel managers/leaders feel the pinch? Are they motivated?

What is the agency cost of a poorly trained and wrong-ORM-balanced aircrew pool? Are bonuses or other changes in USAF status quo worth the very real costs of poor manning management (mishaps, attrition and it's paired new-guy training burden)? Where do the black and red lines of this situation cross? Has anyone tracked these strategic ideas (not just aircrew personnel total chasing)? How bad does it need to be before the entire Gov't beauracracy recognizes, confirms, and recovers? A National Security Crisis confirmed? Will the National "purse" open up? It will cost and our purse will open up in some form or fashion, that's undeniable; whether it be via new training costs or mishap costs or bonuses or increases to USAF quality of life costs. Why stagnate and exacerbate the known problem?

Senior leaders  (ACC, AMC) are writing about it publicly, but perhaps the pot hasn't boiled over yet; or maybe it has and they don't want to admit to "Mom" how bad it is (ex. Finalized Rated retention reports published FY15, FY16?) So...

https://access.afpc.af.mil/vbinDMZ/broker.exe?_program=DEMOGPUB.static_reports.sas&_service=pZ1pub1

 ....when are they going to address the core grievances to fix the issue? OODA, gentlemen. I'd love to here where they think they are in this OODA loop, and how fast they're reevaluating/adapting? How well are they convincing the bureaucracy for change? And is it working at all levels needed? Is dialog with industry having the affect they desire? Written articles on the subject fixing it? If not, re-enter the loop...or find the heart of the matter by listening to your people and addressing their core grievances. 

[Stitch]

  On 3/1/2017 at 4:10 AM, Sprkt69 said:

Is that where they force everyone with a DD-214 back to active serve?

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British Royal Navy seriously looking at that option to man their new "Big Deck" Queen Elizabeth class carriers. They too gutted their force for the quick and easy cost savings and its now coming back to bite them in the ass.  Imagine being in your late 50s and getting called back... Holy Cow...  

Link: https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/766183/Royal-Navy-plug-staff-shortage-urgent-plea-ex-sailors

 

[pawnman]

  On 3/1/2017 at 9:40 PM, Stitch said:

British Royal Navy seriously looking at that option to man their new "Big Deck" Queen Elizabeth class carriers. They too gutted their force for the quick and easy cost savings and its now coming back to bite them in the ass.  Imagine being in your late 50s and getting called back... Holy Cow...  

Link: https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/766183/Royal-Navy-plug-staff-shortage-urgent-plea-ex-sailors

 

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I might find a way to be DNIF at my flight physical if that happened.

[Jaded]

  On 3/2/2017 at 2:21 AM, pawnman said:

I might find a way to be DNIF at my flight physical if that happened.

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By being honest to the flight doc for the first time ever? 

[BADFNZ]

  On 3/2/2017 at 2:34 AM, Jaded said:

By being honest to the flight doc for the first time ever? 

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Yep.  Won't have to use air quotes anymore when she asks how many drinks I have per sitting.

Edited March 2, 2017 by BADFNZ

[pawnman]

  On 3/2/2017 at 2:34 AM, Jaded said:

By being honest to the flight doc for the first time ever? 

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Plus, they would have my final medical paperwork from when I left the Air Force...so, all that hearing loss, back pain, etc that qualifies you for 10-20-40% disability would all get brought up, in excrutiating detail.

[Snooter]

  On 3/1/2017 at 6:40 PM, Swizzle said:

All talk and little action occuring, albiet risky, inappropriate action to ease the shortage I've heard of (ex. wash forward UPT studs, undue prof-advance pressure, and push studs through crap training expeditiously)

Do, now, personnel managers/leaders feel the pinch? Are they motivated?

What is the agency cost of a poorly trained and wrong-ORM-balanced aircrew pool? Are bonuses or other changes in USAF status quo worth the very real costs of poor manning management (mishaps, attrition and it's paired new-guy training burden)? Where do the black and red lines of this situation cross? Has anyone tracked these strategic ideas (not just aircrew personnel total chasing)? How bad does it need to be before the entire Gov't beauracracy recognizes, confirms, and recovers? A National Security Crisis confirmed? Will the National "purse" open up? It will cost and our purse will open up in some form or fashion, that's undeniable; whether it be via new training costs or mishap costs or bonuses or increases to USAF quality of life costs. Why stagnate and exacerbate the known problem?

Senior leaders  (ACC, AMC) are writing about it publicly, but perhaps the pot hasn't boiled over yet; or maybe it has and they don't want to admit to "Mom" how bad it is (ex. Finalized Rated retention reports published FY15, FY16?) So...

https://access.afpc.af.mil/vbinDMZ/broker.exe?_program=DEMOGPUB.static_reports.sas&_service=pZ1pub1

 ....when are they going to address the core grievances to fix the issue? OODA, gentlemen. I'd love to here where they think they are in this OODA loop, and how fast they're reevaluating/adapting? How well are they convincing the bureaucracy for change? And is it working at all levels needed? Is dialog with industry having the affect they desire? Written articles on the subject fixing it? If not, re-enter the loop...or find the heart of the matter by listening to your people and addressing their core grievances. 

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I heard a SrA at AFPC had the pilot shortage problem solved but the MFR keeps getting kicked back because it isn't formatted correctly according to the tongue & quill...

[BADFNZ]

  On 3/2/2017 at 12:53 PM, Snooter said:

I heard a SrA at AFPC had the pilot shortage problem solved but the MFR keeps getting kicked back because it isn't formatted correctly according to the tongue & quill...

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Better make damn sure it's on the 70th Anniversary letterhead too.

[Guardian]

Well at least if we have to stay we can push our sleeves up like everyone else. Because that was what was making me want to get out. But now that I can do that, I'm staying. (Sarcasm)


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[so.it.goes]

  On 3/2/2017 at 4:03 AM, BADFNZ said:

Yep.  Won't have to use air quotes anymore when she asks how many drinks I have per sitting.

That's one of my favorite things I've read on the forums in a long time... Here's how mine always goes:

Medical- "How many drinks, on average, do you have per week?"

Me- "I don't" (and struggle to maintain straight face)

Honest answer- "All of them..."

[ClearedHot]

  On 2/13/2017 at 8:19 PM, gearpig said:

As to the second, "Good dudes" are seemingly appointed as CSAF only to disappoint later. Why? There is no doubt in my mind Goldfein is a well-informed, well-intentioned, and well-liked leader who knows why pilots leave, and knows it's not money. However, he still has to protect the overall mission, and he's forced to get creative even if it means trying to shackle his pilots to the AF beyond their commitment.

There's only one logical explanation that merits this type of "solution" from someone like him: The CSAF believes changing conditions outside the Air Force is more feasible than changing conditions inside the Air Force. He's essentially admitting, "I can't pay you more, I can't reduce your time away from home, I can't reduce your additional duty commitments and queep, I can't increase support. The AF is a giant runaway bureaucracy and there's not much I can do (aside from letting you push up your flight suit sleeves.)"

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Valid point points...however.

There is no denying decisions at the very top, particularly strategic ones are often a choice between two uncomfortable paths.   I liken it to decisions made by senior generals in wartime who know men will be lost in combat and find a way to disconnect from reality as they make choices that will most certainly send men to their death in an effort to save a country or a way of life.  What gets me is the double-speak, the slight of hand, the outright lies as he says one thing to your face then goes behind your back to advocate a lower hours requirement with Congress.  Be a fucking LEADER, stand up and tell the truth to your men and women...Ive done what I can within my power and I am left with no other choice to save the service.  I know Goldfein, Rand, and many of the others and I don't simply understand why they surrendered their integrity.

[WeatherManC130]

Can't really think of a good place to post this, but overheard two guys going through MQT talking about the airlines.  Really wanted to say "how about you concentrate passing your MSN check ride and flying the actual aircraft."  Is this the standard coming from UPT now?  

 

WeatherMan

[Jaded]

  On 3/22/2017 at 1:37 AM, WeatherManC130 said:

Can't really think of a good place to post this, but overheard two guys going through MQT talking about the airlines.  Really wanted to say "how about you concentrate passing your MSN check ride and flying the actual aircraft."  Is this the standard coming from UPT now?  

 

WeatherMan

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Hey, they're aspiring to be professional pilots rather than professional christmas party planners. It's progress.

[LookieRookie]

  On 3/22/2017 at 1:37 AM, WeatherManC130 said:

Can't really think of a good place to post this, but overheard two guys going through MQT talking about the airlines.  Really wanted to say "how about you concentrate passing your MSN check ride and flying the actual aircraft."  Is this the standard coming from UPT now?  

 

WeatherMan

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Do you not allow them to talk about anything else besides training during MQT?

[Chida]

Better than talking about Masters degrees, which was standard at the FTU in the 2012-2014 timeframe.


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[Snooter]

  On 3/22/2017 at 5:32 AM, Chida said:

Better than talking about Masters degrees, which was standard at the FTU in the 2012-2014 timeframe.


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Nail, head, boom...

[dream big]

  On 3/23/2017 at 6:18 AM, whiskeychevelle said:

No shit- I was pulled off the flying schedule once as a LT to attend a christmas party planning event with key spouses and other non vol'd booster club members in JULY.

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Ugh sounds so familiar.

break break..

Don't blame these LTs for talking about the airlines during MQT....fear deeply for the state of the Air Force that we have young soon to be copiglets/wingmen already thinking about the airlines.  God we are so f8cked

 

[pawnman]

  On 3/22/2017 at 1:37 AM, WeatherManC130 said:

Can't really think of a good place to post this, but overheard two guys going through MQT talking about the airlines.  Really wanted to say "how about you concentrate passing your MSN check ride and flying the actual aircraft."  Is this the standard coming from UPT now?  

 

WeatherMan

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Hard to blame them when that is all they hear instructors talking about in the squadron.

[Stitch]

  On 3/23/2017 at 6:18 AM, whiskeychevelle said:

No shit- I was pulled off the flying schedule once as a LT to attend a christmas party planning event with key spouses and other non vol'd booster club members in JULY.

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Well you can't expect the wives of the CC and DO to reschedule that important bunco championship or candle party do you?   Thank goodness I never had to deal with that crap as an E on the MX side of the house.  

[MDDieselPilot]

https://federalnewsradio.com/air-force/2017/03/air-force-meeting-airlines-pilot-shortage-may/

  Quote

Grosso said the partnership would look for a “win-win” situation for both the airlines and the Air Force.

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Or as Michael Scott would say, "Now this situation is a what I like to call a Win-Win-Lose", where the airlines win, the air force wins, and our pilots lose.  Because eff them.  But Grosso isn't going to say that, of course.

  Quote

“What we found in the past — and we’ve been through this before because airlines have hired before — is quality of service is as important as quality of life. And quality of service is making sure that you’re given the opportunity to be the best you can be in your design, in your chosen occupation. Pilots who don’t fly, maintainers who’s don’t maintain, controllers who don’t control, will walk. And there’s not enough money in the Treasury to keep them in if we don’t need to give them the resources to be the best they can be. In my mind, readiness and morale are inexplicably linked. Where we have high readiness, we tend to have high moral because they’re given the opportunities to compete. Where we have low readiness, we have our lowest morale,” Air Force Chief of Staff David Goldfein told the Senate Armed Services Committee last September.

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Funny.. I just left a squadron whose commander was adamant that the Air Force's goal is to produce leaders, not pilots.  On a local we discussed the topic at length, and he told me "If you want to just fly, great.. get out and go join the guard or reserves.  The Air Force wants leaders, not technicians."  Trying to provide evidence to the contrary was a losing position, we found very quickly.  It would seem that AF leadership is now giving a different message and being forced to acknowledge that not all of us will be, or want to be, leaders. 

As someone who went to UPT late and is more or less stuck in till 20, I am curious and scared to see how this unfolds.

Edited March 28, 2017 by MDDieselPilot

[Guest]

Jesus, why does HAF think that the solution lies external to the AF/DoD? If you want to keep us in, improve conditions on the inside. CSAF needs to man up and tell the combatant commanders that they don't phucking need deployed rated staffers. Break pilots out from the LAF promotion board; I shouldn't have to compete with a finance officer who wins FGOY because he's a church elder, chili-cookoff winning, soccer mom, Girl Scout troop leader. Fix the assignment system; I'll volunteer for a shitty assignment if given a guaranteed, desirable follow-on. Money isn't everything, but don't insult us with correcting for 20 years of inflation and act like you're doing us a favor.


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