Professional pilot kill recreation?

[VMFA187]

15 hours ago, HuggyU2 said:

Ah... silly, silly, Grasshopper.  Give up your love of such things as golf, motorcycles, golf, cars, golf, and... did I mention golf?  These things were created by Lucifer to steer you away from your Aviation Destiny.  

Well,... keep the fast car.  But only if it doesn't keep you out of more aviation.  Being able to drive to your 60 mph aircraft in a car that can do 165 mph is kinda worthwhile.  I think.  

Golf isn't an issue. I've found that I only enjoy doing something if I'm decent at it - Golf doesn't count. The hardest thing I've ever done. Twice.

Well, I figured of the General Dynamics and the Dodge variety, I could only legitimately own and operate one of the two Vipers. And unfortunately it wasn't the former.

Maybe I'll get into GA once I'm make it to The Show.

[jspace17]

17 hours ago, HuggyU2 said:

Some airplanes just don't respond well to inputs.  It might not be a problem with "that type of airplane", but rather with "that particular airplane".  I remember my first Extra 300 flight in 1996:  indescribable.  

And now... with 110+ different aircraft in my logbook... I'm happy to say that I'm over 25% of the way to my goal.  They are truly, unique experiences.  

Not to mention the amazing people I have met along the way.  I should have written a book. 

I've been meaning to fly an Extra for a while now but it's not in the budget yet. I feel like there are so many different planes that I'll always have something on my list to learn. I think bush flying would be pretty fun.

110, that's impressive. Any other favorites other than the Extra?

Edited August 23, 2017 by jspace17

[Day Man]

32 minutes ago, jspace17 said:

Any other favorites other than the Extra?

Edited August 23, 2017 by Day Man

[Danger41]

Fly a Piper Cub as a fast jet dude if you truly enjoy aviation. Awesome stuff.

[BashiChuni]

Or a Aeronca Champ. 

[bfargin]

I fly a little Titan Tornado S now and it is a blast. It's a full light weight metal aircraft with only 80hp (Rotax 912) but it will do a loop, actually more of an oval ellipse since it barely gets over the top and kind of falls off the back side.  It cruises at C-172 speeds and has 2 seats in tandem and a stick rather than a yoke. A fun little experimental that carries about as much (600 lbs - that includes the 15 gallons of fuel) as its empty weight (~620lbs).

The reason I chose it is that the front seat height is pretty much even with the seat in my wheelchair (I'm paralyzed now so can't use feet/legs) and the rudder and brakes were easy to modify so that I can use my hands to operate all flight controls. Never consciously thought about how much I would miss flying until it was taken away for a little while. The first picture was when I test flew one before I bought mine, the second shot is my plane shot from a friends plane.

 

[jspace17]

16 hours ago, bfargin said:

I fly a little Titan Tornado S now and it is a blast. It's a full light weight metal aircraft with only 80hp (Rotax 912) but it will do a loop, actually more of an oval ellipse since it barely gets over the top and kind of falls off the back side.  It cruises at C-172 speeds and has 2 seats in tandem and a stick rather than a yoke. A fun little experimental that carries about as much (600 lbs - that includes the 15 gallons of fuel) as its empty weight (~620lbs).

The reason I chose it is that the front seat height is pretty much even with the seat in my wheelchair (I'm paralyzed now so can't use feet/legs) and the rudder and brakes were easy to modify so that I can use my hands to operate all flight controls. Never consciously thought about how much I would miss flying until it was taken away for a little while. The first picture was when I test flew one before I bought mine, the second shot is my plane shot from a friends plane.

This is awesome. Looks like a great plane to fly, must be a blast. Glad to see that you got back into it.

Inspiring stuff man, it's great that you're not letting anything ground you. It's part of my dream to own my own little plane and have a runway as a driveway and a hangar as a garage. Looks like it doesn't need much to land on too.

[Homestar]

Plane owners: how much does it cost per year to own?  What is the break even point between renting and owning in terms of hours flown? Now that my kids are getting older I want to teach them how to fly.

[Hacker]

24 minutes ago, Homestar said:

Plane owners: how much does it cost per year to own?  What is the break even point between renting and owning in terms of hours flown? Now that my kids are getting older I want to teach them how to fly.

Standard answer: it depends.

Highly, highly dependent on what kind of aircraft and what you want to do with it.

Here's a ballpark number for an airplane that you're probably not thinking about and is probably considerably more expensive than what you're considering:

About 6-9 years ago I was in the market to buy a T-6 (round engine tailwheel kind, not Pilatus weed-whacker kind), and the overall ownership/operations/hangar/maintenance/insurance cost was about $30,000/year for 100 hours of flying per year.  That included the payments for a 15-year note on a buy-in cost of $150,000.

[Prosuper]

Always wanted to learn to fly but life got in the way. Every once in awhile I help a friend out and do annuals on GA aircraft. Knowing the MX side and the cost of it all to make a puddle jumper airworthy kind of makes it unattractive. But I never got the training you guys got on Uncle Sam's dime , myopia, so I will never know. Besides you Airline guys have a better union than the A&P's so your incomes are better than mine so GA flying is a option. 

[moosepileit]

Since starting as a USAF mx officer in 1995 I've had a Pitts S1S, Luscombe 8E, Kitfox 4, Clone of a 135hp SuperCub and now a RV-6. 12 yrs active total, C-9As and C-17s, then AFRC C-17s with part 121 cargo. Gave my AFRC O-5 pledge pin back 5 years early this past Feb as at 23 total they'd pegged the funmeter. More time for GA!

 

Just turned 14 hours of driving into 4.5 of flying. North of Louisville to South of Atlanta, round trip. 180mph at 9 GPH, and mine is a slower one.

 

I've had the same $35k out of pocket in planes, only did a note for a while on the Pitts. I help with the mx, so annuals are about $350, plus parts.

 

Insurance is about $1k a year for 2 seats with enough hours.

 

Plan Fuel burn $ x 2, $50 in the tank, $50 in the fix-it bank, plus hangar and insurance and you'll be close in the right plane. There are no cheap planes. An oops, woops or "what's that" costs about $300 per fist coverage, hopefully including labor. Need a Magneto? 2-3 fists. Carb? Same. Hope you have yuger hands. Mechanics and their schedules can mean huge downtime, which deflates the fun and family support system if you all fly together. Mechanics are slightly easier than finding a good, local hangar.

 

Hangars can be a nightmare, find that first. I split with another RV, $120 each, but it's 35 minutes away and pretty dead. Good for getting work done, not so much for hangar flying and extra hands.

 

If you don't fly 50 hrs/yr, RENT, if you care about the $ side. I do not pretend it makes sense to own, even in partnership.

 

Buy a good one, under 300 hrs and 3 years since overhaul, but not too fresh to avoid infant mortality and A/Ds on defective new parts. Do not buy old panels if you need IFR, pay up for current to MAYBE 1 gen old, if supported.

 

I dig on experimentals, known types that are easier to inspect and check vs. plans and standards.

 

I'm as happy in a cub, door open at sunset or sunrise as flying acro in a Pitts or travelling mad miles with a digital autopilot, good tunes and the frau in the RV. Sure I jumpseat, fly airlines and drive- sometimes a GA plane makes a trip possible, sometimes it's a drag if worrying about weather/hail/FBO hangars/icing, etc. It's not hard to know when the car or airline tickets are best. Think mil space A.

 

It's also about the folks in flying GA, we're ready to make the hangar-home move next. Any background of pilot can yield a great friend, probably similar to many hobbies, good enough for me so far in flying private GA.

 

 

If it will get you to family, friends, second homes- great, no further people-side needed. But, it's the EAA folks, chapters, fly-ins, Oshkosh, etc that put it over the top for me. Look at a radius calendar on eaa.org or similar and see what happens near you year round. When I was at CHS I met folks that years later put me in touch with the FFO area crowd.

 

At work, trips where I fly with another GA pilot of ANY background go by 9 times in 10 like paid time off.

 

Now, I soloed in gliders at 14, and already knew this is what I was in to. Did not know what I was in for, but the $ in GA has been some of my best spent.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[dmginc]

My dad flew F-4J's during Vietnam for the Navy, and was big into flying little Cessna's around after he got out.  Eventually the passion faded.  He would keep current with his PPL but that was about it.  It wasn't until my siblings and I were old enough to tag along that he really started getting into it again.  I think just being able to share the the joys of aviation with us, seeing the looks on our faces, really lit the fire in him again and reminded him of how much he loved doing it.

[08Dawg]

Granted, I sit in a dungeon with no windows when I fly for work, but I love GA.  My buddy (a fellow FTU instructor and Buff IP) lets me fly his Comanche, and he was my CFI for my commercial ASEL last October and we just finished my CFI a couple of weeks ago.  I think military aviation makes me a better civilian pilot.  My big thing over the past few months has been to find ways to make my weekend aviating useful and not just burn holes in the sky.  I did a couple of Pilots n' Paws trips, flying rescue dogs to adoption agencies.  I also did an EAA Young Eagles event, and flew five or six plane loads of kids over the course of a morning.  Some would've never had the chance to fly in an airplane otherwise, and some were very much into aviation and want to make it a career, so this was just more motivation for them.   

[SocialD]

On 8/24/2017 at 4:33 PM, Homestar said:

Plane owners: how much does it cost per year to own?  What is the break even point between renting and owning in terms of hours flown? Now that my kids are getting older I want to teach them how to fly.

You own a plane because it's what you love to do and don't mind spending your hard earned cash on it.  With the right airport community, you're also getting into a community filled with great people.  There's always someone hanging around to BS with, go fly with, that knows how to fix something you need fixed, or someone willing to share flight time in each others planes.  I've spent many a cookout by the hangar, drinking beer and talking shop...good times.   But what you're ultimately paying for, is the convenience and the ability to stroll out to the hangar and go fly, anytime you want.  You don't worry about availability, hours of operation, taking it out of town for a week, or dropping into a local grass strip.  If you're worrying about pinching pennies and running a CBA on it, then renting will save you lots of headaches.  Also, for insurance reasons, I don't think any FBO would let you instruct in their planes.  

 

Edited August 28, 2017 by SocialD

[Homestar]

1 hour ago, SocialD said:

Also, for insurance reasons, I don't think any FBO would let you instruct in their planes.  

 

That's a good point. Thx!

[Stitch]

On 8/27/2017 at 3:32 AM, 08Dawg said:

...I also did an EAA Young Eagles event, and flew five or six plane loads of kids over the course of a morning.  Some would've never had the chance to fly in an airplane otherwise, and some were very much into aviation and want to make it a career, so this was just more motivation for them.   

Spot on!  EAA is a great deal, we have guys flying RVs, light sport homebuilts and classics such as a beautiful 1947 Howard DGA (looks brand new) and another guy with, I kid thee not, a 450 Stearman, the only flying Boeing 40 in the world and just finished restoring and now flying a 1943 Grumman Goose. 

I have been very active with my local EAA Young Eagle program in the last four or so years.  In the time I've been involved, our chapter has flown just over 431 kids.  Sent one kid the EAA Air Academy in Oshkosh, he went on to college for an Aviation Business degree with a minor in flight and just learned another kid who we gave an Eagle ride to years ago just earned the gold wings of a Coast Guard aviator.     

Good times inspiring the next generation of recreational and professional aviators.  Just for the record, I work as a "crewchief" escorting the kid, mom/dad out to the plane and back.  Being retired MX guy I don't miss the BS of active duty, but miss being around the airplanes. I however, am spending the elephant dollars to earn my PPL so maybe next season I can do some flying as well.  Fun being back on the ramp even if the environment is completely different.       

[moosepileit]

In barnstorming rides we call the escort/$ taker/fuel runner, etc, " Scootering", ala the start of, "The Great Waldo Pepper".

Turns more folks faster, safely, less extra work for the pilot. Think a hot pit team.

[EvilEagle]

10 years ago I was firmly in the "GA would be a waste of my time because I'm too used to flying fighters and it'd be boring."  I was wrong.  It's not as challenging as flying fighters, but having your own airplane is awesome.  I had a Glasair for a few years and I've had my Bonanza 36 for 6 years now.  I still fly it more than 150 hours a year. 

 

The older I get, the more I like airplanes - all airplanes.  The year I started at Delta I was flying the Eagle, my Bonanza, A-4's at Draken, 757s/767s at Delta and started on warbird T-6's.  I just like airplanes.  My wife loves traveling in our Bo; hates commercial - even non-rev in first class.  For some destinations, GA is where it's at - Bahamas for sure.  I'd say don't knock it till you try it (renting one for the weekend isn't trying it).  GA isn't for everyone (nor is the airline) but they both suck a LOT less than I was expecting. 

 

 

[Whitman]

On 8/23/2017 at 4:13 PM, VMFA187 said:

Golf isn't an issue. I've found that I only enjoy doing something if I'm decent at it - Golf doesn't count. The hardest thing I've ever done. Twice.

Well, I figured of the General Dynamics and the Dodge variety, I could only legitimately own and operate one of the two Vipers. And unfortunately it wasn't the former.

Maybe I'll get into GA once I'm make it to The Show.

Post a pic of your Dodge Viper.  To the OP:  I own an exotic v10 and also an RV-4.  Know which one I'm selling if I find myself suddenly jobless?  There simply is no replacing the value and peace of mind of knowing you can open up the hangar, strap on your airplane (that nobody else flew or left a switch out of place in) and go fly.  Most importantly, people in GA are second to none.  RV owners particularly but I may be a bit biased.  

[VMFA187]

59 minutes ago, Whitman said:

Post a pic of your Dodge Viper.  To the OP:  I own an exotic v10 and also an RV-4.  Know which one I'm selling if I find myself suddenly jobless?  There simply is no replacing the value and peace of mind of knowing you can open up the hangar, strap on your airplane (that nobody else flew or left a switch out of place in) and go fly.  Most importantly, people in GA are second to none.  RV owners particularly but I may be a bit biased.  

Unfortunately I no longer have the keys. It seems that it is exceedingly difficult to keep a two-seat sports car in the garage once you're married and your wife is still in school. At least I was able to replace it with the latter, RC8R

Now, you've seen mine. Let me see yours.

[matmacwc]

Shit just went Navy

[Whitman]

 

[jspace17]

23 hours ago, Whitman said:

There simply is no replacing the value and peace of mind of knowing you can open up the hangar, strap on your airplane (that nobody else flew or left a switch out of place in) and go fly.

That sounds like the dream. Hope to get there myself some day. I'd love to be able to fly halfway across the state and back just for lunch.

[HuggyU2]

I figured I’d resurrect this thread with some pics of earlier today. 

Fuel flows in this pic are definitely costlier than a round of golf... but well worth it. 

[Marco]

CJAA?