Leaving the Air Force for Something Other than the Airlines

[HuggyU2]

8 hours ago, ClearedHot said:

From my experience most of the opportunities come from networking. 

I never used a recruiter, but wouldn't rule it out.  

As with CH, building relationships was the key to any opportunities I've had.  In my case, I kept those relationships alive because I liked the people I met... it wasn't to "find a job".  But the job offers that came my way were a unintended consequence of those friendships. 

If you're 12 months from retiring, and expect to start networking now to find a great opportunity, it will be very difficult, in my opinion.    Many of the opportunities I've had were developed over relationships that went back many years.  

 

Edited June 16, 2018 by HuggyU2

[Kenny Powers]

Not retiring, just considering flying part time for the Guard and doing something other than the airlines.

This has probably been covered but, do things like LinkedIn help with networking? Are there other tools? Or has this all been from people you guys have met over your career? That's the thing about the guard, with the exception of TDY, you see the same people for 20 years haha.

For example, if I wanted to work for a company like Lockheed/Boeing/Raytheon, there has to be more to it than searching their job postings hoping to find a match, right?

Edited June 16, 2018 by Kenny Powers

[HuggyU2]

Kenny,

I'll give you my opinion on the matter, but I hope others post theirs, as there are certainly many, many other viewpoints.  

The U-2 guys that have gone in to the aerospace sector were pretty well networked, for the most part.  While some of that was through the U-2 Brotherhood, much of it was also because they built relationships with various the people from those companies while they were on active duty.  They would go TDY to conferences, site visits, etc... and made the effort to  stay with the entire group, rather than bolt and do the "aircrew only" bar scene once the meetings ended.  For example, one friend of mine became a trusted agent and social friend to a couple of Flag Officers, an Under Secretary,  and and some other heavy hitters you would know from recent news events.  I have very little first hand knowledge, but I assume the same opportunities exist within your community.  

LinkedIn:  I built a profile years ago, but have never used it.  I'm sure there are success stories out there, but the positions I were offered were not something that I could imagine happening on LinkedIn.  

The Executive Director position I had from 2014-2016 was purely a result of meeting some CEO's and entrepreneurs at Oshkosh, and spending many hours engaged with them on a personal level for a couple of years.  

One interesting "networking" thing that happened was at Oshkosh in 2003 or '04.  Two of us flew a Beale T-38 there for static.  Met and spent quality time with some people from Virgin.  A couple of nights later, I'm at a small, private house party in Oshkosh with about 30 people. It wasn't until we walked out to the pool area that we realized Richard Branson was hosting the party.  Too bad I had no aspirations to move to the UK or Mojave.  

In summary, Kenny, I don't think the positions you would want will easily materialize through job postings.  But that's just my opinion, since I have no direct experience with social media job hunting.  

[Azimuth]

LinkedIn offers military and veteran's free Premium access, which is normally $60 a month, for free. It's good for a year. Starting next month, they're offering it to military spouses for free to help network and make it easier to find jobs due to PCS's.

https://linkedinforgood.linkedin.com/programs/veterans/premiumform

Edited June 17, 2018 by Azimuth

[matmacwc]

2 minutes ago, Azimuth said:

LinkedIn offers military and veteran's free Premium access, which is normally $60 a month, for free. It's good for a year. Starting next month, they're offering it to military spouses for free to help network and make it easier to find jobs due to PCS's.

https://linkedinforgood.linkedin.com/programs/veterans/premiumform

Thats pretty good!

[Buddy Spike]

1 hour ago, Azimuth said:

LinkedIn offers military and veteran's free Premium access, which is normally $60 a month, for free. It's good for a year. Starting next month, they're offering it to military spouses for free to help network and make it easier to find jobs due to PCS's.

https://linkedinforgood.linkedin.com/programs/veterans/premiumform

More importantly, I've heard of people using Linkedin as a dating site for professionals.  Anybody had any luck picking up hot business chicks on these sites?  

As an airline pilot, I think it's time to start looking for my first ex-wife. Bonus points if I can get alimony out of the deal.  

[SocialD]

5 hours ago, Buddy Spike said:

More importantly, I've heard of people using Linkedin as a dating site for professionals.  Anybody had any luck picking up hot business chicks on these sites?  

As an airline pilot, I think it's time to start looking for my first ex-wife. Bonus points if I can get alimony out of the deal.  

Might as well.  You have chicks out there trying to use Tinder as a legit dating site!  "...if you're just looking to hook up, swipe left!"  Go to match if you're not down!   

[FDNYOldGuy]

I posted up in another thread, so sorry to beat the same drum, but being a firefighter (or cop) is another option if you don’t want airlines or an office job. A lot of larger-city options might be off the table if you did 20+ military due to age restrictions (36 is a cap in a lot of cities; but many smaller cities don’t have age caps), but it’s worth looking into.

Most cities give points to veterans, let you buy back 3 years military time, are very conducive to Reserves/ANG if you still want to fly, may provide another pension, and are seemingly (only say that because I don’t have military experience...yet) similar mentalities/excitement levels to military service. 

There are 12 other people all day, every day in my firehouse, with nearly 60 assigned to the house in total. Lots of different personalities to keep things interesting. We have each others’ backs, are close-knit and social (both at work and with our families), help each other through thick and thin, laugh a whole lot (at ourselves and one another), and get to do some pretty crazy/exciting things that change daily. 10-20% of guys are prior military service, too. 

I’ve not flown a military jet (yet), but driving a 70,000lb fire truck through traffic, pulling up to a building with fire blowing out the window, and heading in when everyone else is heading out is pretty damn exciting. You’re forcing open doors and heading into an environment that’s hot and you can’t see your hand in front of your face to look for victims, or pushing a hoseline that’ll unleash 180-250 gallons of water a minute and nearly send you flying backwards.

You will save a cat. Likely many cats over a career. I’ve heard of guys rescuing a cop, who got stuck in a tree trying to save a cat. In front of a playground full of school children...

You’ll see the best and worst; often times within a few hours of one another. You’ll laugh pretty damn hard. You’ll go home feeling like you made a difference, even if it’s just a small one like opening up an arthritic old lady’s cat food can or making sure the local drunk is still breathing when passed out after his/her latest bender. 

It’s not a perfect job always, but it sure isn’t a bad one. Especially if you already have the mindset, as I’d imagine many pilots/military members do. 

[Mustache Sally]

Has anyone on here taken the civilian RPA pilot route?  I'm 50/50 on going to the airlines and at the very least, I think it'd be a good backup plan in the event that I couldn't land an airline job (loss of 1st class medical, economy tanks, etc.).  

[cragspider]

3 hours ago, Mustache Sally said:

Has anyone on here taken the civilian RPA pilot route?  I'm 50/50 on going to the airlines and at the very least, I think it'd be a good backup plan in the event that I couldn't land an airline job (loss of 1st class medical, economy tanks, etc.).  

I can tell you unless you have rpa experience it’s hard to get into it some times. The hiring goes in cycles as to what they are are looking for in folks. But having a current clearance will help some. 

[pawnman]

51 minutes ago, cragspider said:

I can tell you unless you have rpa experience it’s hard to get into it some times. The hiring goes in cycles as to what they are are looking for in folks. But having a current clearance will help some. 

Bummer, because I was interested in the answer.  I figure thousands of hours spent operating the Sniper pod might give me an in for a similar job in an unmanned aircraft for something like law enforcement or border patrol.

[guineapigfury]

4 hours ago, Mustache Sally said:

Has anyone on here taken the civilian RPA pilot route?  I'm 50/50 on going to the airlines and at the very least, I think it'd be a good backup plan in the event that I couldn't land an airline job (loss of 1st class medical, economy tanks, etc.).  

Assuming you mean defense contractor, I have.  What do you want to know?

[hindsight2020]

On 6/17/2018 at 11:21 AM, Buddy Spike said:

More importantly, I've heard of people using Linkedin as a dating site for professionals.  Anybody had any luck picking up hot business chicks on these sites?  

As an airline pilot, I think it's time to start looking for my first ex-wife. Bonus points if I can get alimony out of the deal.  

bumble is where it's at these days yo for future exwife and crazy ex. Same ratio of single mothers (69%), but the quality is more Target in flavor than Walmart (tinder), if you're looking for the lightly used exwife material.

PoF is still the grab and go, 'grab er by the ----'  mecca though. Like sticking your hand on a wood chipper.  

[matmacwc]

On 7/18/2018 at 8:14 PM, hindsight2020 said:

bumble is where it's at these days yo for future exwife and crazy ex. Same ratio of single mothers (69%), but the quality is more Target in flavor than Walmart (tinder), if you're looking for the lightly used exwife material.

PoF is still the grab and go, 'grab er by the ----'  mecca though. Like sticking your hand on a wood chipper.  

I’m not exactly sure what you said there or what it means, but I’m all in.

[hindsight2020]

1 hour ago, matmacwc said:

I’m not exactly sure what you said there or what it means, but I’m all in.

It's basically what happens when you find yourself becoming the crusty one-strike divorced Major while babysitting FAIPS during "fat and backs". It's amazing the millennial stuff you can pick up on a double turn. These cats got the dragon slayin' apps on point. The only thing I ever carried with me on a computer when I was their age was a nerd ass -38 PMP TOLD Calculator.

Of course that's back when text was charged by the message, yahoo messenger was a bona fide ass-scouting venue (being decommissioned this month btw..sad that I know that), and I had to tell the slam mat to call me after 1900 so I can tap the nights and weekends minutes.

These cats today have the slam mat apps pre-selected on their phone so when they chock they're already swiping right. Lining up ass has become so much easier. I will say, closing still requires ol school game. Brave new world nonetheless.

I regret having married my college girlfriend after UPT, especially after she got fat and lazy in the sack. I don't regret divorcing her though. So DFP Inst Fix:  

1)Stay single for the first 10 years of AF tenure...fuck it make it 15. 

 2)Load smartphone with "Target or higher" quality ass-scouting apps prior to off-station sortie or TDY. 

3) Smash.                                                                           

4) Ghost app on the RTB. 

5) Profit.

 

Edited July 20, 2018 by hindsight2020
typing while alt+tab to porn don't work too good....

[Lord Ratner]

It's basically what happens when you find yourself becoming the crusty one-strike divorced Major while babysitting FAIPS during "fat and backs". It's amazing the millennial stuff you can pick up on a double turn. These cats got the dragon slayin' apps on point. The only thing I ever carried with me on a computer when I was their age was a nerd ass -38 PMP TOLD Calculator.
Of course that's back when text was charged by the message, yahoo messenger was a bona fide ass-scouting venue (being decommissioned this month btw..sad that I know that), and I had to tell the slam mat to call me after 1900 so I can tap the nights and weekends minutes.
These cats today have the slam mat apps pre-selected on their phone so when they chock they're already swiping right. Lining up ass has become so much easier. I will say, closing still requires ol school game. Brave new world nonetheless.
I regret having married my college girlfriend after UPT, especially after she got fat and lazy in the sack. I don't regret divorcing her though. So DFP Inst Fix:  
1)Stay single for the first 10 years of AF tenure... it make it 15. 
 2)Load smartphone with "Target or higher" quality ass-scouting apps prior to off-station sortie or TDY. 
3) Smash.                                                                           
4) Ghost app on the RTB. 
5) Profit.
 

A little birdie told me that bumble is surprisingly useful for unicorn hunting, if don't happen to be single...

[di1630]

I had a buddy recently TDY at the ops desk showing us all photos of a tinder chick (she was smoking) and he played the drunken messages she left him about meeting up.

That evening he asked me to give him a ride to meet her. We had a beer waiting til she showed, when she did, I probably laughed out loud and saw his face.

All we had seen was her face shot, the rest of here looked like a washing machine.

Anyhow, be careful when shopping.

[dream big]

1 hour ago, di1630 said:

I had a buddy recently TDY at the ops desk showing us all photos of a tinder chick (she was smoking) and he played the drunken messages she left him about meeting up.

That evening he asked me to give him a ride to meet her. We had a beer waiting til she showed, when she did, I probably laughed out loud and saw his face.

All we had seen was her face shot, the rest of here looked like a washing machine.

Anyhow, be careful when shopping.

Be extra careful when shopping overseas, especially Southeast Asia, turns out a lot of the “girls” are ladyboys.  Easy to hide details like that on tinder. 

[Bobsan]

6 hours ago, hindsight2020 said:

2)Load smartphone with "Target or higher" quality ass-scouting apps prior to off-station sortie or TDY. 

Newer high-end options are Hinge and the League, there's also Happn. You could have each app set to a different location you frequent or plan out different location changes ahead of your trips so you have matches and dates lined up before you even get there.

[di1630]

Hypothetically, if you were debt free, kids college funded, decent investment balance with a military retirement, what would be your annual net income number you’d feel comfortable leaving the workforce entirely for just to pursue your hobbies?

[Warrior]

Hypothetically, if you were debt free, kids college funded, decent investment balance with a military retirement, what would be your annual net income number you’d feel comfortable leaving the workforce entirely for just to pursue your hobbies?

Easy to answer after you tell us
-how old you are
-how long you’ll live
-how long your spouse will live
-.mil retirement details (O-5? Years of service?)
-annual expenses in retirement
-expected growth rate on investments
-assumed inflation rate
-any large expenses other than what you mentioned (cars/vacation/new house)
-desire to leave money to your kids

By annual net income do you mean passive from your investments? Or what income will your hobbies generate?

[Buddy Spike]

3 hours ago, di1630 said:

Hypothetically, if you were debt free, kids college funded, decent investment balance with a military retirement, what would be your annual net income number you’d feel comfortable leaving the workforce entirely for just to pursue your hobbies?


 

If your hobbies are airplanes, boats, race cars, or women, you're going to need at least $20k per month.

[nsplayr]

8 hours ago, di1630 said:

Hypothetically, if you were debt free, kids college funded, decent investment balance with a military retirement, what would be your annual net income number you’d feel comfortable leaving the workforce entirely for just to pursue your hobbies?


 

I'd quit my real job today at less than age 35 with $2m in the bank.

I'd leave that sudden windfall invested in a similar fashion as my current portfolio, start drawing ~4% per year, and have almost $1K per week to spend after paying for my house (would not pay off right away due to very low interest rate for the next 28 years...can invest much more effectively than that). I'm not even sure I could spend that much although I guess it would be fun to find out. And all that is never touching your principal so long as you're willing to adjust your spending a little during downturns in investment success, i.e. still plenty of wiggle room to fund a mid-life crisis Ferrari or boat or whatever.

Honestly I would keep up being a DSG in the Guard because I like serving, plus I'd like to get my Guard pension one day and stay eligible for Tricare. Purely optional though and if it ever sucked too much I could punch no questions asked.

TBH a lot of people don't realize that you don't need 10s of millions of dollars to quit your job and still live a comfortable, upper-middle class lifestyle even if you are still young. YMMV, but in general your number can also likely go down with age & after factoring in other pensions if you have them.

Like I said, I'm < 35, have a mortgage, don't have a pension in the bag, and have 1x elementary-aged kid...and my number is still only $2m. In your hypothetical of being debt free, no college fund to save for and a mil pension, hell, IDK but it'd be a lot lower. $700K or maybe less? Depends on how much your pension is paying monthly, e.g. AD O-5 > 20 pension, yea, prob $700K would work.

Edited July 22, 2018 by nsplayr

[guineapigfury]

I'm a single late 30s dude with no kids, debt or pension.  My retirement number is 2 mil with a house paid off.  That should generate 80-100k per year, which is plenty.

[di1630]

I'm a single late 30s dude with no kids, debt or pension.  My retirement number is 2 mil with a house paid off.  That should generate 80-100k per year, which is plenty.

I’m thinking no debt, 1 mil in investments, military retirement plus healthcare and an extra $50-60k or so to bring net income to $100k.

Reason I ask, I was looking at how much I really spend on a family of 4 and we live well spending around $80k annually.

Just wondering if I’ll go to the airlines and miss out on family events to have money to buy stuff I don’t need or die with a ton of money in the bank.

I don’t want to be the richest man in the cemetery but I want some security. Must of all though I don’t want to miss out on my kids while I’m stuck in the Middle East or on layover.

Just weighing options.