Elon Musk & Tesla EVs

[HarleyQuinn]

I know some of you guys probably follow stock prices and the value of Tesla or the net worth of the company's CEO. Has the world gone mad calling EVs the future and comparing the CEO to Tony Stark? I want your opinions on the stock and stupid sh$t like this: 

https://www.theverge.com/2018/7/7/17544452/elon-musk-spacex-thailand-cave-soccer-team-kid-sized-submarine-rescue

Edited July 8, 2018 by HarleyQuinn

[soupafly06]

Tony Stark? I always thought Musk is closer to this guy:

Still I'd rather have a piece of SpaceX than Tesla but it's still privately held at the moment.

[Snooter]

So a guy worth billions of dollars from a car company and a rocket company is putting some of his employees to work by building a mini sub to get a Thai soccer team out of a cave before they die.  What are you doing with your time, besides posting on Baseops?

[HarleyQuinn]

9 hours ago, Snooter said:

So a guy worth billions of dollars from a car company and a rocket company is putting some of his employees to work by building a mini sub to get a Thai soccer team out of a cave before they die.  What are you doing with your time, besides posting on Baseops?

Elon Musk was going to save Puerto Rico by rebuilding their power grid. He absorbed Solar City which was in his family and on the verge of bankruptcy. Solar City is still in debt. What state is Puerto Rico's power grid in right now you ask? Regular civilians who have no training is trying to repair parts of the grid so their families can have power.  This was another BS PR stunt by Musk.

Professional divers are rescuing those football players without any help from Elon Musk period. A mini sub is useless in a complex cave structure where divers can hardly even fit oxygen tanks through for the children to utilize let alone themselves. Of which one former Thai Navy Seal has already perished attempting to assist. A little research on your part and listening to actual experts go a long way. Last thing you want is the man responsible for self driving cars who have run into 2 parked fire trucks, a parked police car, and a highway barrier in the past 4 months to say anything. Not the man I want trying to save children.

This is the same man who thought he could build a car assembly line with robots performing most of the work and out manufacturer the top automakers. The Japanese wrote the book on efficient car manufacturing. Elon failed miserably by thinking he was smarter than everyone else and had to admit he was wrong. Guess it's okay to be wrong burning through billions of other people money.  But churning out cars like in the 80s movie Gung Ho is definitely a car people should buy. 

I don't see Bill Gates trying to make headlines every week or lying to investors. Bill Gates and Steve Jobs never had to claim they were sleeping on a factory floor in order to resolve manufacturing problems. That's an illusion for Elon Musk micromanagement leadership style. 

I guess your plan is to put Ant-Man in Elon Musk mini sub? Brilliant.

Edited July 8, 2018 by HarleyQuinn

[YoungnDumb]

38 minutes ago, HarleyQuinn said:

Elon failed miserably by thinking he was smarter than everyone else and had to admit he was wrong. Guess it's okay to be wrong burning through billions of other people money.  

 

He should join the AF, he'd make GO in a heartbeat.

[sqwatch]

.

[nsplayr]

I’ll just leave this here and see myself out...

Edited July 9, 2018 by nsplayr

[HarleyQuinn]

10 hours ago, YoungnDumb said:

He should join the AF, he'd make GO in a heartbeat.

Social media will definitely call you out if you don't follow through. Once again, Mr. Unreliable Musk rears his head.

Edited July 9, 2018 by HarleyQuinn

[waveshaper]

10 minutes ago, HarleyQuinn said:

Social media will definitely call you out if you don't follow through. Once again, Mr. Unreliable Musk rears his head.

This rescue was initially projected to take up to 4 months. I'll give "Mr. Unreliable Musk" some credit for jumping through some hoops to make the following happen/todays latest news on this subject;

After considering a "bouncy castle air tube" that the kids might be able to wriggle through to safety, Musk and his team settled on the idea of building a kid-sized submarine, equipped with external air tanks. A foot-wide liquid oxygen transfer tube, originally built for SpaceX’s Falcon 9 rocket, would serve as the hull.

The contraption went through dive-pool tests at Palisades Charter High School in Los Angeles and was sent on a 17-hour flight to Thailand.

The crisis could be resolved without having to resort to SpaceX’s mini-sub, and without further fatalities, which everyone agrees would be good news.

But in today’s tweets, Musk made clear that he wouldn’t consider the effort wasted even if it doesn’t come into play in the flooded Thai cave. The concept could come in handy for future underwater rescues on Earth, or rescues in the vacuum of space.

In any case, it’s instructive to see how the crowdsourced engineering exercise unfolded over the course of just a couple of days.

 

 

[17D_guy]

1 hour ago, waveshaper said:

But in today’s tweets, Musk made clear that he wouldn’t consider the effort wasted even if it doesn’t come into play in the flooded Thai cave. The concept could come in handy for future underwater rescues on Earth, or rescues in the vacuum of space.

In any case, it’s instructive to see how the crowdsourced engineering exercise unfolded over the course of just a couple of days.

But it didn't result in something useful right now so it's a total failure!

[HarleyQuinn]

On 7/8/2018 at 8:45 PM, waveshaper said:

This rescue was initially projected to take up to 4 months. I'll give "Mr. Unreliable Musk" some credit for jumping through some hoops to make the following happen/todays latest news on this subject;

After considering a "bouncy castle air tube" that the kids might be able to wriggle through to safety, Musk and his team settled on the idea of building a kid-sized submarine, equipped with external air tanks. A foot-wide liquid oxygen transfer tube, originally built for SpaceX’s Falcon 9 rocket, would serve as the hull.

The contraption went through dive-pool tests at Palisades Charter High School in Los Angeles and was sent on a 17-hour flight to Thailand.

The crisis could be resolved without having to resort to SpaceX’s mini-sub, and without further fatalities, which everyone agrees would be good news.

But in today’s tweets, Musk made clear that he wouldn’t consider the effort wasted even if it doesn’t come into play in the flooded Thai cave. The concept could come in handy for future underwater rescues on Earth, or rescues in the vacuum of space.

In any case, it’s instructive to see how the crowdsourced engineering exercise unfolded over the course of just a couple of days.

 

 

https://gizmodo.com/is-elon-musk-serious-1827456578

A kid-sized submarine arrived in northern Thailand, just a few hours before the final four members of a youth soccer team and their coach were rescued from the flooded Tham Luang cave complex. Elon Musk, whose minions had built the sub out of SpaceX rocket materials for the sole purpose of moving the trapped boys to safety, delivered the mini sub himself and announced his presence in a tweet to his 22 million followers. Meanwhile, the rescue chief said that the kid-sized submarine was “not practical” for the boys, as thousands heaped praise onto Musk for doing—well—it’s unclear if the bombastic billionaire really did anything helpful. Which makes you wonder: is Elon Musk serious with this shit?

The short answer to that question is no. Musk has a long track record of promising to solve huge problems and then either missing deadlines or falling short.

Edited July 10, 2018 by HarleyQuinn

[17D_guy]

3 hours ago, HarleyQuinn said:

The short answer to that question is no. Musk has a long track record of promising to solve huge problems and then either missing deadlines or falling short.

So, in your opinion he's a failure if not all items that he invests in produce tangible results?

[HarleyQuinn]

5 minutes ago, 17D_guy said:

So, in your opinion he's a failure if not all items that he invests in produce tangible results?

That quote is from the article. I don't consider the guy a failure at all. I just want him to STFU and focus on EVs, solar, and space. The term doing too much comes to mind. I wonder if people on Twitter are trolling him because his actions to help in Thailand were because of a tweet he received. Musk thinks he really is Tony Stark who is a fictional character....

Edited July 10, 2018 by HarleyQuinn

[Day Man]

show us where Elon touched you...

[FourFans]

On ‎7‎/‎9‎/‎2018 at 6:08 AM, 17D_guy said:

But it didn't result in something useful right now so it's a total failure!

This statement right here (17D, I love your sarcasm) points to exactly what's wrong with so much of the world today.

[waveshaper]

19 hours ago, HarleyQuinn said:

https://gizmodo.com/is-elon-musk-serious-1827456578

A kid-sized submarine arrived in northern Thailand, just a few hours before the final four members of a youth soccer team and their coach were rescued from the flooded Tham Luang cave complex. Elon Musk, whose minions had built the sub out of SpaceX rocket materials for the sole purpose of moving the trapped boys to safety, delivered the mini sub himself and announced his presence in a tweet to his 22 million followers. Meanwhile, the rescue chief said that the kid-sized submarine was “not practical” for the boys, as thousands heaped praise onto Musk for doing—well—it’s unclear if the bombastic billionaire really did anything helpful. Which makes you wonder: is Elon Musk serious with this shit?

The short answer to that question is no. Musk has a long track record of promising to solve huge problems and then either missing deadlines or falling short.

IMHO, it never hurts to try an advance rescue/recovery/resupply technologies on planet earth and in space. Also, with this new "Space Force" evolving it's just a matter of time before a few "Major Tom's" will find themselves in some dicey situation. Major Tom sends his regards to folks like Mr. Musk and the new Space Force:<)

 

Edited July 11, 2018 by waveshaper

[HarleyQuinn]

8 hours ago, waveshaper said:

 

 

Quote

 

 

23 hours ago, Day Man said:

show us where Elon touched you...

 

If the whistle blower information is correct, Musk will have touched a lot of people. People who think they paid $75K-120K for a very safe, family vehicle actually received a car manufactured in an unsafe way like the movie Gung Ho (classic). Musk said, He sleeps at the factory." Can't deny being held culpable at that point.

https://jalopnik.com/tesla-s-alleged-saboteur-is-doubling-down-1827514663

"Tripp alleges a series of claims that he has made since being connected to the leak of information. In particular, he claims, that Tesla place batteries “containing dangerous puncture holes in vehicles” and overstated to investors the number of Model 3 vehicles produced by as much as 44 percent. He also claims that Tesla “systematically reused parts already deemed scrap/waste in vehicles without regard to safety,” the statement said."

Edited July 11, 2018 by HarleyQuinn

[Danger41]

 

[Vertigo]

Do you want a super villain? Cause badmouthing a philanthropic kabzillionaire who loves to make rocket ships, flame throwers, and submarines is how you get a super villain.

[Mark1]

On 7/8/2018 at 7:57 AM, HarleyQuinn said:

Last thing you want is the man responsible for self driving cars who have run into 2 parked fire trucks, a parked police car, and a highway barrier in the past 4 months to say anything. Not the man I want trying to save children.

Tesla doesn't sell self driving cars.  Negligent drivers in Tesla vehicles did all those things.

Also, do you have numbers on how many BMWs, Hondas, and Fords were involved in crashes involving parked vehicles and highway barriers over the same period of time...normalized by the relative number of cars of course?  That would help make your point that Teslas are rolling death traps.  Oh wait, the numbers show that Teslas are significantly safer than a traditional vehicle?  And that's with contribution of any battery issues and scrap parts rolled in?  Damn, so much for that.

As a fun side project, you should look up cases of "spontaneous" combustion in traditional cars vs. Teslas...you might be surprised to find that the national news isn't being so genuine when they highlight every incident of a Tesla burning to the ground while neglecting the order of magnitude more traditional cars that do the same on a daily basis.

Statistically, your life insurance company should gift you a Tesla with known battery and manufacturing defects.

Having said that, I wouldn't go anywhere near Tesla stock.  People seem to have this impression that Tesla is doing something that none of the other car manufacturers have the skills to do.  That's not the case at all.  Up until now Musk has been willing to operate at a loss in a long term effort to corner an emerging market, but it's foolish to think he can do so. 

The traditional auto manufacturers won't enter the autonomous EV market in earnest until it's favorable economically over internal combustion engine vehicles, which isn't yet the case.  However, when they choose to shift their engineering and manufacturing efforts it will take no time for them to flood the market with comparable EVs with their logos on them, and the halo that Tesla has been operating under will disappear in short order.  They'll probably be left as a legitimate, but very small player in the car business.  Their stock reflects none of that reality.

[HarleyQuinn]

10 hours ago, Mark1 said:

Tesla doesn't sell self driving cars.  Negligent drivers in Tesla vehicles did all those things.

Also, do you have numbers on how many BMWs, Hondas, and Fords were involved in crashes involving parked vehicles and highway barriers over the same period of time...normalized by the relative number of cars of course?  That would help make your point that Teslas are rolling death traps.  Oh wait, the numbers show that Teslas are significantly safer than a traditional vehicle?  And that's with contribution of any battery issues and scrap parts rolled in?  Damn, so much for that.

As a fun side project, you should look up cases of "spontaneous" combustion in traditional cars vs. Teslas...you might be surprised to find that the national news isn't being so genuine when they highlight every incident of a Tesla burning to the ground while neglecting the order of magnitude more traditional cars that do the same on a daily basis.

Statistically, your life insurance company should gift you a Tesla with known battery and manufacturing defects.

Having said that, I wouldn't go anywhere near Tesla stock.  People seem to have this impression that Tesla is doing something that none of the other car manufacturers have the skills to do.  That's not the case at all.  Up until now Musk has been willing to operate at a loss in a long term effort to corner an emerging market, but it's foolish to think he can do so. 

The traditional auto manufacturers won't enter the autonomous EV market in earnest until it's favorable economically over internal combustion engine vehicles, which isn't yet the case.  However, when they choose to shift their engineering and manufacturing efforts it will take no time for them to flood the market with comparable EVs with their logos on them, and the halo that Tesla has been operating under will disappear in short order.  They'll probably be left as a legitimate, but very small player in the car business.  Their stock reflects none of that reality.

Gasoline and diesel vehicles make up 99% of cars sold. EVs only account for 1% of sales. When Tesla can actually sell 10 million cars in a year like Toyota did last year, we can have this discussion. Having 450K reservations doesn't come close to measuring up to the 20 million cars total that Toyota or Volkswagen actually sold last year. There is a huge difference between a reservation and sales. Sell 10 million Teslas and lets see how the safety records compare. Battery packs can reignite after the fire has been put out which puts first responders and those trapped in a car in harms way. 

Why were those drivers negligent? Because Musk was making these claims and during interviews he had his hands off the steering wheel while driving himself.  Tell that to the mother or father of a child who gets run over by a Tesla in a school zone because people believe everything he has to say. Musk has a cult of 22 million followers who calls him Tony Stark. Musk said, "The probability of an accident with the autopilot is less" at the 1:25 mark per your savior. 

 

I'll take the white Toyota from behind by a semi over the Tesla that hit a barrier and burst into flames because the owner was driving around on autopilot. The Japanese know how to build stuff that lasts.

Edited July 14, 2018 by HarleyQuinn

[Mark1]

2 hours ago, HarleyQuinn said:

Gasoline and diesel vehicles make up 99% of cars sold. EVs only account for 1% of sales. When Tesla can actually sell 10 million cars in a year like Toyota did last year we can have this discussion. Having 450K reservations doesn't come close to measuring up to the 20 million cars total that Toyota or Volkswagen actually sold last year. Huge difference between a reservation and sales.

I'm going to assume that you're responding to the voice inside you're head because none of this is related in any way to anything I had to say.

2 hours ago, HarleyQuinn said:

Battery packs can reignite after the fire has been put out which puts first responders and those trapped in a car in harms way. 

And yet, from a statistical perspective, they're still saving lives over traditional vehicles.  So what's your point.  That they can improve?  Sure, great.  Doesn't change the fact that they're objectively safer in their current state.

If you'd like, for funsies, I can point you to a video of a man burning alive inside his gasoline powered car after a mild impact which he survived but which deformed the frame of the vehicle to the point that he couldn't exit the vehicle, and cracked the fuel tank.  Or are we all tuckered out on anecdotal evidence and hypotheticals that do nothing to change the statistics?  Statistics that don't require 20 million sales to be relevant.  There are very well established methods for determining how much of a sample size is required for meaningful statistical conclusions.  Those analyses are presented right alongside the results showing the disparity in safety record.

3 hours ago, HarleyQuinn said:

"The probability of an accident with the autopilot is less" at 1:25 mark per your savior.

Yes, and?  You take issue with objective truths?

Also, not sure how you interpreted my comments to be support for Musk in any way.  I recall showing support for the science of probability and statistics, and then pointing out the inevitable failure of Tesla's business model.  I don't recall raising Musk up to deity status.

For your sake I hope Musk's next project is a charity focused on adult literacy programs.

[Day Man]

22 hours ago, Vertigo said:

Do you want a super villain? Cause badmouthing a philanthropic kabzillionaire who loves to make rocket ships, flame throwers, and submarines is how you get a super villain.

 

[HarleyQuinn]

8 hours ago, Mark1 said:

For your sake I hope Musk's next project is a charity focused on adult literacy programs.

The people who can't keep their hands on the steering wheel are the same ones buying "not a flamethrower" in California of all places. Brilliant idea.

In this forum, we might not like what some individuals post. But personal attacks are for Lts who wasn't loved enough by their mother,  father, and IPs.

Illiteracy is a huge problem. I mean if your mom COULD actually read the instructions on the side of the Plan B box, you wouldn't be here right now. Everyone loves a good mom joke..😁

Edited July 14, 2018 by HarleyQuinn

[HarleyQuinn]

"Elon Musk can 'stick his submarine where it hurts', says British caver who helped rescue Thai schoolboys"

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/thai-cave-rescue-elon-musk-mini-submarine-british-driver-tham-luang-vern-unsworth-a8447166.html

A British diver who was instrumental in rescuing a schoolboy football team from a flooded cave in Thailand has told Elon Musk to “stick his submarine where it hurts”, describing the entrepreneur’s offer to help the mission with a miniature submersible a “PR stunt”.

Vern Unsworth said a six-foot submarine the SpaceX boss invented and handed to the rescue team “had absolutely no chance of working” because the billionaire inventor “had no conception of what the cave passage was like”.