Military Pilot Shortage and Aero Clubs

[SocialD]

From my very limited experience with AF aero clubs, the governmental bureaucracy of an aero club is a PITA.  I'm in the process of researching options for starting my own club (mostly squadron mates) and there is lots of information out there.  I've found it useful to reach to a club and talk to others who have started one or are currently running one...lots of useful information.   Here are a few links to starting a club. 

AOPA Flying Club

Flying Club Resources

Club Finder

[BFM this]

11 hours ago, SocialD said:

From my very limited experience with AF aero clubs, the governmental bureaucracy of an aero club is a PITA. 

The benefits are (were) the support structure, especially during times of plenty when surplus T-34s and T-41s could be the backbone of the club, on base facilities, including avgas availability (which is gone with the wind, obviously).

But you're right, the golden goose was strangled by the typically Air Force answer to non-existent problems, such as the hamfisted application of an AFI11-2AeroClubV1,2,3 template that turns a sunny day in search of the $100 burger into, well...more queep than it's worth.

That the Air Force doesn't make support (real, risk managed, managment-managed approach) to supporting Aero Clubs is a shame.  It should be a core cultural priority; we're the fucking AIR Force, for chrissakes!  AFB's should have an Aero Club, Navy bases should have a sailing club, Army bases should have an MWR shooting range and backcountry hiking/camping.

[Stitch]

On 3/30/2019 at 12:04 PM, Blue said:

Given the complaints I've seen here about Aero Clubs (bureaucracy, red tape, general nonsense), any thoughts about establishing a "Cannon Aero Club" at the nearby municipal airport?

That's probably your best option, lots of 100LL, flying off a non-towered field if possible, burger burns on the ramp at the end of the flying day, host a pancake fly-in or a Young Eagles event a few times a year to inspire the next generation; all the fun with minimal bullshit.   Look to EAA start your own chapter with a flying club attached.  EAA National is having a big push right now for chapters to do just that.   More info here: https://www.eaa.org/eaa/pilots/flying-club/flying-club-manual

 

[brabus]

Agree with Stitch - starting a local club can be great.  In fact, the only con of doing so vs. an AF aero club is you don't have government subsidization, but a non-AF club can win in every other way, from better airplanes to no bullshit red tape.  Remember, the best thing the AF does is fuck up something that should be awesome.

[Orbit]

As much as I love the EAA there are some fees that I believe are in the 2-300 dollar range to start a chapter.  If the goal is just to get a flying club started AOPA has resources to help you start one. https://www.aopa.org/community/flying-clubs

 

 

[BFM this]

So this hit my in-container recently:

Quote

 

From: […] OG/CD 
To: [a bunch of CCs]
Cc: [a bunch of DOs]

Subject: Civilian Aircraft Parking/Aero Club Survey

Commanders,

I have good news.  The FSS has published an Aero Club/Civilian Aircraft Parking Survey.  The overall purpose of the survey is two-fold:

1. A survey is required by AFI in order gauge interest and begin the process of creating an Aero Club.

2. The survey will gauge interest and build our initial contact list for personnel who wish to park their aircraft on the CAP ramp.  We will then coordinate with them to begin the landing permit process and eventually open the ramp to their aircraft.

The survey will be active until 28 Apr 19.

Although FSS Marketing will promote the survey on the FSS website, mobile app, and social media, I recommend you forward this to your squadrons/attached personnel in order to ensure they receive it, as I would imagine the FSS’s methods will not be as effective as an email from within the unit.  I’ll also work to make sure the word gets out to [tenant staff], but if you think of anyone else who would be interested, please forward the link along.

The link to the survey is: [link to the survey]

Let me know if you have any questions.

R,

 

On the one hand, its a faint signal among the static that maybe someone is out there who gets it.  On the other, maybe I'm jaded, but I see this fizzling out in the crib.  ...now, if big blue were to do some recapitalization of their Cirrus fleet at the zoo, doling out the existing tails to clubs AF-wide...  Like I mentioned before, I think the reasons that clubs were successful in their heyday had a lot to do with resourcing with surplus tails.  Unfortunately we don't have a glut of T-34s, T-41s, and T-42s laying around.  Although CAP has had some success lobbying for consistent recapitalization of their own fleet in recent years, (way nicer rides than when I was a cadet) so maybe that could form the basis as well. 

Plenty of ideas about how this could work...few about how it could work given today's operating environmentals.

[arg]

Two planes for the Cannon aero club got here today.

[FLEA]

3 hours ago, arg said:

Two planes for the Cannon aero club got here today.

Ooooh what'd you get !? what'd you get!?

[Sketch]

On 4/13/2019 at 4:38 PM, BFM this said:

Although CAP has had some success lobbying for consistent recapitalization of their own fleet in recent years, (way nicer rides than when I was a cadet) so maybe that could form the basis as well. 

Which is just about the only thing keeping the program relevant anymore, besides the occasional SAR & Green Flag sorties and largely emasculated cadet training. Still a great route to build cheap hours, though

[arg]

On 10/13/2019 at 10:30 PM, FLEA said:

Ooooh what'd you get !? what'd you get!?

Cessnas, not sure the model

 

[nunya]

4 hours ago, arg said:

Cessnas, not sure the model

[Bertamus47]

Kadena has an aero club with 3 RedHawks. Availability is alright most the time, but I have no context to speak to the competency of the management. Prices are a bit high but hey you’re on an island in the Pacific. 

[HuggyU2]

They have RedHawks??  Diesel-powered C-172s?  That’s surprising.

 

[mb1685]

That’s pretty cool. I used to work for Redbird at their FBO and they were doing the RedHawk conversions at the field (KHYI).

[Bigred]

6 hours ago, Bertamus47 said:

Kadena has an aero club with 3 RedHawks. Availability is alright most the time, but I have no context to speak to the competency of the management. Prices are a bit high but hey you’re on an island in the Pacific. 

When I was there they only took actual FAA medicals instead of the "mil comp" class 3 from our flight physicals. Probably a function of being on Okinawa, but I was bummed when I spent ~6 months on the island and couldn't get a FAA medical to putt around in the Cessna.

[LJDRVR]

I was never bothered too much by the red tape at the aero clubs. I did my instrument rating in a nicely decked out T-41. Most of the aero clubs are 141 approved, meaning you can use your GI bill. 

Another added bonus was the quality of the instruction. I had a retired O-6 who flew B-47's, T-39's and T-43's. He did his civilian ATP ride shooting approaches into the Johnson ranch with the Boeing. Finished up as the wing commander at Mather. 

Wally Miller. I can still hear his voice every time I push the thrust levers forward;

"Today's the day your engine gonna quit!"

[Bertamus47]

On 10/24/2019 at 11:27 AM, HuggyU2 said:

They have RedHawks??  Diesel-powered C-172s?  That’s surprising.

 

Correct. Got them about a year ago now. About 5 GPH which is good for the club’s fuel bill. 

[Bertamus47]

On 10/24/2019 at 4:46 PM, Bigred said:

When I was there they only took actual FAA medicals instead of the "mil comp" class 3 from our flight physicals. Probably a function of being on Okinawa, but I was bummed when I spent ~6 months on the island and couldn't get a FAA medical to putt around in the Cessna.

Interesting. Got my faa class 3 through the med group with little issue. Maybe it’s something they added?

[hindsight2020]

On 10/24/2019 at 12:30 PM, mb1685 said:

That’s pretty cool. I used to work for Redbird at their FBO and they were doing the RedHawk conversions at the field (KHYI).

Sadly the FBO is no more. Nice little rant the CEO posted on the internet too about it. 

[Guardian]

Sadly the FBO is no more. Nice little rant the CEO posted on the internet too about it. 

Copy and paste here or it didn’t happen

[hindsight2020]

1 hour ago, Guardian said:

Copy and paste here or it didn’t happen

https://landing.redbirdflight.com/posts/the-pilot-and-the-fbo-a-love/hate-story

[FLEA]

11 hours ago, Bertamus47 said:

Interesting. Got my faa class 3 through the med group with little issue. Maybe it’s something they added?

Some flight docs go through the actual FAA training and can issue up to a Class 2 I think. They pretty much get the training for post career aspirations but it's not universal. 

Otherwise, the FAR allows your military class 1 to count as a FAA Class 3 but it's a US FAR, so probably not accepted elsewhere. 

[Guardian]

https://landing.redbirdflight.com/posts/the-pilot-and-the-fbo-a-love/hate-story

Thanks. Interesting and sad read.