Information on PCS/moves/moving (DITY, TMO, DLA, storage)

[Bigred]

6 hours ago, TMFan said:

Can anyone answer with certainty on whether mailing items via a PPM is counted against your UAB weight allowance? I am PCSing OCONUS to CONUS and will be mailing ~200 pounds of our stuff to myself at the CONUS location. I always thought that the weight is counted as UAB, but the person answering the phone at TMO is telling me it will count as HHG weight and that I'll still get my full UAB weight allowance. The difference is important, as the movers will be weighing each UAB box and I plan to keep handing them things to pack until I get close to the limit. I don't want to get stuck with the international air freight bill for going 200 lbs over my UAB allowance.

Counts as part of HHG. I don’t have the reference but that’s how it played out for me. 

[MooseAg03]

I tried digging through the thread but couldn't find an answer that was clear to me.  Has anyone done a TDY enroute to PCS during which you left your family at your losing CONUS station during the TDY, completed the TDY and signed in to the new unit (maybe being a geo-bachelor for a bit), and then moved the family to the gaining CONUS location?  With the COVID shenanigans going on, I'd like to leave my family at my current location while I go to training (they like it here, better support network for the frau) and I'll come back and get them when it's over (hopefully during the winter break so it's an easier transition for the kiddos).  If anyone has pulled a plan like that off, what are some of the gotchas that I should be looking out for?

I did something similar. With TDY en-route, you will still be receiving BAH based on your losing base location since it is unaccompanied. Check BAH rates for both locations, because when you check into the gaining base the BAH rate will change. If it’s significantly less than the old base, you might have to come out of pocket. However, finance can adjust the BAH based on dependent location. Your living expenses as a geo-bachelor will be all out of pocket. Be sure to keep your new unit informed of your plan, you will have to take leave to get the family moved whenever it is time.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[soupafly06]

I just wrapped up a TDY enroute for a TX-2 course and have proceeded on to my next duty station.  I left my family behind at my previous duty station and am leaving soon to do the HHG shipment and move them on to our new home.  Does anyone know if there is any way for me to pick them up without using a crap ton of personal leave?  The permissive TDY regulations don't seem to cover this scenario.  I did not use house hunting leave but we've signed for a house already so technically that's a no go.  Is there a way to cut a no-cost TDY order for me to return for an "appointment" at my old duty station?  I have the leave days but I'd just prefer to not burn almost two weeks up on nothing but moving.  Any advice is appreciated!

[slackline]

Okay, done some searching, but I haven’t found anything.  I don’t think my search function is working properly because every time I put in geobachelor/geo-bachelor/or any other possible way to spell it, I get zero results back every time.

Here’s my situation: had to do the geobachelor thing for a PCS that was supposed to only work out to about 10 months of training and my son is a senior in HS doing one of those programs where he’ll graduate with a couple of associates degrees, and moving the family would have messed that up.  We’re doing an OCONUS move, and I spoke with TMO before I went to DC when they told me it shouldn’t be a problem to get movers at my location in DC and the family’s location, as long as my family’s address on my orders was listed as the separate location.  

Anyone done anything like this in the past, or know someone that has?  Anyone familiar with the regs on this?  I am coming up on the move time in the next couple of months, and I just want to be prepared with some SA before I walk into TMO and the guy at this office says something different than the guy in the other office.  With covid, and the other craziness going on with the move, I didn’t ask for anything in writing.  I have it in emails, but I want something more firm.  

Thanks in advance!

[Swizzle]

2 pickup locations are determined by previous authorizations/orders and/or used allowance/entitlement.

For example: I did 2 pickups within the same city no problem last PCS. Just listed it in pickup request and reflected it would be below max FGO allowance. Easy. Many people do this from storage and domicile/house within 50 mile radius. 

But if you were to do 2 pickup from different cities/"areas", were your dependents authorized to stay? Were they not authorized to go to new place (similar but different question)? If not, have you used your Home of record (HOR) move? Want to? Did you not use 100% of previous PCS HHG allowance moved?

It sounds like your orders should be (confirm?) unaccompanied PCS orders in which you took/used minimal PCS HHG entitlement to D.C. In which case you will use for TMO a combo of your unaccompanied and previous accompanied PCS orders with your new accompanied OCONUS orders to get it all to the same, new, OCONUS place. If it's not this case, TMO will probably give you trouble. G'luck. 

You might be able to consolidate it at your family's departure point and get days to do that. As in, geo-bach stuff moved to family and then whole of family's stuff to OCONUS. That'll take some working, but should he do-able. 

You want to reference the JTR and AIR FORCE INSTRUCTION 24-602 
VOLUME 4
15 OCTOBER 2020

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://static.e-publishing.af.mil/production/1/af_a4/publication/afi24-602v4/afi24-602v4.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjxsJj_3sTvAhVDG80KHYmTAjAQFjACegQIIRAC&usg=AOvVaw0Yn91Xt0YtVTk2J6P4K_95

[slackline]

25 minutes ago, Swizzle said:

2 pickup locations are determined by previous authorizations/orders and/or used allowance/entitlement.

For example: I did 2 pickups within the same city no problem last PCS. Just listed it in pickup request and reflected it would be below max FGO allowance. Easy. Many people do this from storage and domicile/house within 50 mile radius. 

But if you were to do 2 pickup from different cities/"areas", were your dependents authorized to stay? Were they not authorized to go to new place (similar but different question)? If not, have you used your Home of record (HOR) move? Want to? Did you not use 100% of previous PCS HHG allowance moved?

It sounds like your orders should be (confirm?) unaccompanied PCS orders in which you took/used minimal PCS HHG entitlement to D.C. In which case you will use for TMO a combo of your unaccompanied and previous accompanied PCS orders with your new accompanied OCONUS orders to get it all to the same, new, OCONUS place. If it's not this case, TMO will probably give you trouble. G'luck. 

You might be able to consolidate it at your family's departure point and get days to do that. As in, geo-bach stuff moved to family and then whole of family's stuff to OCONUS. That'll take some working, but should he do-able. 

You want to reference the JTR and AIR FORCE INSTRUCTION 24-602 
VOLUME 4
15 OCTOBER 2020

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://static.e-publishing.af.mil/production/1/af_a4/publication/afi24-602v4/afi24-602v4.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjxsJj_3sTvAhVDG80KHYmTAjAQFjACegQIIRAC&usg=AOvVaw0Yn91Xt0YtVTk2J6P4K_95

Great info, thanks!

 

[jango220]

 

On 3/22/2021 at 11:29 AM, slackline said:

Anyone done anything like this in the past, or know someone that has?  Anyone familiar with the regs on this?  I am coming up on the move time in the next couple of months, and I just want to be prepared with some SA before I walk into TMO and the guy at this office says something different than the guy in the other office.  With covid, and the other craziness going on with the move, I didn’t ask for anything in writing.  I have it in emails, but I want something more firm.  

Thanks in advance!

I am in a similar boat as you (going CONUS instead of OCONUS however). TMO here at Maxwell said the same thing you heard last year: as long as your family is listed on the orders in block 17 at a different address, they will move from two locations. It appears that you have to build it as separate moves on move.mil however - likely 3 for you with the unaccompanied baggage? I will have the third on mine for the partial DITY/PPM. There is some verbiage listed in the AFI that swizzle posted about putting "request agent review" in the remarks for a somewhat related situation, but no idea if that will draw the ire of the logistics and finance demons who will subsequently smite you.

Granted, this is all YMMV and has not encountered first contact with JPPSO/finance/etc but that is how I intend to press.

Edited April 5, 2021 by jango220

[isuguy1234]

Anybody have to pay out of pocket for your HHG in storage?  More specifically, big blue pays for 90 days of Storage in Transit, then if you exceed that, u have to pay out of pocket. Any experience on how much that is out of pocket per month?  Obviously depends on how much schtuff u have, just curious. 

[Bigred]

12 minutes ago, isuguy1234 said:

Anybody have to pay out of pocket for your HHG in storage?  More specifically, big blue pays for 90 days of Storage in Transit, then if you exceed that, u have to pay out of pocket. Any experience on how much that is out of pocket per month?  Obviously depends on how much schtuff u have, just curious. 

It’s gonna depend entirely on how much stuff and where. I rent a 10x10 for roughly $90 a month and I have roughly 5,000 lbs of stuff in there. 

I rent my unit in San Diego and when I was looking I found a range from roughly $90 to roughly $160 for a 10x10, based purely on where the storage unit was located. 

[isuguy1234]

So is that what a moving company would use?  Just a regular storage unit essentially that I could rent on my own?  I’ve read a couple places in TMOs stuff, that if you exceed the 90 days SIT, then moving company storage is extremely expensive. The regular storage place rates u talk about, I don’t see as expensive so I wonder if there is more to it if u exceed the 90 days of SIT?

[HossHarris]

Can you still request an extension beyond 90 days?  Used to be you could and it was generally approved … but I haven’t kept up with JTR changes. 

[Bigred]

18 minutes ago, isuguy1234 said:

So is that what a moving company would use?  Just a regular storage unit essentially that I could rent on my own?  I’ve read a couple places in TMOs stuff, that if you exceed the 90 days SIT, then moving company storage is extremely expensive. The regular storage place rates u talk about, I don’t see as expensive so I wonder if there is more to it if u exceed the 90 days of SIT?

From my understanding that’s correct. The storage, if kept in a commercial facility by the moving company, is much more expensive. 
 

My storage is done as part of a DITY NTS while I’m OCONUS. The commercial rate for my 5k lbs of crap is almost $300 in the San Diego area, and I pay $90 to do it myself. 

[disgruntledemployee]

I'm assuming this is all your stuff.  One thing to consider if storage will be a decent amount of time is having the moving company deliver it to a storage unit and only you have the key.  One base I was at had a deal where I could store X lbs for free at a moving company (lack of storage space in base housing) so I used it.  When it was time to move, I went to get it and saw the stuff was in an open warehouse, stacked up, and sorta roped off.  Thats how stuff goes missing; a worker moves something out of the way, 5 finger discount, etc. 

All this to say is that SIT or moving company storage is not always in standard storage units.  Bekins, etc charge a high amount because the govt lets them. 

One last bit of advise for the next move.  You can DITY your whole move and even use a commercial company.  It takes homework and you take on risk, so have good insurance.  The key is the multiplier TMO uses, which fluctuates on demand.  Compare that to an estimate or 2 and decide.  One move I was looking at was going from base housing to base housing, no wait, 1.8ish multiplier over baseline allowances (summer, busy, higher rates).  Could have made a few thou but too many flaming juggle sticks to handle and just needed a turnkey move.

[jazzdude]

I'm assuming this is all your stuff.  One thing to consider if storage will be a decent amount of time is having the moving company deliver it to a storage unit and only you have the key. 

Only thing to add is to inspect your stuff well when you take delivery if you're going to put it right back in storage.

[isuguy1234]

Thanks all for the responses y’all. We’re lookin to build a house, but this would b final separation move kind of thing. So, depending on build timeline during these crazy times, might need more than the 90 days. Extension is still a thing, but sounds like it’s a lot more difficult to get it than it used to be. 
 

Next question…read a lot that you can’t rent a big UHAUL and car transport trailer and get reimbursed for the car transporter, or the weight correct? (Partial DITY is the plan - we have 2 cars to move)   

So could I drive my car out a few days prior, then fly back and drive the uhaul out with wife following in her car, and “win?” By that I guess i mean, could I drive my car out and get paid for mileage?  Then drive the uhaul out and my wife drive her car out and be reimbursed for the uhaul rental, plus mileage for my wife in her car?

A lot to unpack, I know. 

[jazzdude]

Thanks all for the responses y’all. We’re lookin to build a house, but this would b final separation move kind of thing. So, depending on build timeline during these crazy times, might need more than the 90 days. Extension is still a thing, but sounds like it’s a lot more difficult to get it than it used to be. 
 
Next question…read a lot that you can’t rent a big UHAUL and car transport trailer and get reimbursed for the car transporter, or the weight correct? (Partial DITY is the plan - we have 2 cars to move)   
So could I drive my car out a few days prior, then fly back and drive the uhaul out with wife following in her car, and “win?” By that I guess i mean, could I drive my car out and get paid for mileage?  Then drive the uhaul out and my wife drive her car out and be reimbursed for the uhaul rental, plus mileage for my wife in her car?
A lot to unpack, I know. 

Short answer is yes.

I did something similar my last PCS (full DITY because of COVID) except the move was short enough (2 hour drive) that we took both cars down a few days early, dropped one off, then took one car back to grab the uhaul. We weighed the cars everytime we went down, and got reimbursed for all the weight in the multiple car trips (3 full tickets for car 1, 1 full ticket for car 2, 1 full ticket for uhaul). Only got mileage and tolls paid for the last trip (uhaul and 1 car).

Another option is to have a friend or family member drive the second car and fly them back, or to consider shipping one car (depending on the cost of plane tickets and hotels needed for a separate drive, it might be cheaper if you can do without a second car for a bit).

Or just tow the second car behind the uhaul, you lose the mileage payment and can't claim the weight of the car, but you simplify the transport problem and avoid the cost of a second trip. I think you can claim the expense of the tow dolly as a moving cost (and if not, you can claim it on your taxes as an unreimbursed work moving expense), so really you're just losing the mileage payment for one car.

[QAZqaz]

Sorry if this has been covered but...

I PCS for a short tour overseas unaccompanied soon. My wife will be living in the conus while I'm gone. I'm currently OCONUS but still in America. I would like my stuff to stay in storage for the full 1 year tour, as she will be living with family near my duty station once the short tour is over. Finance is saying I will make BAH so the government will not cover the cost of NTS (non temp storage) and I will have to pay that out of pocket for the year I'm overseas.

When I asked TMO they said the gov will pay for non temp storage.

She is listed as a dependent on my orders and will be allowed to move to a designated location.

What doesn't make sense is if she wanted to move to state X while I was gone and then move to my next duty station after my short tour, the gov would be moving our goods twice. If the goods are kept in non temp storage, they will only have to move them once to my duty station after my short tour.

Does anyone know the answer to this? Can you point me to a AFI or reg that covers this so I can go to finance and explain their regs to them if need be?

Any help appreciated!

 

[StoleIt]

Anyone have any "inconvenience claims" advice? The shipper will not make the required delivery date and it looks like my stuff hasn't even moved after it got packed.

Googling it seems like I will get M&IE at the local rate but no lodging reimbursements.

[AC&W]

3 hours ago, StoleIt said:

Anyone have any "inconvenience claims" advice? The shipper will not make the required delivery date and it looks like my stuff hasn't even moved after it got packed.

Googling it seems like I will get M&IE at the local rate but no lodging reimbursements.

M&IE for you and dependents. You don’t get lodging as BAH/OHA is intended to cover this. 
 

Some purchases can be itemized for reimbursement however I don’t know the specifics. 
 

I recently filed an inconvenience claim, but a coordinator from the moving company assisted me with the claim along the way. 
 

Your local TMO office should be able to tell you who your moving coordinator is. I have a POC if Lift Forwarders is your mover. 

[pawnman]

4 hours ago, StoleIt said:

Anyone have any "inconvenience claims" advice? The shipper will not make the required delivery date and it looks like my stuff hasn't even moved after it got packed.

Googling it seems like I will get M&IE at the local rate but no lodging reimbursements.

I had luck calling the moving company and berating them. Meals, camping chairs, air mattress all reimbursed by the company. No TMO interventions required. 

[08Dawg]

So I just did a PPM and I loaded my own stuff into a Penske truck.  Like a dumby, I did not get weight tickets.  Somehow blew past that part in that "do it yourself" counseling stuff, also thinking what the hell does it matter since they charge you a flat rate for the truck.  Shack on me for not following the checklist... 

Now, the bitchy civilian in my TMO office is being about as helpful as a pile of dog turds.  I cannot be the first person to have forgotten these....what's the workaround?  I have done the constructed cost thing, but she's making it sound like there's zero way to get paid, and since I got the advance, I might be paying some of it back.  How do I get out of this mess?  

[CaptainMorgan]

So I just did a PPM and I loaded my own stuff into a Penske truck.  Like a dumby, I did not get weight tickets.  Somehow blew past that part in that "do it yourself" counseling stuff, also thinking what the hell does it matter since they charge you a flat rate for the truck.  Shack on me for not following the checklist... 
Now, the bitchy civilian in my TMO office is being about as helpful as a pile of dog turds.  I cannot be the first person to have forgotten these....what's the workaround?  I have done the constructed cost thing, but she's making it sound like there's zero way to get paid, and since I got the advance, I might be paying some of it back.  How do I get out of this mess?  

Rent another truck, reload, and get weight tickets. Maybe.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[08Dawg]

1 hour ago, CaptainMorgan said:

Rent another truck, reload, and get weight tickets. Maybe.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That's what SrA Slapnut suggested, but I've been unpacked and in a house for a month.  Took three weeks of leave between outprocess and inprocess.  Not a viable solution.  

[jazzdude]

That's what SrA Slapnut suggested, but I've been unpacked and in a house for a month.  Took three weeks of leave between outprocess and inprocess.  Not a viable solution.  

Don't think there is a workaround if you want to get paid, have to have the weight tickets if you want to get paid for the weight moved, and I don't believe there's any flexibility in the JTR on that.

You should get paid at least for the truck rental, tolls, packing materials, etc if you have the receipts. And if you itemize on your taxes, claim the difference between your moving cost and what the gov paid you for the move.

[Bigred]

3 hours ago, jazzdude said:

You should get paid at least for the truck rental, tolls, packing materials, etc if you have the receipts. And if you itemize on your taxes, claim the difference between your moving cost and what the gov paid you for the move.

That’s not how it works. The expenses reduce the taxable amount, you’re not reimbursed the expense cost outright. Without weight tickets there is no amount to be paid and then deduct expenses from. 
 

I worked admin for several years with weight and I don’t ever recall someone not having weight tickets. From what I can recall of the JTR, the only option I can think of is either reweighing everything or just deducting it from taxes.