Finally done in Afghanistan?

[brabus]

College is horse shit - I will actively discourage my kids from going unless they have a specific career goal that actually requires a degree. Quite the opposite mindset from when I was a kid. 

[Lord Ratner]

4 hours ago, brabus said:

College is horse shit - I will actively discourage my kids from going unless they have a specific career goal that actually requires a degree. Quite the opposite mindset from when I was a kid. 

Same

[FourFans]

15 hours ago, Lord Ratner said:

Same

 

20 hours ago, brabus said:

College is horse shit - I will actively discourage my kids from going unless they have a specific career goal that actually requires a degree. Quite the opposite mindset from when I was a kid. 

I was in that same boat...until several conversations with non-college grads who now operate international airliners.  We discussed simple things such as supply and demand economics, civics, statistics, basic biology, and even the foundations of what calculus is and how it touches, well, everything...(I get it, that sounds higher level, but explain how you "derive" a solution to someone who hasn't touched math beyond algebra...it's painful...turns out derivation and integration thought processes are kinda handy)...and a load of other subjects that were basic pre-recs at my school.   It was honestly saddening.  I honestly had to explain the difference between miles-per-hour and kilometers-per-hour to two dudes...I wish I were joking...

Am I for everyone going to college?  ABSOLUTELY NOT.   Are there a LOT of subjects that should be covered and assumed as a baseline for a college education that allow a higher level of social and economic understanding and interaction?  Definitely.

The current American 'college experience' does not meet that standard.  But it should.  If for no other reason than the fact that IT SHOULD.  University education should STILL be a high standard, and I refuse to let leftist liberal doorknob licking morons debase that standard like they have with every other standard they touch.

Edited December 26, 2022 by FourFans130

[brabus]

If college was what it SHOULD be, I’d encourage my kids to go. But good luck getting college, or even public primary school, to be what it SHOULD be by any means short of “burning the system to the ground and rebuilding from the ashes.”

The dumbest people I’ve ever interacted with are college grads and many of my non-degree friends and acquaintances are very smart and capable people. On the whole in my experience, I interact with more dumbasses with degrees than I do without degrees. That’s a sad reality and not what I want, but it is reality.

[Lord Ratner]

14 hours ago, FourFans130 said:

 

I was in that same boat...until several conversations with non-college grads who now operate international airliners.  We discussed simple things such as supply and demand economics, civics, statistics, basic biology, an even the foundations what calculus math is and how it touches, well, everything...(I get it, that sounds higher level, but explain how you "derive" a solution to someone who hasn't touched math beyond algebra...it's painful...turns out derivation and integration thought processes are kinda handy)...and a load of other subjects that were basic pre-recs at my school.   It was honestly saddening.  I honestly had to explain the difference between miles-per-hour and kilometers-per-hour to two dudes...I wish I were joking...

Am I for everyone going to college?  ABSOLUTELY NOT.   Are there a LOT of subjects that should be covered and assumed as a baseline for a college education that allow a higher level of social and economic understanding and interaction?  Definitely.

The current American 'college experience' does not meet that standard.  But it should.  If for no other reason than the fact that IT SHOULD.  University education should STILL be a high standard, and I refuse to let leftist liberal doorknob licking morons debase that standard like they have with every other standard they touch.

College was taken over and misused by a bunch of unproductive pseudo-intellectuals who figured out the only way their obviously stupid ideas could gain a foothold would be to form indoctrination camps for inexperienced adults. That's probably not surprising to anybody here.

 

But while they were doing so the world changed and the distribution of information was radically redesigned by the internet. While colleges probably could have adapted to this new landscape, they were far more concerned with dogma and societal change. At the same time, the government wildly distorted the economics of education with, go figure, unlimited money.

 

Now the cat is out of the bag as my generation, the millennials, are facing the reality that their degree did not, as they were promised, result in a more lucrative life. It did give many of them an inescapable financial anchor around their neck. The gen Z kids behind them, at least the latter half of the generation, are beginning to reject the system that is quite obviously built on false promises and lies. I suspect at this point it's too late to save the system, and there will be a split. College will return to the playground for the rich and breeding ground for politicians, while everyone else will shift back towards on the job learning, heavily supported by much cheaper and adaptable online courses.

We haven't reached the final act yet because the money printing has only just stopped, but when unemployment starts going up and the long due pandemonium from the last 15 years of intentionally blind spending comes due, the idea that middle and lower class kids with no road map for their entire adulthood will just go to six figure institutions to get drunk, fuck, and occasionally sit in a room with 500 other people learning subjects they don't need to know, well that just isn't going to hold when people can't afford it.

 

Edited December 27, 2022 by Lord Ratner

[FourFans]

Sounds to me like we don't have an educational, social, or economic crisis.  We have a complete failure of the parenting.  I've said if for decades now: If you heal fatherhood (i.e. incentivize men to stay in the home where they procreate instead of incentivizing single parenthood, divorce, and abortion), you heal our country.  The second problem...which is related to fatherhood...is that American parents appear to have adopted the belief that it's someone else's job to teach their children truth, morality, logic, and reason.  No wonder millennials (i am one) are so lost: we were raised by public schools. 

I've got two teens, and my bride and I are working hard to make sure that no university education or any other life experience will upend their faith foundation or their logic and reason.  If they launch with a solid relationship with God and a thirst for truth, it won't matter what lies they encounter, college or not.

ANYWAY, we're finally done in Afghanistan and it feels like we're right back to the mid 70's with the end of a horrid war, wild problems with energy, social upheaval, and a couple of political parties that have lost their minds.

...now, where's our Reagan?

[guineapigfury]

13 hours ago, FourFans130 said:

...

ANYWAY, we're finally done in Afghanistan and it feels like we're right back to the mid 70's with the end of a horrid war, wild problems with energy, social upheaval, and a couple of political parties that have lost their minds.

...now, where's our Reagan?

There's probably a governor named Ronald running in 2024, just saying.

Edited December 27, 2022 by guineapigfury

[FourFans]

On 12/27/2022 at 7:00 AM, guineapigfury said:

There's probably a governor named Ronald running in 2024, just saying.

We can hope.  He's already demonstrated that he can handle a crisis with logic and reason.  If someone would please shut down Trump, that would be great.

Edited December 29, 2022 by FourFans130

[Biff_T]

17 years of my USAF experience was during GWOT.  What's it like now in the squadrons with no more war to fight?  I remember deployments prior to 9-11 and they were mostly for OSW and ONW.  Now that we (I guess you guys, I'm retired) don't fly combat sorties everyday the young guys are probably pretty bored.  Lol.  

[nsplayr]

For MQ-9 there's still plenty of "war" to be had. Nothing like the heyday of strikes and ops every day/night but still enough to stay busy. In all the familiar places, plus some new places keeping an eye on other bad actors. Inshallah we'll still keep flying/fighting/winning (? on the last one) for approx. 10 more years so I can retire the way I'd like to. The young kids do indeed need to stay in the sim and on the range to keep sharp but that's what instructors and training plans are for. YMMV per platform I'm sure.

[brabus]

Still plenty busy with real world stuff, but not necessarily including shooting and dropping. We’re back to holding the line for wars we hopefully will never fight. 

[uhhello]

Lots of "pivoting"

[SocialD]

3 minutes ago, uhhello said:

Lots of "pivoting"

 

Lots of "glad I'm retiring this year."  

[dream big]

2 hours ago, Biff_T said:

17 years of my USAF experience was during GWOT.  What's it like now in the squadrons with no more war to fight?  I remember deployments prior to 9-11 and they were mostly for OSW and ONW.  Now that we (I guess you guys, I'm retired) don't fly combat sorties everyday the young guys are probably pretty bored.  Lol.  

We still deploy to CENTCOM, because that command gets whatever it wants regardless of OPSTEMPO, my old Sq is doing training exercises and Dubai Airshows. Wouldn’t call Dubai highlife “bored,” but makes you think if resources could be used wiser. 

[Biff_T]

I really wanted to go TDY and party when I was younger.  Then 9/11 happened.   

For those who served in GWOT thanks!  Enjoy the break and hopefully you'll make it into the golden parachute club before the next war.

For the young guys foaming at the mouth to fight, enjoy these times.  You'll most likely see a fight before your UPT ADSC (or Enlistment) is up.    

Edited December 27, 2022 by Biff_T
Or you could just go to AFSOC? lol

[Danger41]

Ironic that you mention AFSOC because (IMO) that command is in a drastic flail trying to find its way post-GWOT. The command has been given guidance to focus on GPC (sound familiar?) and the direction to “innovate”. The problem is that the command structure (and the AF writ large) isn’t willing to drastically innovate and take risks at the appropriate level. Perfect example is that the PC-12 is flown single pilot by some kid from Embry-Riddle with a couple hundred hours down to minimums but AFSOC won’t entertain that. Or put the decision authority down to the appropriate level (way below O-6). 

I don’t know if we’ll ever have WW3 with a Great Power, but I guarantee there will be dirty little wars fought by SOF that AFSOC will be a part of. I hope this innovation doesn’t cause the command to lose that skill set. 

[tac airlifter]

5 hours ago, nsplayr said:

For MQ-9 there's still plenty of "war" to be had. Nothing like the heyday of strikes and ops every day/night but still enough to stay busy.

I don’t know if “plenty of war to be had” is a fair characterization, but maybe I’m a war junkie.  It’s like a 99% decrease from 2001-2021 levels.  TEA for kinetic or DA is GCC level with CJCS briefings.  

[08Dawg]

I would subjectively say life in the bomber force is busier than when GWOT was a thing.  Everybody wants a BTF, and the old "I'm going to Guam for six months every eighteen months" is long a thing of the past.  I always said Buff life was great for stability because in the course of a normal ops tour, you could pretty much pin down exactly you were gonna be gone over your three-four year tour.  Now we're on the road a whole lot more than we used to be, much more often and with much less predictability.  Like Brabus said, holding the line against the next war. 

[nsplayr]

14 minutes ago, tac airlifter said:

I don’t know if “plenty of war to be had” is a fair characterization, but maybe I’m a war junkie.  It’s like a 99% decrease from 2001-2021 levels.  TEA for kinetic or DA is GCC level with CJCS briefings.  

So long as the orders flow I don't personally care if we stare at a single solitary rock in the dessert for 21 hours per day, 7 days a week, 365 days a year for the next decade 😅 Ok that's hyperbole but still...MPA is still relatively unchanged for now which is ultimately what matters to my bottom line. Agreed that "actual war" is down dramatically, but I'm ok with that too. Can't say we were winning exactly when we were murking dudes every single night, let's try just monitor & assess for a while, that's fine by me for real.

[Danger41]

2 hours ago, 08Dawg said:

I would subjectively say life in the bomber force is busier than when GWOT was a thing.  Everybody wants a BTF, and the old "I'm going to Guam for six months every eighteen months" is long a thing of the past.  I always said Buff life was great for stability because in the course of a normal ops tour, you could pretty much pin down exactly you were gonna be gone over your three-four year tour.  Now we're on the road a whole lot more than we used to be, much more often and with much less predictability.  Like Brabus said, holding the line against the next war. 

I didn’t appreciate BTF life until I was teaching at the WIC and we had set up a big exercise with the Ellsworth Bones and Sioux Falls Vipers. Went there on a Monday to do some briefings and then before the first mission they got a BTF tasking to go to the Black Sea. To their credit, they filled that tasking and produced 3 jets for each vul (2 flew). I was seriously impressed with that effort from the entirety of the Ellsworth team.

[ClearedHot]

16 hours ago, Danger41 said:

Ironic that you mention AFSOC because (IMO) that command is in a drastic flail trying to find its way post-GWOT.

You win the internet, I have been saying this since day one of the "Knife" deciding to Crazy Ivan the command.  Are we so desperate to play in the big fight that we forget why SOCOM and AFOSC were formed?  Oddly, in fighting the GWOT we gave up on some basic blocking and tackling that was the foundation of the command, did that need suddenly go away as well?  These so called "transformational leaders" just force us to chase our tail in an effort to build "their legacy."  IMHO there is value in being able to seize an airfield in a hostile nation and conduct operations, I can only imagine the flail if we tried to simul three MC's onto a runway and roll out the TF.  Situations and adversaries change so the status quo is not always a good thing, but divesting basic tasks that took YEARS to develop and refine is a poor choice in a chaotic world.

While we are at it, what defines "post-GWOT"...is it because we quit and went home?  Did all the bad guys just stop because we went home?  Obviously Afghanistan is turning back into a soup sandwich, but I hope someone is watching the brewing terror storm in Africa, South America, the islands in PACOM.  It is absolute lunacy to think that just because we left Afghanistan GWOT has gone away. 

The real question is why does AFSOC think they need to transform so quickly, the answer is easy...$.  After years of being the Belle of the ball they were worried they would become the B team and lose all the cash that was poured into and on the command.  Keep in mind that on Sept 10, 2001 the TOTAL SOCOM budget was $2.1B, that swelled to $15.5 at one point and that doesn't count the many billions the services had to carve out of their budgets as "service common" to do things like RECAP the C-130 fleet ($10B), purchase CV-22's ($5B), buy RPAs and Ops centers for AFSOC ($4B).

SOCOM/AFSOC certainly have a place in the peer/near-peer fight but in a desperate effort to play the big contribution we are homogenizing the C-130 fleet into missile trucks?  Seriously?  What happens when the phone rings and the boss asks us to insert some BAMFs deep (STS), to enable the fight?  We are years away from the shinny new MCJ's having the TF and ECM capability we are sending to the desert on the T2s...while mothballing half the CV-22 fleet!  Also, our shinny new gunships are still waiting for an ECM suite that is half as capable as the H model that went to the Boneyard 9 years ago.  Good thing the near-peer fight won't be fought in a SAM ring.

16 hours ago, Danger41 said:

Perfect example is that the PC-12 is flown single pilot by some kid from Embry-Riddle with a couple hundred hours down to minimums but AFSOC won’t entertain that. Or put the decision authority down to the appropriate level (way below O-6).

WTF is your problem dude, thinking we should follow our basic doctrine of centralized control, decentralized execution that has been written in blood many times through the years...F that nonsense!

15 hours ago, nsplayr said:

Can't say we were winning exactly when we were murking dudes every single night, let's try just monitor & assess for a while, that's fine by me for real.

Define winning, which has always been the problem.  Did we stop attacks on the homeland while murking bad guys "over there?"  I think there was a certain value in that proposition but obviously it can't go on forever.  As far as monitor and assess, I presume you are?  The intel feeds and assessments are not pretty, Al-Qaeda, ISIS-K, Taliban and other Jihadist groups are most certainly rebuilding and spreading influence while our exalted leaders have shifted to countering domestic violence here at home.  Sadly, there will be another big event, followed by investigations, finger pointing and over-reaction. 

16 hours ago, Danger41 said:

I don’t know if we’ll ever have WW3 with a Great Power, but I guarantee there will be dirty little wars fought by SOF that AFSOC will be a part of. I hope this innovation doesn’t cause the command to lose that skill set. 

I know I am a dinosaur but one would think there is a better way to plan for both.  Back to the rocking chair and running kids off my lawn.

[FlyingWolf]

1 hour ago, ClearedHot said:

Wisdom

You must have had an incredibly interesting career, with all the insight you bring across topics. Well deserved rocking chair status.

On this one... spot on. It troubles me greatly.

[filthy_liar]

On 12/26/2022 at 5:20 PM, FourFans130 said:

Sounds to me like we don't have an educational, social, or economic crisis.  We have a complete failure of the parenting.  I've said if for decades now: If you heal fatherhood (i.e. incentivize men to stay in the home where they procreate instead of incentivizing single parenthood, divorce, and abortion), you heal our country.  The second problem...which is related to fatherhood...is that American parents appear to have adopted the belief that it's someone else's job to teach their children truth, morality, logic, and reason.  No wonder millennials (i am one) are so lost: we were raised by public schools.

This is the problem in our society, and its really depressing to think about.  Parents have checked out and just run around with a wheel barrow of excuses on why they cannot properly guide and discipline their kids.  And unfortunately their misbehaved kids who lack self discipline and control are on a path leading straight to a Ritalin/Adderall prescription.

I could write ten pages on how parenting has declined but I shan't.  I'll leave it with I agree with FF.

[Majestik Møøse]

1 hour ago, filthy_liar said:

This is the problem in our society, and its really depressing to think about.  Parents have checked out and just run around with a wheel barrow of excuses on why they cannot properly guide and discipline their kids.  And unfortunately their misbehaved kids who lack self discipline and control are on a path leading straight to a Ritalin/Adderall prescription.

I could write ten pages on how parenting has declined but I shan't.  I'll leave it with I agree with FF.

There’s something to this. A unique combination of extreme comfortability and safety brought on by untold global wealth, combined with a brewing discontent due to lack of shared purpose.

[Biff_T]

4 hours ago, ClearedHot said:

While we are at it, what defines "post-GWOT"...is it because we quit and went home?  Did all the bad guys just stop because we went home?  Obviously Afghanistan is turning back into a soup sandwich, but I hope someone is watching the brewing terror storm in Africa, South America, the islands in PACOM.  It is absolute lunacy to think that just because we left Afghanistan GWOT has gone away. 

The GWOT is over.  No more national defense service medals.  Lol.

I'm not saying that all of the bad guys are dead. Maybe I should have  clarified, I'm just more curious what it's like in a non AFSOC unit after OIF/OEF being over?   I can barely remember what it was like before 9/11 (young and drunk lol) but we didn't have dudes walking around with 69 air medals as the norm.   

Edited December 28, 2022 by Biff_T